FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[amh63]

Things must be slow elsewhere....i.e. Liberty League or the Empire 8.  Nice to have "visitors" views; better if they are on topic and related to conference items.
Anyway, The Amherst-Colby preview is on the Amherst website.
Further info to make the earlier discussions even more interesting.   The most recent school to enter the conference, Conn. College, does not have a football team.  Hamilton College who has been a member in football, will be a full sports member next year.  In sports such as soccer, field hockey, basketball, tennis, swimming, etc. they are in a different conference at present...Liberty League I believe.
As some posters have pointed out, it is basically how the conference members view the role of sports in the missions of the colleges and the role of sports in the education of the students.
Colleges like RPI, Union and JHU are great schools and have top level students.  Yet each school has decided a different path wrt the role of sports in the mission of the school, IMO.  Union left the NESCAC conference in part because they wanted to have a Div.1 level hockey program.  RPI also has a Div.1 Hockey program with Div.3 programs for the other sports.  JHU has a Div.1 Lacrosse program but pursues championships in its other sports at the Div.3 level
The most interesting school brought up in the discussions to date is MIT.  MIT did not have a football team when I was in grad. school in the late 60's.  I believe it added a football team in the 80's.  I was most proud of the school when I read an article about how the team became a "varsity sport" (Alumni mag.)  The article stated that MIT bought much of the "equipment " it needed to start the varsity level program from a college that was dropping football.  The team played its first game in uniforms that were not in the MIT colors, rather in the colors of the school that dropped football.  Now that is a school that has the approach to college sports!

[Yarsan]

The "recruiting" issue is an interesting problem... I know NESCAC pretty well, my oldest son swims at a NESCAC school and my middle son is a HS senior, playing football and lacrosse.  He's being recruited by several teams, including a couple of NESCACs (he should know for sure in a week or two where he's going!)

The fact that NESCAC schools play a shorter season and DON'T practice all year is a huge plus for him.  He wants to play both sports, but he knows his primary mission is to get an outstanding education.  His grades and scores are good enough to get into most NESCACs even without sports, but he LOVES football and lacrosse.  He's going to choose a school where sports and education line up, if possible.  That's only going to happen at a NESCAC, and one or two other schools (Washington & Lee, for example.)

So I think it's a smart positioning move on NESCACs part.  They get a lot of very good and very smart athletes, who can really contribute to the overall school atmosphere. Niche marketing at it's finest.

[frank uible]

All this stuff is merely guesses at the reasoning by NESCAC about its inter-collegiate football policies - and in many cases patently bad guesses. NESCAC remains silent on the subject. At any rate small college football was alive and healthy before there was a DIII or DIII playoffs. There is no reason NESCAC or any of its individual institutions (or for that matter any  segment of DIII football) can't be alive and healthy without its participation in football playoffs now.

[amh63]

Nicely put Frank U!  Helps to put us "lost souls" on the right path.

[bleedpurple]

HELP WANTED:

Looking for Pollsters for a "soon to be unveiled" D3 TOP 25 FAN POLL.

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[Doid23]

but he LOVES football and lacrosse.  He's going to choose a school where sports and education line up, if possible.  That's only going to happen at a NESCAC, and one or two other schools (Washington & Lee, for example.)

What??? NESCAC and 1 or 2 other schools? I hope that you really don't believe that. There are hundreds of schools where that is possible.

[Yarsan]

What??? NESCAC and 1 or 2 other schools? I hope that you really don't believe that. There are hundreds of schools where that is possible.

There really aren't "hundreds" of schools that have the academic quality of the NESCACs AND where he can play both football and lacrosse. I was talking only about one kid's particular search, and why NESCAC's approach makes it an attractive league for that one kid.

Just to name a few possible choices - D 1 schools like Bucknell and Georgetown run full year programs and don't really love the idea of kids playing two sports - and GU lacrosse is above his skill level. Schools like F&M, Union or Gettysburg are good, but they aren't quite NESCAC.  Davidson and Macalester don't offer varsity lacrosse.  Some great schools are farther away than he's looking to go.

Sure, there are TONS of great schools with amazing things to offer. No argument there.  I just like the fact that there are 10 schools in one league where my son can "get it all."

