FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[frank uible]

Each of the NESCAC colleges should stay out of the others' admissions offices - it is none of their damn business!

[speedy]

Each of the NESCAC colleges should stay out of the others' admissions offices - it is none of their damn business!

They don't agree with you and they can establish whatever rules they want, including rules that involve intrusion into the admissions process!! And they will expand that intrusion if they deem it necessary  to restore balance and competition.

[Trin9-0]

I wouldn't mind a little more ballance in the league. As a Trinity alum and football fan, I was bored out of my mind last week (and Williams was expected to be one of the closer games Trinity played in this year). But I don't believe that increasing restrictions on transfer students will make that big of a difference in wins and losses. If anything Trinity will only win every game by two touchdowns as opposed to the 38-4 average margin of victory from 2003-present.

Believe you me, if the transfers are perceived as a problem (and the fact that Trinity's QB and its top running back are D1 transfers makes that almost a certainty), NESCAC will regulate and stop the practice in order to restore balance to the league. Transfers are an easy target as it rarely happens at most of the other NESCAC schools.

Trinity starting quarterback and tailback may be transfers but they didn't exactly come from poor schools (UVA, Colgate respectively) and I have heard they are both very good students. Who is to say they couldn't have trasnfered to Trinity without help from the football program? Be carefull, when using specific examples about student athletes without knowing the entire story.

Trinity won 22 games prior to Schweitzer and Leo (the players you menioned) starting on offense. Furthermore, Trinity's defense is the reason they haven't lost a game in over 3 years. And only one transfer played a significant defensive role over that span and he transfered from Cornell (another school that's not too shabby).

[formerbant10]

Trin....you beat me to it. 
Speedy....believe it or not, not all transfers are guaranteed to get into Trinity.  And not all of Trinity's transfers are athletes.  I don't believe you are stating the opposite, but it seems that the majority of this board believes Trinity can admit whoever they want as long as he transfers in.  As stated before the transfers that are playing right now are from very good schools.  The hoops team had transfers from Tufts (very good), BC (very good), then Quinnipiac and now BU where those students achieved grades high enough to transfer in.  It's not like Trinity is letting in animals as long as they perform on the field.  Let's get that notion out of our heads.  Trinity has a lot more to offer than just sports and a TOP 25 education.  A lot of the transfers like Trinity for its social scene and its family style environment.  If I'm not mistaken the hoops team got a transfer from Williams in the mid 90's.  He scored over 1400 points in 3 years at Trinity, good for 3rd on the All Time list right now.  Would you have a problem with him transfering in now as well?

[speedy]

Trinity starting quarterback and tailback may be transfers but they didn't exactly come from poor schools (UVA, Colgate respectively) and I have heard they are both very good students. Who is to say they couldn't have trasnfered to Trinity without help from the football program? Be carefull, when using specific examples about student athletes without knowing the entire story.

Trinity won 22 games prior to Schweitzer and Leo (the players you menioned) starting on offense. Furthermore, Trinity's defense is the reason they haven't lost a game in over 3 years. And only one transfer played a significant defensive role over that span and he transfered from Cornell (another school that's not too shabby).

My point is that the restrictions on tipping can be circumvented via the transfer route. And of course a fair number of NESCAC schools are reluctant to admit transfers of any sort. It is an easy place to start and would be easy to regulate (require that they sit out a year and lose a year of eligibility or maybe deny eligibility completely).

It will of course require more than restricting transfers to restore parity to the NESCAC but I suspect that the NESCAC administrators can think up some new restrictions to accomplish that goal and that some are probably already hard a work dreaming up new restrictions.

[speedy]

Trin....you beat me to it. 
Speedy....believe it or not, not all transfers are guaranteed to get into Trinity.  And not all of Trinity's transfers are athletes.  I don't believe you are stating the opposite, but it seems that the majority of this board believes Trinity can admit whoever they want as long as he transfers in.  As stated before the transfers that are playing right now are from very good schools.  The hoops team had transfers from Tufts (very good), BC (very good), then Quinnipiac and now BU where those students achieved grades high enough to transfer in.  It's not like Trinity is letting in animals as long as they perform on the field.  Let's get that notion out of our heads.  Trinity has a lot more to offer than just sports and a TOP 25 education.  A lot of the transfers like Trinity for its social scene and its family style environment.  If I'm not mistaken the hoops team got a transfer from Williams in the mid 90's.  He scored over 1400 points in 3 years at Trinity, good for 3rd on the All Time list right now.  Would you have a problem with him transfering in now as well?

