FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[amh63]

Pat....more of a hunch that MIT is a "better fit" in the Nescac than in the Newmac where your college resides.  Presently, there are 3-4 NEWMAC schools that play many sports regularly against Nescac teams.  MIT has a huge endowment that have Head coaches in many sports  with more assistant coaches...double the number...than Nescac schools.  I know the Cambridge area well where MIT sits.  My older brother went to Harvard and married a local "girl" that attended BU.  Spent Thanksgiving around Harvard square or at the Cape.  I attended grad school at MIT..full time for two years and picked up a couple of degrees.  My oldest son was born in Cambridge.  My wife and I lived in MIT housing in Cambridge.....on Pearl Street that runs from Central square down to the Park/school by the BU bridge.  Walked to MIT along the Charles river.  Traveled up to the Cambridge area for work often...even "hired" some profs during the summer...friends..for some work projects.

[Pat Coleman]

MIT has been to the football playoffs twice in the past decade. I understand that schools at this level don't make all of their conference affiliation decisions based on football, but it would probably not be preferable to take a playoff-capable program and then deny them the ability to accept a playoff bid.

[lumbercat]

Why would MIT apply to join the NESCAC?

While I don't think it will happen it's not unrealistic to assume that MIT might share some of the same values which define the NESCAC.
 
I grew up 20 miles from MIT and their Athletic profile has changed quite a bit, although gradually, in the last 25 years. A Bates guy took over their Football program and took it from a kind of a tolerated club deal to a bonafide, successful D3 program.

There has been a big turnaround in sports at MIT over the years. They always resisted any significant commitment to sports back in the day but they have a nice Athletic program including Football now. Times change.

I applaud them for it.

At the end of the day I  see MIT to be a better fit for the UAA but that might be too much of a leap even for today's MIT athletics.

And, yes, I think MIT actually sported the used BU Football gear when the infamous John Silber axed a fine BU football program.

Always amazed how the esteemed pompous academic institutions in the northeast with the largest endowments spend money on Athletics like they have one foot in the poorhouse. Topic for another day I guess.

[Jonny Utah]

I believe MIT is more interested in saving money on bus/hotel trips to Waterville, Clinton or Williamstown than they are anything else (also saves students hours off "the road" for more study time I guess).  Granted the NEWMAC is a little different for football but for all other sports every team in the league has hourlong bus rides for the most part.  Look at most of their non league games in other sports too, sure a few Nescac and overnight trips are sprinkled in, but mostly MIT is playing local teams like Curry, Lassell, Emmanuel, Wellesley and the MASCAC schools.  Tufts, Amherst and Bowdoin seem to be the three consistent NESCAC schools they play (3 closest if I have my distances correct).    EDIT looked it up an Trinity/Wesleyan are closer.

[Scoops]

Talked to one of the NESCAC coaches with knowledge of the MIT staff/department about joining the NESCAC. Even if the option was open to them, they would have no interest. Since now Rochester HC Martinovich (never a Bates guy, sorry lumbercat) took over, they steadily took over that league. Since moving to the NEWMAC, HC Bubna has them vying with regional powerhouse Springfield for the league title and a playoff berth every year. They would be a great addition to the NESCAC, but the coaches at MIT apparently feel their competitive situation is better in the NEWMAC. If NESCAC schools start to drop football (looking at you Amherst), I think it would be more likely that NESCAC schools would look to join the NEWMAC, than the other way around.

Why would MIT apply to join the NESCAC?

While I don't think it will happen it's not unrealistic to assume that MIT might share some of the same values which define the NESCAC.
 
I grew up 20 miles from MIT and their Athletic profile has changed quite a bit, although gradually, in the last 25 years. A Bates guy took over their Football program and took it from a kind of a tolerated club deal to a bonafide, successful D3 program.

There has been a big turnaround in sports at MIT over the years. They always resisted any significant commitment to sports back in the day but they have a nice Athletic program including Football now. Times change.

I applaud them for it.

