FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[amh63]

ContinentalsMan.....like your persistent headstrong attack style   plus K to you.   Have seen the new Music and Arts facilities in Clinton  Puts pressure on me since Amherst hints at a new Music building.   Next time Amherst plays Hamilton in that lovely place...confusing that Colgate is in the town of Hamilton down the road.....I will like to meet you and have a discussion on where true educators place Amherst on the academic scale....not too long ago the Dean of Faculty at Harvard stated...in a blunt manner, that for an undergraduate education, the best place is Amherst..not at Harvard.  I extend that thought to all of the NESCAC vice the Ivies.  My late dad..a very smart person would agree.  Having seen my older brother's experience at Harvard and mine at Amherst..he chose to support Amherst in his later years.
This topic has run its course for me.....rather turn to music and BANDs!  Maybe even the topic of cheerleaders at games!
Seems Amherst has a "budding" cheerleader squad.....saw it at the recent volleyball game between the Ephs and LJs.
Anything is better than the men cheerleaders in my days of all-male enrollment.
What CAC schools have football cheerleaders?

[P'bearfan]

Anything is better than the men cheerleaders in my days of all-male enrollment.

That could not have been pretty....especially in the dead of winter.....

[P'bearfan]

What CAC schools have football cheerleaders?

I had to look it up on line but apparently Bowdoin does (or did as recently as 2011).  Assume they are still active and just haven't updated their website.

http://students.bowdoin.edu/cheerleading/about/

[hamgrand]

I thought I have seen a girls dance team at Hamilton that performs at halftime on occasion.

[amh63]

Thanks P'Bear for the follow up! 
Hamfan...I also saw the dance squad perform...online.
Thought I saw a Tufts squad online at a game online...however at a live game in LeFrak, there were no cheerleaders.  Really think that the schools should support that activity even to the extent of plus credit in admissions...truly.
Guess today's students are missing somethings...road trips...all night poker games...oops better stop here...though the card games included faculty members.
Actually today's students activities are more wholesomes...all three of my kids point that out to me when I tell them of my toga party days.( they all decided to attend Amherst in spite of my stories).
Back to football.  Nice to see that two Tufts players were picked as Players of the Week!  Long time coming.

[ContinentalsMan]

You can't go wrong going with any NESCAC or Ivy school and I was super impressed with Amherst when we visited. The great thing about this blog is each of the schools we are talking about have tremendous academic reputations and deliver the goods in the classroom. I was part of a tremendous tradition in football in college and just realize how closely that has kept all of us as we have gone through the years. Football is a special sport and while the NFL has some cleaning up to do as well as the college game, it is only going to get more popular from the top level down. I was at Wesleyan last week and the atmosphere was great in the stands and competition good on the field on what is a converted baseball diamond and quad. Can you imagine what it will be like there when they finally build a stadium? And can you imagine how pumped they are over at Tufts right now? Two straight wins and a chance for a third Saturday after going all those games without a victory. Good for them and if they are smart and market themselves properly they will pack in their next home game on Oct. 14.           

[Nescacparent]

Quote from PolarCat:

Ah, but there is an ugly underbelly to Ivy recruiting.  One that (hopefully) the NESCAC schools will avoid, maybe more than happenstance than by design.

An Ivy team's Academic Index has to fall within a certain range compared to the rest of the student body.  So what does Harvard do when they need a tight end, but the kid they really want is dumber than a post?  They recruit the tight end, and balance him off with another player (Punter? WR?) who is a marginal player, will never get a minute of playing time (except maybe against Columbia and Cornell), but who has perfect SAT's, a 4.5 GPA and is a member of Mensa.  The Harvard coach gets his TE, without jeopardizing his AI.

