FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[amh63]

Old Cardinal....nice post!  Plus K.  Should join this board more...though we are not always a "Band of Brothers".  However, as brothers often do, we fight over the most trivial things.  Strange that I say that since my two sons never fought at all...but always got into trouble together.
I must support the Old Cardinal point of alumni network....and parent network to a certain degree. Two examples.  The MBB team has a very strong network of alums, former coaches, etc that do "recruiting" around the country.  When, the team went on a trip during semester break years ago, they got to practice in the NBA Nets team's court in NJ...at the time. A parent connection.  Same thing happened in Atlanta when alums got the team to practice at schools before the National title win.
Alums supported the men's soccer team on their trip abroad several years ago to Paris and Monaco, arranging games, etc.   The head of state of Monaco...Grace Kelly's son...just recently gave a muti-million gift to Amherst in another area.  He played soccer at Amherst and often shows up to relax...a place where he is often overlooked/ not recognized.  A plug here...the men and women soccer teams both won the Nescac title yesterday.. The men's team is seeking a Nat. Title repeat.

[Nescacman]

As the Williams Sideline QB Club prepares for their lunch today, we thought we would share a direct quote from a prominent Williams alum:

"Hard to believe one coach (former HCOF Kelton) could have a significant role in two teams going a combined 0-19 in one year. The whole thing is embarrassing".

Could not have said it better ourselves.

Wesleyan scored in 8 of their first 9 possessions and led 56-14 at the half. The Wes QB was NESCAC POTW and all of his stats were in exactly two quarters. We don't have a dog in this fight but we wish Coach Raymond luck. On some levels this is a harder rebuild than Tufts are even Hamilton or Bowdoin. That's partly because the expectations at Williams are so much higher.

[JEFFFAN]

As the Williams Sideline QB Club prepares for their lunch today, we thought we would share a direct quote from a prominent Williams alum:

"Hard to believe one coach (former HCOF Kelton) could have a significant role in two teams going a combined 0-19 in one year. The whole thing is embarrassing".

Could not have said it better ourselves.

Wesleyan scored in 8 of their first 9 possessions and led 56-14 at the half. The Wes QB was NESCAC POTW and all of his stats were in exactly two quarters. We don't have a dog in this fight but we wish Coach Raymond luck. On some levels this is a harder rebuild than Tufts are even Hamilton or Bowdoin. That's partly because the expectations at Williams are so much higher.

The current coach has a good history but it will take time.  As a Williams grad you might remember the dark period after Ostendarp retired and they hired one of his assistants to take over.   Miserable job.   They brought Sedlicki in and while he turned it around quickly, it was done in part through taking an entire recruiting class from Union and having them attend Amherst.   Bad idea.   Football got better pretty quickly but it wasn't a good plan.   So it will take time for the Ephs but they will get there.

[PolarCat]

Maybe the most fun thing you will see all day.  Perfectly captures why our sons play this game: https://www.facebook.com/tuftsfootball/videos/1346607428705153/

[RetiredMule]

Hello all - been away from the board for personal reasons but I was lucky enough to make the Tufts game this past weekend, always a good time in Medford. I take that it is quite unfortunate the state of the team. You cannot be given the ball twice off fumbles in your opponents territory and only manage 9 yards and 2 FGs on 8 plays. Again props to John Baron for hitting 4 fields goals this week and 6 in the past two. On a happier note from my point of view, Colby's inability to reach 4 wins would seem to support the idea that the Michaeles tenure will come to an end soon following the season. I am looking forward to hearing more in either direction.

[westcoastDad]

Polar Cat it's all the same remember.  You speak for all of the fathers remember?  Cmon now.

Did I read someone mention the "Q" word again as in kids "quitting"? 

I know many on the board like to pile onto Kelton and his "legacy".  He won because of the previous coach.  Now, he's responsible for the current coach's slow start (although I don't remember anyone accusing the Kelton teams of "quitting".....blah blah blah. 

