FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[frank uible]

amh63: So it's settled. Your correspondent is going to be seated on the sunny side with all those old Jeffs.

[lumbercat]

FourMore
Our sources agree- scrimmage at 2 at Bowdoin.

[gridiron]

Looking forward to first hand reports back from the scrimmages from those reporters-on-the-scene on this site.

[gridiron]

Regarding relative size of NESCAC rosters, look at the relative size of the NESCAC schools.  Having 80 or so to begin camp (instead of 70-75) really should be NO BIG DEAL when you are one of the bigger schools (Tufts 5.1K, Wesleyan 2.9K, Middlebury 2.5K, Trinity 2.4K, Williams 2.2K).  One could argue they SHOULD have greater numbers with the significantly greater number of potential walk-ons.

What IS impressive is when one of the schools with 1800 or so students is able to get turnout in that range.  Bowdoin, for instance (this season at least).

Of course, size of roster does not always translate to success on the field.  Quality is still king.

[iamhuge]

Regarding relative size of NESCAC rosters, look at the relative size of the NESCAC schools.  Having 80 or so to begin camp (instead of 70-75) really should be NO BIG DEAL when you are one of the bigger schools (Tufts 5.1K, Wesleyan 2.9K, Middlebury 2.5K, Trinity 2.4K, Williams 2.2K).  One could argue they SHOULD have greater numbers with the significantly greater number of potential walk-ons.

What IS impressive is when one of the schools with 1800 or so students is able to get turnout in that range.  Bowdoin, for instance (this season at least).

Of course, size of roster does not always translate to success on the field.  Quality is still king.

I think you are underestimating the talent level of even the NESCAC players.  It's very unlikely that a kid who is smart enough to get into a NESCAC and athletic enough to play meaningful minutes wasn't already in touch with the coach before he was admitted.  If he's good enough to play, he was good enough to be all conference in high school and therefore astute enough to figure out how to get recruited.

I just don't think there are walkons who can just show up at practice and actually make an immediate difference.

[gridiron]

I think we are largely in agreement.

Each recruiting class has about 15 slots used to help gain acceptance.  Each coach hopes to get another 5 to 8 in an incoming class (players he knows about) but does not have to use a slot for admittance.  Project out through senior year with injuries, etc. and roster sizes usually end up in the 70 to 75 player range (75 of course being league max).

Often there are some multisport athletes not recruited primarily for football who end up going out for the team as well.  The term walk-on is not what the name implies.  I'm sure the coaches are seldom surprised by someone they do not know of in advance.  It's simply the case that schools with a larger the pool of students are somewhat more likely to have a few additional players interested in, and potentially capable of, joining the team.

Now, as far as these extra players having a significant impact, I would agree--not likely.  Hence the original point that the quantity on the roster doesn't really matter--it is still the quality. 

I think we are on the same page.  I am actually very impressed overall with the level of talent in the NESCAC.

[amh63]

Another "in my day" story while awaiting current football info.
Freddie Scott, Class of '73, who holds most of the receiving records at Amherst, was a true walk-on.  A slightly built student from the Little Rock, AKansas area, went to watch his room-mate at football practice.  The story goes that he thought he had a chance to play after watching.  Freddie Scott went on to the NFL and was a MVP for the Detroit Loins.  He has since been elected to the College Hall of Fame.  It is told that he took medical school courses when he was in the NFL.
I too agree that today's football world is such that a Freddie Scott will nover be overlooked...would never even play D3. Football.  Still...who knows.

[iamhuge]

Another "in my day" story while awaiting current football info.
Freddie Scott, Class of '73, who holds most of the receiving records at Amherst, was a true walk-on.  A slightly built student from the Little Rock, AKansas area, went to watch his room-mate at football practice.  The story goes that he thought he had a chance to play after watching.  Freddie Scott went on to the NFL and was a MVP for the Detroit Loins.  He has since been elected to the College Hall of Fame.  It is told that he took medical school courses when he was in the NFL.
I too agree that today's football world is such that a Freddie Scott will nover be overlooked...would never even play D3. Football.  Still...who knows.

Back in the 70's and early 80's, if you were a starter on a high school football team, you could go play in the NESCAC.  I have numerous examples of kids I knew in high school who were not very good at all, who played for Middlebury, Tufts, Colby, etc.

[iamhuge]

This article cites Tufts scrimmage results and lists a few of the 30+ freshmen that they have:

http://www.tuftsdaily.com/sports/football-notebook-freshmen-impress-in-intersquad-scrimmage-1.2834328#.UjJ0U8aTh8E

Seems pretty clear that most of the experienced veterans will still be the key contributors.

[gridiron]

Nice job reporting on the Tufts scrimmage.  Hope we get more over the next few days.

[Knightstalker]

Just a question regarding rosters in the NESCAC.  I realize that the teams are limited to 75 on the roster.  If the school fields a JV team do the players come from the 75 man roster or can they also have a JV roster?  Second question, do some of the schools do the wink wink, nudge nudge with some players if they have to cut them, basically telling them to stay in shape because if someone goes down for the season they will be added to the team or is this not allowed by the conference?

[quicksilver]

This is what the 2004 NESCAC manual (more current versions are not accessible to members of the public!!):

Each NESCAC institution that sponsors football shall submit their official team roster (of no more than 75
players) to the conference office. Official rosters must be submitted no later than noon the day before the
first game of the season. Each roster shall indicate the name and number of each player that will be
eligible for practice and competition that season. No additions or substitutions will be permitted once the
list is submitted. The roster should be submitted with the approval of and by the respective head coach and
Athletics Director. Practice/taxi squads and/or separate junior varsity programs are not permitted.

Assuming that the rules are still the same, it looks like no JV squad (outside of a JV squad that first within the 75-member roster) and no movement onto the roster once the official 75-member list is submitted to the NESCAC offices before the first game.

[frank uible]

Would that the ongoing changes in Presidencies among the NESCAC colleges cause the elimination of the Rule of 75 and its unbelievably bad pedagogy, but in your correspondent's view, sadly such an event remains highly unlikely.

[gridiron]

My understanding is that teams rarely end up needing to actually cut players.  Rarely do teams begin with more on their preseason rosters than 80.  Five players or so inevitably fall to attrition of various types (injuries especially).  Teams that start with 80 also tend to initially include some players the coaches know would be a surprise if they stuck around until game one--i.e., some upperclassmen who were injured and never played before in their college careers, some who are just too small to realistically succeed, some who like to be around the program but will end up helping out in other ways.  There are several such players on the current 80 man 2013 rosters.

[amh63]

Went to the Tufts website and saw/felt the rise of sport spirit...really.  There is a Fan Spirit spot and two? Football sites.  In any case, good to see.  Tufts has posted it's webcast plans for this upcoming seasons.  Cannot yet figure out all the parties....Presto for stats; Jumbocast being the student run video and a d3 something others.  Maybe Iamhuge can clarify or any other Tufts poster.  Not too smart with this new "Internet " thing.
On the subject of squad size.....the Tufts 2012 roster is still up.  Counted the non seniors and came up with 54 players.  If there are 30 plus freshmen candidates and all underclass men return....there maybe 84 players around for a time.  Good to see that Tufts and others are going to reach the player limit.  I see more competitive games in the future for the conference.