Now the punter has pipe dreams of being a football hero in college, never realizing that his intended role is to ride the pine for 4 years (or until he quits football in favor of the Hasty Pudding).  Is that fair?  Depending on the kid, maybe yes, maybe no.  We know kids who got "recruited" to Harvard, Yale and Dartmouth, who will never play a snap.  Their role is to prop up the AI, period.  And we know other kids that are wearing the Crimson or Big Green who are not academically gifted enough to be admitted to Bowdoin or Wiliams.   At the end of the day, they'll all graduate with the Ivy diploma, so maybe they were all well-served.

To the best of my knowledge, the NESCAC's limits on recruiting function differently than the Ivies - no tips below a certain level, etc.  (I'm sure others here are much more knowledgeable on this score than I am).  So the Colby coach CANNOT recruit that same dumb-as-a-post TE, and balance him with the unathletic brainiac punter.  And the 75-man roster places terrific constraints: how do you compete for the kids who have talent, that also have brains, and that are being wooed by the Ivies (to prop up their AI), or being offered scholarship $$$ by the DI's?

PolarCat and ContinentalsMan- for sports other than football, Ivy recruiting works generally as described, however football is a different matter sometimes referred to as the "banding system". You can find a general description here: http://www.varsityedge.com/nei/varsity.nsf/main/athletic+recruiting+at+the+ivy+league
To say that the banding system allows for creativity would be an understatement. Many Ivy's are giving likely letters to students with 21 -24 on their ACTs (score conversion to SAT on a 1600 scale= 1000-1110) on a regular basis. If any one knows of a student accepted to Williams, Amherst or Bowdoin in that range, please let me know. Thus the pool of recruits for the Ivy Schools is incredibly wider and deeper.  Even with this pool the Ivy teams are struggling against their scholarship opponents and some Ivy JVs loose in contests with NESCAC schools (see Middlebury and Dartmouth JVs this year). I do not know where the future of contests  between these leagues will go, but the recruit pools and out of season training as well as roster limits would have to be made level between the leagues before this can happen.

[toad22]

I am aware of several basketball players with high grades and ACT/SATs (35-36/2300-2400) who chose Ivy schools over Williams who never even made the team. These players would have been decent role players in the NESCAC, but were taken by the Ivys strictly for their grades. I don't know if those players felt used by the Ivy or not, but it is a totally corrupt system at its core. Even with that, I think that each school should do what it feels is in its best interest. I'm told by Ivy guys in the know that the Ivy system works reasonably well except with regard to Princeton, and especially Harvard, who feel that the rules don't apply to them.

[Nescacman]

ContinentalsMan.....like your persistent headstrong attack style   plus K to you.   Have seen the new Music and Arts facilities in Clinton  Puts pressure on me since Amherst hints at a new Music building.   Next time Amherst plays Hamilton in that lovely place...confusing that Colgate is in the town of Hamilton down the road.....I will like to meet you and have a discussion on where true educators place Amherst on the academic scale....not too long ago the Dean of Faculty at Harvard stated...in a blunt manner, that for an undergraduate education, the best place is Amherst..not at Harvard.  I extend that thought to all of the NESCAC vice the Ivies.  My late dad..a very smart person would agree.  Having seen my older brother's experience at Harvard and mine at Amherst..he chose to support Amherst in his later years.
This topic has run its course for me.....rather turn to music and BANDs!  Maybe even the topic of cheerleaders at games!
Seems Amherst has a "budding" cheerleader squad.....saw it at the recent volleyball game between the Ephs and LJs.
Anything is better than the men cheerleaders in my days of all-male enrollment.
What CAC schools have football cheerleaders?

Having attended the Wes/Conts game in Middletown last Saturday, we note that Wes has BOTH a Band and Cheerleaders.

Just to add our two cents to the Ivy/Nescac debate...having attended a Nescac school in the mid-80's, we scrimmaged a pretty good Princeton varsity team (including at least two future NFLers) and held our own losing 24-14 (those were the days when Nescac schools had 3 scrimmages...2 game scrimmages and 1 inter-squad and played 7 conferences games and 1 out of conference rivalry game...like Norwich v Middlebury and Wesleyan v Coast Guard). Were they a little bigger and a little faster, yes. Were we just as athletic and just as tough, IMO yes.