You're missing my point completely. Trinity stands out as being receptive to transfers. Other NESCAC schools are much less interested in transfers (athletes or otherwise). It's an obvious vulnerability for Trinity and an easy place for the NESCAC to throw down a new set of restrictions. 

[speedy]

. .  I don't believe you are stating the opposite, but it seems that the majority of this board believes Trinity can admit whoever they want as long as he transfers in.   . . .

The issue is not what a majority of this board think Trinity should be allowed to do but what the NESCAC presidents think!! The Trinity transfers stand out like a sore thumb -- it's just an obvious place to start of you are a NESCAC administrator and you are concerned about balance and parity.

[dirtybirds8-0]

speedy: You are missing the point...if you want to make this an issue of transfer students you are getting a little rediculous.  Like Trin8-0 said, we have only a couple of transfers....and in the past three years Trinity has dominated the league with only one transfer!!! How is this an issue?  I highly doubt that one individual on one side of the ball accounted for a 7-1 and an 8-0 team.

[dirtybirds8-0]

Oh by the way...for all those posters who are knocking Trinity football academic standards....please check this web site out,  http://www.footballfoundation.com/news.  This award is a national award, and the recipient is picked from all divisions.....The interesting thing about this award, is that there are only 2 NESCAC semi-finalsists....a player from Tufts....Oh and guess what.... A player from Trinity.....we had better watch our admissions standards....now we are letting in players who are to smart.

[dirtybirds8-0]

when you click on the website, go to "MEDIA AND NEWS" and click on the Draddy award posting.

[bant551]

It would be ridiculous to limit transfers from other great schools into the NESCAC.  As mentioned above, the schools the key Trin transfers came from might all actually be better than Trinity academically.  And Trinity is very good, even if its not ranked as high as the other NESCACS.

[Jonny Utah]

I dont think speedy is saying that trinity wouldnt be the best team in the league if they didnt have those transfers, what he is saying is that the transfer issue is an easy place for nescac administrators to set up some sort of rule regulating it.

and I dont think the quality of the school they transfer from is the issue either.  It has to do with the fact that nescac schools dont accept many transfers period.

[speedy]

I dont think speedy is saying that trinity wouldnt be the best team in the league if they didnt have those transfers, what he is saying is that the transfer issue is an easy place for nescac administrators to set up some sort of rule regulating it.

and I dont think the quality of the school they transfer from is the issue either.  It has to do with the fact that nescac schools dont accept many transfers period.

Thank God someone understands what I was trying to say!! Most NESCAC schools are reluctant to admit transfers of any sort (athletes and nonatheletes alike). For whatever reason, they just don't do it. The odds of getting into Bowdoin, for example, are much longer for transfer applicants than for first-year applicants. So it would practically be a no-brainer for the rest of the NESCAC to say "let's begin to level the playing field by taking the transfer option away."

[frank uible]

Break up NESCAC! It is authoritarian, domineering and controlling. When in doubt, it chooses control and order over freedom - just what liberal education is not about.

[bobbyj]

    I want some of what franks' smoking!

    I think the majority of non- Trinity nescac fans only feel Trinity is hurting itself by putting such a emphasis on its football team while its academic rep languishes.  What's so hard to understand is why Trinity would do this when the stakes are so low. Is it really worth further compromising your already rock-bottom nescac academic rating for the sake of building a football titan, one that's restricted to the small pond of nescac?  What's really being gained here? If Trinity were allowed access to the ncaa tourney, it would make only make only a scintilla of sense, at best.  But trinity is denied the national stage, so where's the sense in all this. Why drag your academic rep even lower for the sake beating up nescac teams. What are the trustees and president thinking? Has alumni giving risen in response to Trinity's football success-- while it's academic ratings and reputation wallow in the nescac cellar? I would think most nescac alumni take the long view that academcs trump athletics, especially in a situation where an athletic program is directly compromising the school's already poor academic standing. And that makes me wonder if Trinity's best interests are being served here; it also makes me question whether, given the context, such a misguided pursuit is really consistent the nescac academic philosophy.  Trinity needs to decide where its priorities lie.