FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[beast58]

I'm new to the site today and would love to pick your brains for your gut feelings and any info on the coaches, programs, academics and overall thoughts of the  NESCAC teams, particularly Wesleyan, Trinity and Bates.

My son is a Junior Linebacker at a New England Prep School with a great program. He is 6'1" 225 quiet hard working shy kid who has started every game both sides for two years. He wrecks people and is fast enough to cover and blitz. His highlight tape link went out to numerous schools ( w/transcripts, and a glowing profile from his coaches, SAT results pending but they will be good enough) in Feb ranging from D1aa- D3.

Since then he has rec'd allot of interest from a few Patriot League Schools (Bucknell, Colgate, Lafayette, Holy Cross, Lehigh ...have all come to campus to meet him and speak w him and his coach) and  a ton of interest from the NESCAC Schools  ( particulary Wesleyan, Trinity, Bates,  ... met w all 3 staffs already) and a host of other schools in the Northeast 10, Centennial, Liberty League and some passing interest from 2-3 Ivy Schools. We have visited most of them.

His coaches (as well as the D1aa guys) think he's a Patriot League linebacker but my son ( and with our blessing ) wants to go to the best academic school possible where he can play good football. At this point my son is telling us Wesleyan, Trinity and Bates are 1st, 2nd & 3rd with Bucknell & Colgate being in the mix. At recent prospect days and visits the coaches at both Wes and Trinity have told us that he is an ED1 candidate for them after he comes to camp. We visit Bates this weekend and I think that will happen there also.

So what do you guys think of Wesleyan vs. Trinity vs. the others ....of Whelan Devaney and Harriman....of the overall academic cache, of the student body....anything will be helpful for me as he is my oldest and they all seem great but I'm trying to get as much info as I can

Thanks so much for your patience and time

Just a dad...

[nescac1]

Congrats to your son on three great choices.  Trinity as I'm sure you already know has by far the strongest football tradition and program.  Wesleyan, however, I expect to catch up quickly and soon join Trinity, Williams and Amherst among the NESCAC football elite.  Wesleyan hired Williams' top two coaches away (which worked out great for Williams, of course, thanks to his replacement ), and also hired the former Amherst / Yale head coach as a coordinator, giving them a tremendous staff.  They would not have made those hires, I'm quite sure, without assuring the coaches that football would receive a lot of institutional and admissions support.  That being said, if you want to be in a program with a winning tradition right away, Trinity is a no brainer among those three.  Bates' football team struggles perennially to compete in NESCAC -- I imagine your son would be a top star right away there, from the sound of it.  He might have to wait a year or two to contribute at Trinity, so that might be a factor as well.  IN terms of campus culture, football receives by FAR the most support from alumni and students at Trinity.  Wesleyan's team should improve quickly, but it may take awhile for alumni / campus interest to catch up.

Academically, all are very strong.  Wesleyan has the most academic prestige of the three, but not by an enormous margin.  I'd rank Bates second and Trinity third (those two are nearly equivalent however) academically, but all will provide a great education. 

I am a Williams fan so obviously I am biased but I'd also urge you to consider the Ephs -- just a tremendous football tradition in terms of the Amherst rivalry, The Walk, and along with Trinity the most historically successful program in NESCAC.  And the new coach, Coach Kelton, proved to be an inspirational leader who can really connect with student-athletes.  I'd say when it comes to NESCAC football (strength of program, alumni and fan support, tradition, etc.), Williams and Trinity are at the top, with Amherst and Middlebury the next tier, which I expect Wesleyan will eventually join (probably sooner rather than later). 

[beast58]

Thanks so much. His asst coach is a 2008 Williams grad who played for Whelan so he is in his ear.

The Trin guys were great as were Jeff MacD and Coach Whelan at Wes. Its obvious they have committments to get better. It seems like Trin has a structure in place for academics as well ( freshman player study hall 3x week...emails to coach if a player gets a "C"). That is comforting to a parent....I hope and will talk to Wes about that...

You are right on with Bates ..they said he's an impact player right away and they run a 3-5-3 def w 5 LB's which is allot of spots. At Wes they want him to play the "Mike" in their 4-3 but he could end up at DE w his hand down....thats all stuff that my son just needs to wrap his hands around.

Thanks so much... what a help this is...

[frank uible]

Based solely on what you have said here, Wesleyan is the pick.

[beast58]

Frank,

Thanks for taking the time. What makes you say Wes (thats my sons choice too). Is there anything I left out that you would like to know.....Thanks again

[frank uible]

Best academics, best HFC.

[amh63]

Interesting conversation going on.
I agree with much of the "advice"/info provided by nescac1 and Frank U.  They are both avid football fans of the conference in general and Williams in particular.  They are both quite knowledgeable about football too.  This is hard for me to say since I support Amherst and there is a deep longstanding mutual dislike between the schools in sports.
One point must be made however.....if your son wants the best academic-sports college possible.....then he should think  about Williams, Amherst and Middlebury ,,,,in that order....followed by Wes.
Good luck.  Often the choice one makes is the overall feel of the school to the person....the student body, the location, etc.  Sport participation is fine, but really only part of a person's college experience/education.  Too much advice I know.

[beast58]

You all are the best..

and not to much info AMH63 thanks!

What a great League....Williams has so many supporters its great to see. Williams, Amherst and Midd have not been in our thought process ( we've been to all) for a few different reasons. My son wasn't crazy about the Williams campus but he hasn't met that HC so maybe its worth a revisit....and we never even sent his tape and such.

