FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[quicksilver]

Much excitement in the Bowdoin world because the Hail Mary pass to win the Colby game with 3 seconds to go made # 3 on the ten plays of the day on ESPN's Sports Center last night.

[daoustian]

Tough weekend for Williams.  Losing in football, losing in soccer, then having a former football star arrested and in the news:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/morgan-stanley-bigwig-secretly-taped-sex-romps-prosecutors-article-1.1511592

http://web.williams.edu/athletics/news.php?id=451&sport=10&year=2002&type=general - for those who don't remember Mr. Kelly, he was a preseason All American cornerback in 2002

Unrelated discussion topic to distract us from Mr. Kelly's Ephcapades: for the Lord Jeff alums on the board: would you rather be "the jock school" (seemingly moving that way after football wins in 4 out of 5 years, men's basketball wins in 15 of the past 21 head-to-head matchups, 9 of the last 10 women's hoops games), or ahead of Williams in the US News and World Report rankings?  It's a bit odd how this has flipped in the past 15 years, and I'm curious to hear which people prefer. 

[Panthernation]

All-conference picks: http://sites.middlebury.edu/panthernation/2013/11/11/2013-all-nescac-teams/

[nescac1]

Daostian, someone snarky might say that there was an inverse correlation between the two, but if you actually look at US News factors that has allowed Williams to dominate the rankings for the past decade, they are entirely or almost entirely completely unrelated to anything that has to do with athletic recruiting or success (the only arguable one is Williams' extremely high graduation rate, which possibly rose marginally in conjunction with the tightening of athletic recruiting standards, also about a decade ago).  Amherst despite its improved athletic success still is typically about even with Williams in the overall selectively criteria, which is the biggest factor that might potentially be affected by athletic recruiting.

Although Williams has undeniably struggled of late vs. Amherst in the highest-profile sports, and while Williams is not the 800 pound gorilla (along with Midd) of NESCAC athletics that it was in the 90's, Williams is still at the upper echelon of NESCAC athletics in the aggregate, along with Midd and Amherst.  Williams did after all make the elite 8 in men's basketball and beat Amherst twice in women's hoops last year, including in the Final Four.  Williams has made it to the Final Four in men's hoops in two of the past four years, and the only down year in hoops of the past four was a product of the worst rash of injuries happening at once that I've seen.  It was only a few seasons ago that men's hoops beat Amherst in the Elite 8.  Men's hoops is a top-five pre-season team this year once again and should be a force this year.  Williams has made it to two Final Fours in men's soccer in recent years, including last year.  Williams has the best overall women's soccer program in NESCAC.  And in most of the lower-profile sports like swimming and diving, cross country, track, tennis, crew, volleyball, Williams continues to be dominant more years than not, including three national championships in those sports last year, and total national dominance in women's tennis and women's crew.  Williams has also dramatically improved in men's ice hockey to the point where they are now a NESCAC contender.  Williams did (as usual) win the Director's Cup last year and will likely have FIVE teams in NCAA tourneys this fall (NESCAC champions volleyball and men's cross country, women's cross country, men's and women's soccer).  So it's not like Williams athletics overall has fallen off a cliff ... it's just that Amherst started emphasizing athletics much more. 

So, the football troubles shouldn't be seen as an indicator of a broader trend for Williams athletics ... if the Ephs can turn the football program around, Williams has as much claim to being the "jock school" of NESCAC as anyone -- we just no longer hold that title alone (or arguably, with Middlebury) as the Ephs did in prior decades, as Amherst has really amped up its game over the past decade and some other schools like Trinity (in particular, Trinity is as strong at the top as anyone, just doesn't have the depth across athletics programs), Wesleyan and Bowdoin are very close behind.   

[nescac1]

Back to football, nice job with your picks Panthernation.  I agree with Ciero as a second-teamer.  He and Dunklee are going to be a dynamite duo for awhile.  Meanwhile I think all of NESCAC is happy to see Foote graduate.  It's fun that NESCAC has become more and more evenly competitive instead of dominated by one or two teams, and next year will be another year that is fairly wide open in terms of a bunch of very good teams competing for the crown. 