So, that's all I meant to say.  We've looked at a lot of schools, and there really aren't many that offer my kid as much as the NESCACs do.

[Jonny Utah]

What??? NESCAC and 1 or 2 other schools? I hope that you really don't believe that. There are hundreds of schools where that is possible.

There really aren't "hundreds" of schools that have the academic quality of the NESCACs AND where he can play both football and lacrosse. I was talking only about one kid's particular search, and why NESCAC's approach makes it an attractive league for that one kid.

Just to name a few possible choices - D 1 schools like Bucknell and Georgetown run full year programs and don't really love the idea of kids playing two sports - and GU lacrosse is above his skill level. Schools like F&M, Union or Gettysburg are good, but they aren't quite NESCAC.  Davidson and Macalester don't offer varsity lacrosse.  Some great schools are farther away than he's looking to go.

Sure, there are TONS of great schools with amazing things to offer. No argument there.  I just like the fact that there are 10 schools in one league where my son can "get it all."

So, that's all I meant to say.  We've looked at a lot of schools, and there really aren't many that offer my kid as much as the NESCACs do.

There are levels within the nescac as well though too.  Williams and Amherst are by themselves at the top of the nescac in terms of admissions of non-athletes getting into the school.  After those two schools, Union is exactly the same as all the rest.  And I base that on my 15 years of educational experience with high school student/(athletes) applying to nescac schools, getting into nescac schools, and other schools like Union or Franklin and Marshall.

[nescac1]

Jonny, there are levels, but you skipped one.  It basically goes Williams / Amherst (along with non-NESCAC schools Pomona and Swarthmore), then Midd/Wesleyan/Bowdoin (along with a few others like Haverford and Carleton), and then the rest of NESCAC, where Union would approximately fall along with Hamilton, Bates, Trinity, Conn, etc.

Back to football, at the half way point of the season, not too many surprises, but a few.   Top candidates for individual honors to date:

OPY:  1. Shea Dwyer (biggest surprise), 2. McKillop, 3. Darren Hartwell (also a big surprise), 4. Pat Moffitt, 5. Alex Vetras

I am really impressed with the depth and talent of the Williams receivers.  Bryce Bennett (who should return from injury soon) and Darren Hartwell are both first-team all NESCAC level guys, and Bill Griffin, JC Stickney, and Tomas Kearney are all very solid NESCAC starters.  All but Bennett return next year to boot. 

DPY:   1. Dylan Schultz, 2. Harry Melendez, 3. Cyprian Oyamba 4. Matt Pieterse

ROY: lots of great frosh RB's to choose from, I'll say 1. Evan Bunker, 2. Alex Scyocurka, 3. Zach Donarumma, 4. Griff Cardew

What's crazy about Bunker is that he seemed to be the third Trinity frosh RB in line after two otherws were dominating (and, I imagine, got injured?). 

[amh63]

There hasn't been much chatter by posters on the football games.  What's up?   It is past mid-season and I will provide my observations to date (nescac 1 beat me to the gate again)
Surprises to date: Bates- Bates has played well after the expected blowout at Amherst.  Beat Tufts away and challenged Wes. last week.  Took a run by the Wes QB in the last 51 seconds (21 yards) for the victory.; Midd- QB McKillop still passing like crazy and racking up the numbers/records... but the team is loosing the games.  Amherst had a shootout game.  It seems Midd doesn't have the defense this year to go along with its offense.;  Bowdoin and Tufts seems to be "flat" this year.  Both are not playing competative games,IMO.(Amherst still has to play Tufts..so I should be nice); Trinity-strong offense but not a balanced offense so far.  Defense not up to past standards so far.; Williams- Has a balanced offense.  QB is "full-time " this season and has stable of WRs'.  Defense is solid to date.  Expect the normal battle at Amherst in Nov.  Could be a battle of unbeatens.; Wes- New coach has developed a fine offense with the ex-Williams QB and the use of a Grad. Student running back. Potent running game in place.  Passing attack and defense needs to improve.  Dangerous team so that I cannot relax this weekend.  Will be at Middletown to watch the game.; Amherst- Passing game going well and have a good running game this season.  Last year's inexperienced offensive line (4 newcomers) has the experience this year and the running game is improving nicely with young talented runners getting time.  Amherst's WRs are big and experienced and Reed can match the speed and hands of any Williams' WR. The defense this year does not need to keep Amherst "in the game" until the offense finds a way to win"...as it did last year.  The defensive backfield is good but lacks game experience.  IMO, it can be better than last year's backfield with more games played; Hamilton-not yet ready to move into the upper tier this year.