Midd was nice campus but he was really turned off by student body (snotty were his words and he's pretty mellow) and by some of the coaches at last years Midd camp.

Amherst is a stretch we thought academically (as was Williams) .... In fact we thought Wes was a stretch but then they were and are all over him since day 1 and they have his transcripts etc. It could change when the SATs come back possibly ruling out or in some if he over or underperforms.

He would pick Wes and Whalen over all at this point but I just want him to do it with open eyes ....

Thanks again to all .....Bates this weekend as they have been extremely aggressive and very nice to him.

[beast58]

Here's a different question for you all....

If a school offers him ED1 when is that done (Trin & Wes says it could at or shortly after their camp, which seems soon! ) and how long will they give you to decide ....i.e. can you then take overnight trip during fall //

Just wondering

[frank uible]

Dad: Relax - you are beginning to psych yourself.  You know enough. Have your son put on the Cardinal and play for Mike and Dan DiCenzo - he'll love it.

[beast58]

Ha ha  you're probably right....

[amh63]

Goodness Frank.....that is a "harsh" post.
Anyway...Amherst posters tend to kid William posters...part of the board rules......but back to the question on hand.
Normally, ED1....meaning early decision 1 vice ED2 (which only a few schools have at present, I believe) has an application deadline in November (check school website).  All info is provided except for first semester grades.  Schools provide decisions in December (again check school websites).  The school's decision is binding.....applicant must withdraw all other applications in the mill, if accepted.
Dad....while you are visiting Bates, go take a look at Bowdoin which is less than 45 minutes away.  It is a terrific school with strong sport programs....but an average football team the past five years.  The head coach is a coach that also has Williams experience in his background.  Two years ago, the football team gave Amherst a scare.  It was the year Amherst was undefeated and beat Williams at Williams.  The HFC is solid and respected.  He doesn't normally get enough of the football talent that the top tier schools get.  If you go back to earlier posts, it seems that Bowdoin is getting good players this year out of Mass.

[frank uible]

amh: Not harsh but honest and designed to conserve time, effort, expense and worry while providing an optimum result - otherwise the search never ends (what about Pomona { the coach is from Williams}, Chicago, WashU, Carnegie-Mellon, Rochester, Case Western Reserve, Sewanee, Occidental, Wabash, DePauw, Denison, Ohio Wesleyan, Union, RPI, Norwich, Carleton, etc.)?

[PistachioX]

You can't go wrong with any of his choices, academically.  They will all offer lifelong friendships, great internships and grad school opps.  It really boils down to which school and program offers the best  fit.

Look at the rosters of each of his top choices and check out the player profiles and game stats of kids in his position(s) to get a better feel for how he would fit in AND how soon he may play his first down.  Who are they graduating, how mnay years have they started, how many underclassmen in that same position have been just Look or Scout guys?

After ongoing exchanges with coaches into early fall, the dust will begin to settle.  Doing a handful of overnights at his top picks after September 1 will be very telling in evidencing his best fit.  For now, have him focus on getting bigger, stronger and faster... and work on positioning him to improve his SAT/ACT scores by fall.

My son had similar choices/slot offers and picked the school with the most competitive football program, where he would also stand the best chance of playing early on.  Other factors went into his choice (location, student vibe, coach, possibility of also playing his spring sport, etc), but in the end... he knew where he felt most comfortable, after doing overnights.  He was an ED1 kid, requiring a boost with AdCom.  It's stressful... but sure was nice that he only needed to submit a single app, and knew before XMas where he would be going.  Best of luck~  wishing your son a healthy and successful Senior season.

[nescac1]

Ummm, Frank, the kid is not even a senior yet.  If it was next March, I'd agree with you, but at this point, there is no pressure whatsoever to make a decision based on, what, conversations with just a few coaches and a few campus visits?  Especially when he has at LEAST until October / Novemberish to figure things out, and that is only if he wants to appy ED, which is by no means necessary for someone with his credentials, it sounds like.  I'd rather cast a slightly broader net, at least until the fall, which is the time to start narrowing things down.  What if the kid crushes the SAT's, then talks to Coach Mills or Coach Kelton and falls head over heels for their philosophy?  Why prematurely pass up a chance to attend the two top liberal arts schools in the country, who also happen to have won the last two NESCAC titles in football?  What if he visits Bowdoin, and realizes that is the ideal school for him?  He seems to have narrowed it down to a very manageable group already of largely small New England schools, no one is talking about Pomona or UChicago here.  No harm in looking at more than three seriously, just because those are the first three coaches to talk to him extensively.

And even Wesleyan vs., say, Trinity is far from the no-brainer you seem to imply.  Trinity has great and very successful coaches, just like Wesleyan.  They have a tremendous football program at a school that has been more traditionally supportive of athletics than Wesleyan.  I'm not sure how pro-football the general culture at Wesleyan is, in fact, you might be on a bit of an island on campus -- something worth considering.  I have no doubt that in five years, Whalen and Dicenzo will have built a tremendous football culture and tradition at Wes.  The question is, do you want to be part of the building process, or go to a school that is already a perennial contender, with a rich football history, and tremendous alumni support, like Trinity (or Williams if that comes back into the picture)?  I'm not saying there is a right or wrong answer there, just that there is no huge rush to decide for someone who hasn't even started his senior year yet.  A lot can change in the life and mind of a 17 year old in six months, after all.