At the end of the day I  see MIT to be a better fit for the UAA but that might be too much of a leap even for today's MIT athletics.

And, yes, I think MIT actually sported the used BU Football gear when the infamous John Silber axed a fine BU football program.

Always amazed how the esteemed pompous academic institutions in the northeast with the largest endowments spend money on Athletics like they have one foot in the poorhouse. Topic for another day I guess.

[lumbercat]

Sorry Scoop- you missed it here.

Check again. I didn't say Martinovich was a Bates guy. I said a Bates guy took over the MIT Football program while it was a club team and established the future direction of MIT football.

The Bates guy in question was the head coach at MIT for 30 years. He took the program from club status and built the program into a very successful D3 team.

The coach in question is Dwight Smith, Bates '75, an all New England center for the Bobcats.
Coach Smith retired from MIT in 2008. He built the program, set the table and handed it to Martinovich.
Martinovich spent the next 9 years at MIT with that great inheritance package.

Chad left MIT, now struggling badly in the UAA with the Yellow jackets.

[Scoops]

Sorry lumbercat! After a quick check, you are absolutely right about Coach Smith and his Bates ties. Although I would question that "setting the table" remark. By my check I see Coach Smith had 4 winning seasons in roughly 20 years. Apparently Coach Martinovich  had winning seasons in 3 of 8, and Coach Bubna has yet to have a losing season. I would hope that Bates guys would have a higher standard for "setting the table", but then again  just winning the CBB is considered a great season in Lewiston

Sorry Scoop- you missed it here.

Check again. I didn't say Martinovich was a Bates guy. I said a Bates guy took over the MIT Football program while it was a club team and established the future direction of MIT football.

The Bates guy in question was the head coach at MIT for 30 years. He took the program from club status and built the program into a very successful D3 team.

The coach in question is Dwight Smith, Bates '75, an all New England center for the Bobcats.
Coach Smith retired from MIT in 2008. He built the program, set the table and handed it to Martinovich.
Martinovich spent the next 9 years at MIT with that great inheritance package.

Chad left MIT, now struggling badly in the UAA with the Yellow jackets.

[lumbercat]

[/quote]

Sorry lumbercat! After a quick check, you are absolutely right about Coach Smith and his Bates ties. Although I would question that "setting the table" remark. By my check I see Coach Smith had 4 winning seasons in roughly 20 years. Apparently Coach Martinovich  had winning seasons in 3 of 8, and Coach Bubna has yet to have a losing season. I would hope that Bates guys would have a higher standard for "setting the table", but then again  just winning the CBB is considered a great season in Lewiston

Glad to see that you took the time to make a "quick check" Scoop.
Dwight Smith did a great job building a Football program in a very unlikely athletic environment at MIT. If you need to take a shot at Bates in acknowledging that let it fly.

[Scoops]

Just some friendly smack talk. Figured the board could use some.

Sorry lumbercat! After a quick check, you are absolutely right about Coach Smith and his Bates ties. Although I would question that "setting the table" remark. By my check I see Coach Smith had 4 winning seasons in roughly 20 years. Apparently Coach Martinovich  had winning seasons in 3 of 8, and Coach Bubna has yet to have a losing season. I would hope that Bates guys would have a higher standard for "setting the table", but then again  just winning the CBB is considered a great season in Lewiston

Glad to see that you took the time to make a "quick check" Scoop.
Dwight Smith did a great job building a Football program in a very unlikely athletic environment at MIT. If you need to take a shot at Bates in acknowledging that let it fly.
[/quote]

[lumbercat]

Just some friendly smack talk. Figured the board could use some.

Fair enough Scoop.

[Nescacman]

Never a great time to lose an OC or DC, but Colby's new OC should spark a talented group.

How do you feel about losing both your OC and DC???