A few years back, Tufts was horrible.  How many times do we hear that coach's name bantered about?  Hamilton?   Well, maybe they just aren't expected to do well. 

I'm new to NESCAC.  Kelton had a short run.  I do recall being told he was the first African-American coach?  So, his scrutiny is going to be magnified to the nth degree.  Being the first is never easy.  We don't know much about what he had to work with, what type of support he had from administration, etc.  We just see the results (good or bad). 

But, its comical to read you guys throwing him under the bus for what is happening now. He's gone.  Administration should be your focus. If he wasn't "the guy" then they should have moved sooner to oust him and begin the new regime.  They didn't.  So, the current coach and his team are probably suffering because of it. I would love for a current Williams (or recent player under Kelton) to give their 2 cents.  Fair balance.

I was in Hartford this past weekend.  Had dinner with my kid (Applebee's on route 9 -Hadley) which we try to do post game before I jump back on a plane.  I'm a USC grad, so I'm listening to the USC - Oregon game via radio as I drive back to the Hotel.

The commentator says:  UCLA's current head coach, Jim Mora, has a worse Pac-12 (in conference) record than Karl Dorrell (who was coach a few years prior).  Yet, when Dorrell was at the helm......the alumni basically wanted him kicked off the campus of UCLA never to return.  And, he was a former player and alum for that school.  Mora is adored and they suck this year.  Double standard?

Another example.  I'm a huge Dallas Cowboys fan.  It goes back to my childhood.  My Dad was Bob Hayes' (former world's fastest human and Dallas Cowboy) dorm R.A. in 1960.  Legend has it...that he tried to hit on my Mom.  I would always say to my Mom, "Mom.....I'm fast but just imagine how much faster I could've been...lol."  She would say.......Well, I won't repeat what she would say.  RIP Bob Hayes.   There is a kid playing QB for Dallas right now, Dak Prescott.  Out of nowhere this kid has stolen the most prestigious position in the game from the owner's pet, Tony Romo.  The kid looked incredible during preseason (but oh....it's just preseason).  Now, the kid is 7-1 (which had Dez Bryant or Beasley not dropped balls against the Giants in game 1 could be 8-0).  He's a league leader amongst QBs (only Matt Ryan of Atlanta is better rated I think).  He's basically mistake free.  His accuracy is uncanny.  He's a bigger stronger guy than Romo. It's a young man's game.   He has galvanized Cowboy nation into thinking..........finally...........we can win a Super Bowl.  Love Romo, but nobody on this planet except he and Jerry thinks he can win the big one.   I could go on. 

So, today his owner, Jerry Jones, says "I would not be as happy to win a Super Bowl without Tony Romo as QB".   Did Tom Brady have to hear that?  Double standard?


Williams (just like any other program) is currently in the toilet.  Kelton went 8-0 his first year.  Clearly, it was mostly the result of the previous coach's players recruited.  No different than Jon Gruden winning with Tony Dungy's squad down there in Tampa Bay.  But, if he (Kelton) was so horrible.........he could've easily screwed it up.

Kelton is gone hombre.  He is no more responsible for this year's team than those players out there on the gridiron and those coaches currently calling the plays.


Sounds like Wesleyan opened a can of "whoop ass" on them and killed the Williams team's spirit.  Who knows.  But, if they quit....as NESCACMAN stated.........that's on them and nobody else.

Peace

ps retiredmule, forgive the grammatical errors (again).   





Wrong kid.  I'm not John Baron's dad, I am just a fan.  Impressed by his play, his work ethic, and more importantly his character.  When your team is having a really rough season, it shows a ton of mental fortitude to be able to focus and perform like he did yesterday.  Particularly when there is another another great K on the opposing sideline (Willie Holmquist).  I'm really happy to see NESCAC recognize Baron with the Special Teams POTW.  Classy young man, and I know he will be a huge success in whatever he does after graduation.
[/quote]

[frank uible]

No one has ever gone broke underestimating the intelligence, reason or equity of sports fans.