It is a sign of how far the Ephs have fallen that they only (deservedly) have one individual honoree.  Can't even think of anyone else who warrants consideration.  I do think there are a slew of potential all-NESCAC guys returning next year, including Howe, Adam Datema, Tom Cabarle on defense, and Darrias Sime, Alex Way, and Alan Felix (I'd add Scyocurka in terms of talent, but he did not play to his billing this year) on offense, but the results this year speak for themselves.  Will be a long offseason in Billsville but after losing very few seniors of note, at least the future is brighter for Williams. 

[frank uible]

nescac1: You certainly are an unresisting sucker for a baited hook!

[Nescacparent]

@Panthernation- Thanks for your picks and the thought and effort that goes into them. On the defensive side, it appears to me that certain defensive schemes result in higher defensive stats for linebackers rather the linemen and visa versa. Do you think this id true? Have you taken a look at a comparison of more successful teams/d-lines vs. less successful ones compared their schemes and stats. I have not done so thoroughly- it is just an obsevartion I have after watching 3 or so seasons of NESCAC football. Generally, it appears to me that for  teams utilizing 4 or five linemen the linemen stats are higher. In teams utilizing 3 (or even in some packages 2 ) linemen, the linebackers have the higher defensive stats.( I have not  factored in the team W/L record in my observations yet) What do you think?
If my theory has value (I am prepared to be proven wrong!),  then, in the NESCAC should defensive scheme as well as defensive statistics factor into your picks? Thanks for any input into this

[lancer]

@Panthernation: Thanks for posting your picks.  I did notice one minor error.  The second team WR from Trinity is Chris Ragone.  Brian Ragone is his younger brother who plays WR for Amherst.

[frank uible]

daoustian: If the charges are true, Kelly would be a wonderful example of the success of Williams' unremitting quest to achieve diversity with the objective that all kinds and sorts be represented in its student body.

[PistachioX]

@Panthernation- Thanks for your picks and the thought and effort that goes into them. On the defensive side, it appears to me that certain defensive schemes result in higher defensive stats for linebackers rather the linemen and visa versa. Do you think this id true? Have you taken a look at a comparison of more successful teams/d-lines vs. less successful ones compared their schemes and stats. I have not done so thoroughly- it is just an obsevartion I have after watching 3 or so seasons of NESCAC football. Generally, it appears to me that for  teams utilizing 4 or five linemen the linemen stats are higher. In teams utilizing 3 (or even in some packages 2 ) linemen, the linebackers have the higher defensive stats.( I have not  factored in the team W/L record in my observations yet) What do you think?
If my theory has value (I am prepared to be proven wrong!),  then, in the NESCAC should defensive scheme as well as defensive statistics factor into your picks? Thanks for any input into this.

Very true - at least for Trinity, who plays a 3-4 front on D.  The job of the 3 downed linemen is to contain and to keep the oncoming FB and OL guys tied up so the LB's can swoop in and grab the tackles.

Some teams may have low numbers of overall tackles because they are effective at flushing the QB out of the pocket into a higher number of bad/incomplete throw situations....or because their DB's are so effective in pass coverage.

Other teams also pull starters (on offense and defense) after a quarter or two in lopsided contests, while other, less successful teams allow/need starters to maximize play time; thus running up stats.

IMO...you really should consider the overall effectiveness of candidates in their team's offensive/defensive results, as much as their individual, stagnant numbers.

[Trin9-0]

Source at Trin texted me the photo below (please pardon the obscenity). It was taken in the visiting team locker room following Trinity's 40-10 thrashing of Wesleyan on Saturday. Apparently the Cardinals haven't yet learned how to deal with success... or defeat.

You stay classy Wes.



My guess is that the Bantams will revisit this message next November in preparation for their 14th consecutive win against the Cards.

Al, I also heard a rumor that someone had Wesleyan "Undefeated NESCAC Champions" t-shirts produced to pass out for the inevitable post game celebration than never was. Can you confirm or deny? If you have any leads please let me know. I'd love to buy a few of those as gag gifts for both my Trin and Wes friends.

[nescac1]

Who let AlDavis into the locker room  ??