[nescac1]

All good analysis Amh63.  Amherst's offense does seem much improved this year, even if the defense (while still very strong) isn't quite as dominating overall, which is no shock given all the stars that graduated. 

I do have to take issue with Reed (who is indeed a dangerous deep threat) matching any of the Williams receivers for speed ... ask Trinity's Melendez (arguably the best corner in NESCAC) how easy it is to keep up with Hartwell, who burned him for three TD's, and who already has SEVEN on the year (three or four of which are for 80 plus yards) despite barely playing at WR in the first week.  He is reputed to be the fastest guy on the Williams roster.  But it will all be settled in a few weeks in what I hope is a clash of undefeateds!  Both have some tough games between now and then, though, and neither can sleep on Wesleyan. 

Trinity does seem to be coming together and will also give Amherst a very tough game -- they simply do not lose at home, remember.  Not sure why Galligan has been so quiet this year as he was a superstar last year -- could he be hurt?  He may be the deep threat Trinity needs to open up its passing game and establish a bit more balance. 

[amh63]

The Amherst-Wes game preview is on the Amherst website.  Last year, Wes gained less than 50 total yards in the game at Amherst.  This year, the Wes runner from last year is running at over 189 yds/game.  The coach has improved the offensive line and the team attitude greatly.  It will be an interesting game to watch.  The game day at Middletown is always fun to attend.

[dlippiel]

Jonny, there are levels, but you skipped one.  It basically goes Williams / Amherst (along with non-NESCAC schools Pomona and Swarthmore), then Midd/Wesleyan/Bowdoin (along with a few others like Haverford and Carleton), and then the rest of NESCAC, where Union would approximately fall along with Hamilton, Bates, Trinity, Conn, etc.

Union would clearly fit right into the middle. dlip looked at both Bowdoin and Union and found there to be very little difference between the two. Bottom line all are excellent academic institutions and provide an environment for high level students to develop.

[mariner75]

What??? NESCAC and 1 or 2 other schools? I hope that you really don't believe that. There are hundreds of schools where that is possible.

There really aren't "hundreds" of schools that have the academic quality of the NESCACs AND where he can play both football and lacrosse. I was talking only about one kid's particular search, and why NESCAC's approach makes it an attractive league for that one kid.

Just to name a few possible choices - D 1 schools like Bucknell and Georgetown run full year programs and don't really love the idea of kids playing two sports - and GU lacrosse is above his skill level. Schools like F&M, Union or Gettysburg are good, but they aren't quite NESCAC.  Davidson and Macalester don't offer varsity lacrosse.  Some great schools are farther away than he's looking to go.

Sure, there are TONS of great schools with amazing things to offer. No argument there.  I just like the fact that there are 10 schools in one league where my son can "get it all."

So, that's all I meant to say.  We've looked at a lot of schools, and there really aren't many that offer my kid as much as the NESCACs do.

There are levels within the nescac as well though too.  Williams and Amherst are by themselves at the top of the nescac in terms of admissions of non-athletes getting into the school.  After those two schools, Union is exactly the same as all the rest.  And I base that on my 15 years of educational experience with high school student/(athletes) applying to nescac schools, getting into nescac schools, and other schools like Union or Franklin and Marshall.

Not sure where you get your stats...admission rates:
Tufts 27%
Union 41%
F&M   47%

[nescac1]

Woops, forgot Tufts, which I'd put in the Middlebury group as well (Tufts is a university so harder to compare).  Tufts, Midd, Bowdoin, Wesleyan are schools with admissions rates around 20-25 percent and average SAT's close to or hitting 1400.  That's substantially different from liberal arts schools ranked below them.