FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[lumbercat]

Sorry about the digression on BC athletics, got carried away- this is the  NESCAC football board- my bad. I'm not a huge BC supporter but many in my family played at BC......I went to a different BC in Maine.

[NESCACFball24/7]

Does anybody know where Helbig and Lutz are going next year?

I know Diawara is going to Marist and Tomlinson is at UNH but haven't heard anything about the other two.

[The Mole]

Helbig Colorado State or Wake Forest

[lumbercat]

Williams should have never let Mike Whalen leave for his alma mater. Then they should have done everything they could to keep his OC. I really think with all the success Dick Farley and Whalen had they assumed it was a given that basically any HC would be successful because of some of the advantages that Williams has. If you take away the 9-0 year in 2021 with all those 5th year players, HC Mark Raymond is a woeful 20-23 in his 7 years. Whalen and Farley never lost more than 2 games in any year but one. Raymond has managed to do that 4 times in 7 years.

2016.      0-8
2017.      5-3
2018.      5-4
2019.      7-2
2020.        -
2021.      9-0
2022.      3-6

An improvement over Kellen yes but you get the feeling this guy is just milking that 9-0 year until the t*t is dry.

I don't think that's the case at all- when you see this years recruiting class in it's entirety I think you may call off the dogs on Raymond.

[Charlie]

Williams should have never let Mike Whalen leave for his alma mater. Then they should have done everything they could to keep his OC. I really think with all the success Dick Farley and Whalen had they assumed it was a given that basically any HC would be successful because of some of the advantages that Williams has. If you take away the 9-0 year in 2021 with all those 5th year players, HC Mark Raymond is a woeful 20-23 in his 7 years. Whalen and Farley never lost more than 2 games in any year but one. Raymond has managed to do that 4 times in 7 years.

2016.      0-8
2017.      5-3
2018.      5-4
2019.      7-2
2020.        -
2021.      9-0
2022.      3-6

An improvement over Kellen yes but you get the feeling this guy is just milking that 9-0 year until the t*t is dry.

I don't think that's the case at all- when you see this years recruiting class in it's entirety I think you may call off the dogs on Raymond.

I do know that at the Trinity game this last year Coach Raymond and Coaching staff of Williams were constantly berating the players. I undersand the heat of battle and all but the degrading comments were abusive. A high ranking Trinity official who was on their sideline heard the beratement all game and said " If I ever heard a Coach at Trinity speak to a player like that regardless of the Coach they would be fired after the game "

Again I get the heat of battle but I also know a player who starts on Williams and he has supported the fact that the coaches there constantly Chastise the players and expect them to be better than they are. In cases where the players make mistakes instead of showing them how to correct them they simply yell , berate or bench the players.

I think that Raymond is a decent Coach but this last year things certainly became unravelled. Curious to see what this recruiting class will bring and if any assistant coaches leave for other opportunities. I dont think a freshman class can have an immediate impact and after this year Williams will loose many key senior players on the team.

Hopefully williams can turn this around and stay competitive.

[LochNescac]

Williams should have never let Mike Whalen leave for his alma mater. Then they should have done everything they could to keep his OC. I really think with all the success Dick Farley and Whalen had they assumed it was a given that basically any HC would be successful because of some of the advantages that Williams has. If you take away the 9-0 year in 2021 with all those 5th year players, HC Mark Raymond is a woeful 20-23 in his 7 years. Whalen and Farley never lost more than 2 games in any year but one. Raymond has managed to do that 4 times in 7 years.

2016.      0-8
2017.      5-3
2018.      5-4
2019.      7-2
2020.        -
2021.      9-0
2022.      3-6

An improvement over Kellen yes but you get the feeling this guy is just milking that 9-0 year until the t*t is dry.

I don't think that's the case at all- when you see this years recruiting class in it's entirety I think you may call off the dogs on Raymond.

I do know that at the Trinity game this last year Coach Raymond and Coaching staff of Williams were constantly berating the players. I undersand the heat of battle and all but the degrading comments were abusive. A high ranking Trinity official who was on their sideline heard the beratement all game and said " If I ever heard a Coach at Trinity speak to a player like that regardless of the Coach they would be fired after the game "

Again I get the heat of battle but I also know a player who starts on Williams and he has supported the fact that the coaches there constantly Chastise the players and expect them to be better than they are. In cases where the players make mistakes instead of showing them how to correct them they simply yell , berate or bench the players.