[Nescacman]

We lost one of our brethren recently as Polbear73 passed away.   A Bowdoin graduate from the early 70s, he was a football player on one of the finer teams in Bowdoin history – the 1970 team that went 6-1.   He loved Bowdoin and in the face of difficult evidence to the contrary, hope always sprang eternal with him about the program.   Each late summer brought optimism to his voice about the upcoming season.  He was an avid Bowdoin fan of all sports, and he enjoyed speaking with (fake) disdain about his dislike of Amherst and Williams.  The Fall 2021 Bowdoin defeat of Amherst brought him great joy!  He also understood the values of the NESCAC schools and the role that athletics play in these fine schools.  RIP my friend.

(Posting on the football and hoops boards.)

Just catching up...sorry to hear this news. We will miss him...tough to find many loyal fans of Polar football...

[Nescacman]

Losing low-level coaches from typically high turnover jobs is not anything consequential.  Those guys all have one goal: to get promoted.  Amherst's head coach and three unit coordinators have all been there for well over a decade.  Those are the coaches who matter for a program.  I don't love the talent returning for Amherst - the QBs will be veterans but are still mediocre, they lack any sort of playmakers at the skill spots, and they lose three all-league defenders from a unit that will be good but has huge holes to fill.  They could have one of the three worst offenses in Nescac next year (after Bates and Hamilton) unless they recruited a few superstar skill guys. 

But EJ and his staff remain rock solid and will as always maximize the talent on hand.  That talent was pumped up during Williams' dark days, but now that Williams is back and Wesleyan and Tufts have pumped up their programs, Amherst can't dominate its recruiting pool the way it did for the classes coming in from 2011 through 2016.  Amherst is probably about where it was in the decade before Kelton (when 5-3 was a typical season), but there are also fewer bottom feeders in Nescac, so what once was a 6-2 or 5-3 season is now more like a 5-4 or 4-5 one.

I agree but to loose your recruiting coordinator from last two years at Amherst and especially now when recruitment heats up is going to be tough. Lets not forget that this 2022 recruitment won't be felt for two years. Amherst had bad recruiting class for 2022. So this could perhaps be a decline in football for Amherst for the next three seasons. an Early prediction for this yearend this will change slightly.

1. Trinity       - Surprised if they do not go undefeated Incredible 2022 recruiting class and VETS
                      returning.HC has way of getting new recruits integrated quickly.
2. Williams    - Only because returning a good chunk of OL not a good recruiting year in 2022 too
                      many losses at key positions. Losing Coach Blu will be impacted.
3. Wesleyan  -  Always play tough can never blow out opponents but talent will get them this
                       spot.Down year 2022 recruiting and loss of Coyne will be major.
4. Tufts          - Talent at QB and few playmakers not enough to make hurdle poor 2022 recruit
                       class.Coaching always question mark there.
5. Middlebury - Decent team will try to grind out wins decent 2022 recruit class
6. Hamilton.   - QB has potential lack of talent and recruiting puts them this position. HC on
                       bubble. Teams in NY should not be this bad.
7. Bates         - Coach Coyne will get these kids playing hard and start something. Outlook looks
                       good in ME
8. Colby         - Will always be bottom feeder until new blood at Coaching and recruiting steps up
                       Colby facing same dilemma as Bowdoin. Academic standards , Location cant
                       attract top athletes.
9. Bowdoin     - Despite Coaches good intentions and ability admissions & recruitment will
                       prevent him from getting solid players. He will always get low tier players. The
                       better players will go Ivy or to a higher tiered program in NESCAC. Mirror of   
                      Colby's problems regarding campus and location.

We can't take any predictions about the 2022 season seriously when you don't discuss the Ephs losing the best QB in the league, Wes returning 18 of 22 starters (including the reigning DPOTY Nick Helbig), and completely excluding the Lord Mammoths. Come on Charlie, get with the program.

[Nescacman]

Some good offseason banter. I'll toss in a few thoughts.