[amh63]

Something to add to JEFFFAN's latest post.   That assistant coach was an Amherst alum and the HC of the lacrosse team.  Yes, IMO, he was let go after an 0-8 season primarily because his players had no faith in him.  One of my sons had a roommate that quit the team.  A football player with a noted prep school record.  His father was an Amherst football player and a former classmate of mine...former in that he left school for a period and is officially in the class behind me.  Anyway, had dinner with him and his family often when I visited my son.  Never heard the particulars of why he quit.  A successful MD that raises horses in northern CT now.  Yes, Seldicki was hired from WPI, won games and left for Yale and was retired from Yale and joined Whalen at Wesleyan as an assistant for a period.  Sent a child to get an Williams degree.
Best thing in this story is that HC Mills also arrived from WPI and also the present Amherst AD and former OC.  The story of the hiring of the WPI group of coaches was that Coach DARP had a losing record against WPI over the years...as I was told.

[Vandy74]

Something to add to JEFFFAN's latest post.   That assistant coach was an Amherst alum and the HC of the lacrosse team.  Yes, IMO, he was let go after an 0-8 season primarily because his players had no faith in him.  One of my sons had a roommate that quit the team.  A football player with a noted prep school record.  His father was an Amherst football player and a former classmate of mine...former in that he left school for a period and is officially in the class behind me.  Anyway, had dinner with him and his family often when I visited my son.  Never heard the particulars of why he quit.  A successful MD that raises horses in northern CT now.  Yes, Seldicki was hired from WPI, won games and left for Yale and was retired from Yale and joined Whalen at Wesleyan as an assistant for a period.  Sent a child to get an Williams degree.
Best thing in this story is that HC Mills also arrived from WPI and also the present Amherst AD and former OC.  The story of the hiring of the WPI group of coaches was that Coach DARP had a losing record against WPI over the years...as I was told.

John McKecknie was a rather successful Lacrosse HC at Amherst.  He held the post for a decade, won whatever they called the conference they were in at the time, the '86 or '87 season if memory serves, and was named the HCOY as well.  With all due respect to Jim Ostendarp, like so many great coaches and players, he hung around too long.  McKecknie's (0-8) season in '92 was preceded by (4-4) in both '88 and '89, (1-7) in 90 and a (0-7-1) record in 1991.  He may not have been the right pick to replace a coaching legend but, in fairness, he didn't have the quality of players to work with that Amherst football is accustomed to putting on the field.  DARP teams had gone 44-11-1 from '81-'87. 

This isn't the post I set out to respond to.  My brother was a classmate of John's and a co-captain on their freshman team.  They were good buddies and while I doubt the two of us ever spent much time together completely sober I liked him too.  What I really wanted to find was the answer to AmherstStudent05's query regarding the last time both Amherst and Williams had losing records going into their season ending showdown.  The answer is 1979 when both went into the game at 3-4.  Williams prevailed that day 19-13 to finish with a 4-4 record.  In 1976 a 4-3 Williams eleven was beaten by a 2-5 Amherst team to again go 4-4.  The last time both teams had losing records at the end of the season was in 1970 when both went 3-5.

[AmherstStudent05]

Something to add to JEFFFAN's latest post.   That assistant coach was an Amherst alum and the HC of the lacrosse team.  Yes, IMO, he was let go after an 0-8 season primarily because his players had no faith in him.  One of my sons had a roommate that quit the team.  A football player with a noted prep school record.  His father was an Amherst football player and a former classmate of mine...former in that he left school for a period and is officially in the class behind me.  Anyway, had dinner with him and his family often when I visited my son.  Never heard the particulars of why he quit.  A successful MD that raises horses in northern CT now.  Yes, Seldicki was hired from WPI, won games and left for Yale and was retired from Yale and joined Whalen at Wesleyan as an assistant for a period.  Sent a child to get an Williams degree.
Best thing in this story is that HC Mills also arrived from WPI and also the present Amherst AD and former OC.  The story of the hiring of the WPI group of coaches was that Coach DARP had a losing record against WPI over the years...as I was told.