I think that Raymond is a decent Coach but this last year things certainly became unravelled. Curious to see what this recruiting class will bring and if any assistant coaches leave for other opportunities. I dont think a freshman class can have an immediate impact and after this year Williams will loose many key senior players on the team.

Hopefully williams can turn this around and stay competitive.

Nope...they won't

[SpringSt7]

If you're gonna argue that a freshman class can not have an immediate impact, Mark Raymond and Williams is probably not going to be your best data point.

[lumbercat]

Charlie-

Typically after a 9-0 championship season there is need for restructuring especially at NESCAC venues other than Trinity.

I've observed Raymond and his sideline demeanor quite a few times. In 2021 I spent most of the game at Bates 25 feet from the Williams bench. I saw no trace of anything like the "abuse" you are alleging. To the contrary I remember thinking how organized, controlled and calm the Willaims team and staff were.
I also wandered about this year in Willytown and saw nothing abusive, no berating of players.

"A HIGH RANKING TRINITY OFFICIAL was on the Williams sideline"....... I doubt it.

I also know players and coaches from Raymond's stint at St Lawrence, that's never been his MO. If he's abusing players it's new to me.

Over the years I've watched many visiting coaches and their sideline demeanor at Garcelon Field with provides great proximity to the field. You can literally stand 25 feet from the visitors bench. You learn quite a bit about NESCAC programs, cultures and coaches watching things close up in a game situation.

No one is tougher on players and staff than Devanney but the most torqued up guy on game day is Hammer at Bowdoin, over the top.

At the end of the day Coaches do yell and push players hard but I don't buy allegations of abusive behavior at Williams by Raymond.

[Scoops]

 I'm no Williams honk, but how can you say he's "milking it" after one year? Granted, I don't think Williams will be very good this year either, but I think it's a little early to throw out something like that. Maybe hold that hot take for little longer?

Williams should have never let Mike Whalen leave for his alma mater. Then they should have done everything they could to keep his OC. I really think with all the success Dick Farley and Whalen had they assumed it was a given that basically any HC would be successful because of some of the advantages that Williams has. If you take away the 9-0 year in 2021 with all those 5th year players, HC Mark Raymond is a woeful 20-23 in his 7 years. Whalen and Farley never lost more than 2 games in any year but one. Raymond has managed to do that 4 times in 7 years.

2016.      0-8
2017.      5-3
2018.      5-4
2019.      7-2
2020.        -
2022.      3-6

An improvement over Kellen yes but you get the feeling this guy is just milking that 9-0 year until the t*t is dry.

[nescac1]

First of all, Johnny, you shortchanged Raymond a win in his second year.  Second, the logical year to drop is 2016, when Raymond inherited an absolutely putrid roster which had won a total of six games in the prior three years, and which Nick Saban himself couldn't have won games with. Then, in 2017, Raymond won as many games as Kelton won COMBINED in his last three seasons!  Just randomly eliminating the best season out of a only a six year coaching record makes zero sense, by the way, unless you were say eliminating 2010 for Kelton, since he inherited the polar opposite of what Raymond did before blowing it up. 

Once he was working with at least one full class of his own recruits, Raymond went 30-15.  Virtually the same by the way as Midd and Wes, both 31-14 over the same time period (with a lot more veteran talent in the early years).  Were those coaches failures too?  Now the ultimate benchmark for Raymond is of course Amherst.  He's 4-1 in his last five years v. Amherst, which has gone 26-19 total over that period.  Every Eph fan is certainly happy with that. 

Trinity had been by far the best team in the league over the past five seasons, with only 7 total losses.  But guess what?  Three of those have been to Williams, which has a 3-2 record vs Trinity in the last five games despite having far less cumulative talent over that time period. 

When you consider what he inherited, Raymond has been the second best coach in Nescac since he was hired.  And Williams will never under any coach get recruiting classes of the size and depth Trinity brings in - they are working with nearly double the number of recruits some years!   He's done a heck of a job.  Really, the team has only underachieved in one season, last year. (2018 was a bummer relative to expectations but that team was brutalized by injuries to critical guys and still had zero depth due to the incredibly small roster Raymond inherited). 