If anyone is concerned about Amherst College having a recruiting problem because Mills lost some assistants I would tell them not to worry.
Amherst and Williams are the Harvard and Yale of the little Ivies and recruits will choose those 2  schools more than schools choosing them.
It's been several years so I forget if it was Coach Ostendarp at Amherst or Farley at Williams..... when asked about the secret of effective recruiting Coach responded as follows......"I just have to make sure I'm in my office when they call"

I know its a different climate now but the prestige of an Amherst or Williams diploma is probably more prestigious today.

Up in Lewiston ex Card Matt Coyne winning a lot of friends. He's a worker and a grinder with a very clear plan for the Garnet. Stay tuned.

One earlier post said Bates was going to be depleted by a loss of seniors. Not so, they have 13 or 14 returning fifth year seniors coming back thanks to Coyne's influence since arriving on the scene. But yes, it will take time for Coyne get his recruiting arsenal on line.

Bates would have been 0-9 this year without Brendan Costa. He is a huge loss. Too bad Coyne won't have him this year.

The last memory Bates fans have of Matt Coyne before he came to town as HC this year was in 2011 or 2012. The Birds were losing to Bates by 3 with less than a minute to go in a great game. It was 4th and 2 for the Birds on the Bates 25. Bates stacked the box expecting a run off tackle..........No...... the Whale and Seidlecki call a naked bootleg for our guy Coyne and he waltzes around the left end for the TD. Birds win. A real heartbreaker for the Garnet faithful that day.

Never thought the Whale would skip tailgate food but he couldn't get out of Lewiston quick enough with that Win.

We've got a winner in Lewiston and everyone associated with Bates Football is thrilled to welcome Coach Coyne.

Wesleyan is another Institution that is loosing great coaching. Coach Coyne has left , Coach Moore has left and now there Recruiting coordinator and QB Coach has left. So no idea what is happening at Wesleyan. Coach Archer will be another loss for Wesleyan. In process finding out where he is going.Rumor is that he may be heading to Bates but not confirmed. He was instrumental in getting some of the top recruits and now just at the tip of recruiting loosing him will be big.

I am trying to get information as to why Trinity holds onto its coaches. They seem year after year to keep there Coaches. True they loose a positional Coach here or there but nothing consequential. Do the Coaches teach at the school or does Trinity offer higher pay. Hard to figure out how they maintain there staff year after year. Always thought that there ultimate plan is to be HC like Coach Blu did from Williams and move on.

Charlie, you need to do a much better job on your research. All we'll say is that the coaches that left Wes are good men. Some of them will no longer be coaching. Some left for promotions. However, we feel really good about the new coaches. Coach Sheeks did a great job leading an undermanned Colby D the last couple of years doing a more than respectable job and Coach Benoit, the new QB Coach and Passing Game Coordinator, did a great job as the O coordinator at Western New England. Coach Benoit spent the last three seasons as the offensive coordinator at Western New England. At Western New England, Coach Benoit engineered an offensive scheme that was one of the top units at the NCAA Division III ranks. WNE averaged 31.1 points per game to lead the Commonwealth Coast Conference (CCC) while putting up 354.2 yards of total offense per game in 2021. During the 2019 season, WNE was a juggernaut on offense, ranking 15th in the nation in yards per game (465.5) and 22nd in scoring offense (39.5), helping lead the Golden Bears to an undefeated 7-0 conference campaign, CCC Championship and berth into the NCAA Tournament. So Charlie, what say you? We think the Cards will be just fine with one of the best, if not the best, receiving corps in the league (Simco, Tomlinson, Elkery, Sanchez, et al) along with OPOTY candidate David Estevez. One final thought, its not about one coach or one player, Charlie, it's a team sport for both the players and the coaches. As someone correctly said, this is what happens in college football. All these guys are always looking for the next great job, including NESCAC coaches (except for maybe the HCOFs who we think have a pretty good gig).

[Nescacman]

Colby DC Chiccoine to Wesleyan as DC replacement for Matt Coyne.

Could be more rumblings out of Wesleyan rumor has it that Coach Stanley has departed Wesleyan not confirmed as of yet. Could he reunite with Coach Coyne and get DC job ?

Wrong...