[amh63]

Nescacman...thank you all for the inputs to my questions wrt to cheerleaders and bands.  WES is going all out.  Last time I was in Middletown for the game...remember the field was wet on the edges, the food at the vendors tent...taste of Middletown...was average.  Do not remember the cheerleaders or even a band....did notice the larger crowds for family and homecoming.  Yes the fans are growing for Cardinal football.
To the Hamilton fan that was speculating on the grass football field....Wesleyan maybe conflicted.
It is a field that has been in old movies...being the oldest football field in continuous use in the land. WES did play the first lighted game last season, so there could be lights added and maybe a turf cover added.  The baseball field would have to be moved elsewhere if such upgrades are made to the historic spot.
Bates' preview of the Williams game is posted.  Should be a pivotal season game..an identity check type game for both schools.
Amherst also has a pivotal game up in VT this weekend.  Last time up in Middlebury, A Foote led Panther team shredded Amherst( no pun intended here).  The game last season on Pratt field, Amherst returned the favor.  Believe it was the Panthers' worst lost of the season.  Coach Mills admitted on video that it was a game he had circled...after being out coached, outplayed, etc. up in VT.   Yes, it will be a game to see how good Amherst will be as well as how good MIddlebury will become.  Both teams have shown that it has QB promise and good defenses.  Wonder if the new OC will put in QB Lippe for his experience and decision making...or is that left up to the the new QB coach.

[banfan]

Curious question for the Hamilton posters. There has been a lot of talk here that the team is in good hands and that the school has taken a turn in support.

Besides the history making football at Hamilton less fun, is the amount of bus travel impacting the program in any way? Posters often talk of the "long trip that we will have to take to Waterville or Middlebury or Williamstown for this weekend's game." Other than the short, 2 1/2 hour jaunt to Williamstown, the Continentals can say that for every away game.

[ContinentalsMan]

It's interesting that the Wesleyan seniors took a shot at Hamilton after the game by not singing their fight song ... http://www.middletownpress.com/sports/20140928/college-football-wesleyan-tops-hamilton-in-home-opener ... I had forgotten that the Cardinals were the Alabama of the NESCAC ... lot of great football history in Middleton ... here's that great football history year by year ... http://www.wesleyan.edu/athletics/football/all-time-records/yearbyyear.html ... throw them stones ...

[frank uible]

College-age persons (and a lot of other people but especially college-age persons) tend not to know or care about history, football or otherwise. On the other hand they tend to believe that what is happening today will be (if not happening forever) happening far into the future. So why worry about it as emotionally mature adults like Mike Whelan do?

[amh63]

ContinentalsMan...Frank U....thank you both for the thought provoking posts on matters in Middletown.  Plus K to you both.  It did bothered me somewhat after reading the local press article.  Why?  I have been following WES's efforts to return to its past glory days since the arrival of Coach/AD Whalen.  Not only in sports but also in financial sound standing..add academic to the list.
After last season's lost to the Cardinals on Pratt field, I with friends chatted with the Coach a little and was impressed...strong grip..big hands.  After reading the local press article, I was bothered about the negative  locker room atmosphere being generated.  Bothered that one of the Cardinals star players had to be cited for negative on the field play.  Nescac student players should respect their opponents.
Many will become long time friends in the future, after graduations.  I have seen it...my kids have experienced it...there is a NESCAC bond in their future.

[Bantsfan]

I know it's early, but I was just wondering if Trinity senior RB Chudi Iregbulem is currently leading the league in offense with 7 touchdowns and 217 yards on the ground in just two games?  This poor kid waited patiently behind Bunker and Crick for three years so it's nice to see him get his shot.  I hope he breaks a record or two this year!