Much appreciated as always, Vandy!

John McKecknie was a rather successful Lacrosse HC at Amherst.  He held the post for a decade, won whatever they called the conference they were in at the time, the '86 or '87 season if memory serves, and was named the HCOY as well.  With all due respect to Jim Ostendarp, like so many great coaches and players, he hung around too long.  McKecknie's (0-8) season in '92 was preceded by (4-4) in both '88 and '89, (1-7) in 90 and a (0-7-1) record in 1991.  He may not have been the right pick to replace a coaching legend but, in fairness, he didn't have the quality of players to work with that Amherst football is accustomed to putting on the field.  DARP teams had gone 44-11-1 from '81-'87. 

This isn't the post I set out to respond to.  My brother was a classmate of John's and a co-captain on their freshman team.  They were good buddies and while I doubt the two of us ever spent much time together completely sober I liked him too.  What I really wanted to find was the answer to AmherstStudent05's query regarding the last time both Amherst and Williams had losing records going into their season ending showdown.  The answer is 1979 when both went into the game at 3-4.  Williams prevailed that day 19-13 to finish with a 4-4 record.  In 1976 a 4-3 Williams eleven was beaten by a 2-5 Amherst team to again go 4-4.  The last time both teams had losing records at the end of the season was in 1970 when both went 3-5.

[amh63]

Vandy74....a most informative post.   Thanks and plus K.  My younger son's roommate roomed with his older brother in his senior year...and both graduated the same year.  He attended my son's wedding in Md.  My family are all attending the Homecoming game and there maybe a chance that my younger son will meet his old roommate.
Your 1970 note of the Williams vs Amherst game reveals to me why polbear73 went to Bowdoin .
Will again relate how tightly the IVY and Nescac are intertwined.  My son-in-law grew up in Ithaca and played a little football there.  When I visit my daughter and granddaughter we often attend a Cornell football game and even the Friday night celebration with bands and fireworks, etc.  During two separate Yale vs Cornell game...sitting on the Yale side which has better seats...less of a crowd, I have met Williams, Amherst and Middlebury alums!  Usually there is wet weather and my Amherst Umbrella does attract attention.  Met two couples from Frank U's Class, one a formal football player once.  At another game met an older Amherst couple.  Talked to them.  Their son, a Midd grad was a coach on the Yale team.  Their daughter- in-law is also a Midd grad and we all chatted awhile.  This was within the last five years.  When Amherst is playing Hamilton in Clinton...the family heads East.

[polbear73]

You are correct, amh63; 1970 was the year we beat both Williams and Amherst.  Our only loss was a 14-13 loss at Wesleyan when we fumbled on the goal line in the last minutes.  Funny, until now, my memories of that great year did NOT include losing records by Williams and Amherst!  Funny how the memory can be convenient!!!!!

[JEFFFAN]

You are correct, amh63; 1970 was the year we beat both Williams and Amherst.  Our only loss was a 14-13 loss at Wesleyan when we fumbled on the goal line in the last minutes.  Funny, until now, my memories of that great year did NOT include losing records by Williams and Amherst!  Funny how the memory can be convenient!!!!!

polbear73 - curious whether there was another year in the history of Bowdoin football when the Bears beat both Amherst and Williams?

[polbear73]

There are a couple in the 50's and 60's but with both series so one sided, wins in the same season were rare. Bowdoin has never had an undefeated season.

[DC 53]

Here's living proof that the NESCAC experience is about much more than the wins and losses. He faces an uphill battle, but he's been there, done that!

http://suffolkcountydems.com/candidate/brendan-cunningham