[Panthernation]

We made a couple of changes to the Awards post after noticing a couple of errors/oversights, including the Ragone brother mix up, thank you for pointing that out. We've republished the corrected version.

Nescacparent, we don't doubt that scheme plays a large role in the numbers that certain positions and players produce. Often times dominant defensive lineman go underrepresented statistically because they are engaging blockers and taking on double teams in order to free lanes for linebackers/safeties to fill and make plays. Short of watching tape (which isn't readily available), however, those attributes are difficult to account for, other than what we hear from players, coaches and posters over the course of the year about those guys. Ultimately, we are confined in large part to what the stats show and what we see in the game-plus action we see everyone play. Our method is certainly far from perfect, though we try to use a combination of stats, visual breakdown and reputation to make our picks. Joey Cleary, our DPOY pick (see revised edition) is a pretty good example of that. Cleary led the league in tackles—a good, but potentially flawed indicator—was one of the best defensive players we saw (he was dominant in Middlebury's opener against Bowdoin) and was spoken of highly by players and coaches in the days after the game. Of course, a fair number of all-conference level players at specific positions don't produce noteworthy stats, went unnoticed by us in the game(s) we saw them play and were not publicly talked about. Like I said, it's not a perfect—or even the best—system, which is ultimately why we aren't called upon to make these selections. If anything, publishing our picks hopefully creates a space where other people can share their thoughts on certain players we did or didn't select and explain where we might have missed certain players deserving of recognition. As always, thank you for reading and sharing your feedback.

[AlDavis]

......ok now Humans..........just as in real life I am surrounded by assassins so I always have my head on a swivel........not in any particular order  but here we go.......Coopster 8.0 , I don't think that was written on the blackboard by a Wesleyan Football Person and if so , I am positive it was not condoned..........Coach Whalen gave an Epic Speech on the field to his troops after the Sound Defeat and that's that........I certainly would not conduct a cowardly statement as that as I will always tell you before hand how it will go down and always in person if need be , but  never behind your back or anyone's back .....I don't represent Wesleyan or speak for Wesleyan but am most certain that chalkboard scrawl is staged.........to Amhurt63 finally responding to me 6 weeks later , cool bro , but I don't have multi online personalities , they are all 100 percent real and only gave out 500 clues who I am and could care less if we went by our real names here as I always show up even when outnumbered and certainly would not have been afraid of just One Tent filled with Amhurt Mafia as the odds where just about even when I was looking for Coopster 8.0 at the prescribed location and about 200 Bantam Men and Women where looking at me as an Even Standoff , but we cool Amhurt63 and I will hook you up with any chick , cigar , food , drinks , book from the library you want next year when come to the Whalen Mafia Turf as I will vouch for you.........The T-Shirts I don't know about , but maybe so , it would have been an Epic Accomplishment and don't doubt maybe they where.........Be Very , Very Afraid next year as almost everyone is coming back and word on the street is that a handful of Key Seniors will be getting a GS year ......there will now be an Arms Race like in the Nuclear Weapons in the Reagan years , it's on , it's not going away........there was also a reference to Coach DiCenzo looking good somewhere else and I think the starting price there would be at lowest 10 Million Dollars up front in Cash.............Stanky Franky whatever bro if I went to College in the late 1700's I would know big words and phrases out my aarse too........BantamXGirl  you are that Girl Her fo sho fo , sho  tru dat , as you posted it prior and let everyone know up front and you where dead on point on every phase of your statements and you know what time it is and you don't worry about that slum thing , slums are very underrated and its all relative and I don't roll that way on judgements......I have yet to think of a Song to sing to myself as the loss hurts and will have to settle on 31 - 1 as a parent and very , very thankful and appreciative and will hope to reciprocate in the future.....Gridiron bro , will get back to you and would like to hear more details of that EPIC Colby-Bowdoin Game and 4MoreBeers hit me hard again and will deposit later in the Week.

[Nescacparent]

Thanks @PantherNation- clearly you have put much thoughtful time into your NESCAC football commentary and have a overall high level of understanding of the conference. It is certainly appreciated. I do not know enough to comment at all on your selections, just enough to ask a question or two. I hope you and NESCACman will continue entertain and educate this board again next season!