It does seem like the Ephs have a loaded class coming in so I think the team is once again trending up, depending on how fast the new skill guys can acclimate. But even if Williams were to have another 3-6 sort of season - hopefully not - while the team rebuilds, Raymond's track record would still be stellar. 

[LochNescac]

Where y'all seeing the classes?   

Social media postings, or have some schools released more official info?

Just trying to get educated on who's headed to campus...

[lumbercat]

NESCAC schools are allowed to release recruiting results after 5/1 though the Ephs typically disclose little information even after that date. Usually less than other NESCAC schools.
I believe NESCAC 1 has posted a partial list on this site a few weeks back which will give you an idea of some Eph recruits coming in.

[Johnny Eph]

Damn I did not mean to start a whole thing. I actually had to post because I am supposed to be "gathering information " for another "game" that has been going on for what seems like an eternity and against "unknown competition". The only way I could rule out HC Raymond was to give a bit of an elbow but I was just joshin' and it was not meant to be taken seriously.

I actually have heard he is a pretty good HC. Still 2023 will be a big year for Williams. FWIW I think I did actually learn something. I apologize and will delete the post.

As far as sideline demeanor I went to a couple home  games last year and Raymond seemed pretty calm as far as I can tell. I have heard around town that his players like him and respect him and have seen that first hand.

[NESCACFball24/7]

Tufts class so far(missing a few, was told they are bringing in 25-30 kids):
Only 2 Mass kids.
James Thom-OL - Darien (CT)
Harry Lynch - DL - Lawrenceville (NJ)
Aidan Heaney- RB- Old Tappan(NJ)
Ty Richardson-DB- Menlo school(CA)
Noah Gravel- LB- Baylor School(TN)
Lloyd Walter-LB/S- Aragon(CA)
Alan Young- DB- Montgomery Bell(TN)
Matt Greco-WR- Marin Catholic(CA)
Markeis Batiste- OLB- Madison Prep(LA)
Justin Keller-QB-Ridgefield(CT)
Christian Shapiro-RB- John Jay(NY)
Eli Mcelwaney-TE-Buford(GA)
Oliver Evans-DB-Cardinal Gibbons(NC)
Justin Slabaugh-DL-Delbarton(NJ)
Johnny Ferrelli- LB Berkley Prep (FL)
Parker Scott-OLB-Zachary(LA)
Rohan Terrell-ATH-Bunnell(CT)
Riley Yaker-OLB-Lakeridge(OR)
Ian Miller-OL-Williston(VA)
Charlie Kremin-OL-Evanston(IL)
Will Astorino-LB-King Philip(MA)
Gabe Fitzgerald-TE-Brooks(MA)
Caden Lawlor-K-Seattle Prep(WA)

[nescac1]

Here is the most updated Williams list, which seems heavy on potential impact skill guys.  Very different approach from Tufts, as nearly all the recruits are local (New England or NY) with from CA thrown in as well.  Since Raymond typically brings in around 20 guys, I imagine there are few if any missing at this point:

Luke Thorbahn, 5'9 185 RB/WR, Avon Old Farms
Wyatt Cotton, WR/RB, St. Mary's (MD)
Holden Gering, 5'10 WR/CB/ATH, Crespi Carmelite (CA)
Ethan Shames, 6'3, 280 C, Avon Old Farms
Austin Bongo, 6'3, 215 ATH, Hull H.S.
Will Robke, 6'3, 285 OL/DL, Barnstable
Brady Carroll, 6'2 185 QB/ATH, Sandwich
Brian Ingram, 6'3, 290 OL/DL, Hun School
Drew Renzella, 6'2, 200 QB, Williston
Jack Barber, 6'5, 240 DE, Darien
Christian Reavis, 6'1, 200 LB, Deerfield
Nate Dlugos, 6'2 180 ATH, Greensburg Central Catholic
Jack Kennedy, 5'9 185, WR Cheshire Academy
Nathan Rodi, 6' 210 LB/RB, Pittsford (NY)
Leonardo Maiulolo, 5'8 165 P/K, Saint Francis (CA)
Will Baker, 6'4 220 QB, Cohasset
Owen Johansen, 6'2 212 QB/LB/ATH, Northport (NY)
Owen McHugh, 6'0 182, QB/S, Milton
Jon Marvan, 6'2 225 RB/LB, Choate
Teddy Holland, 6'3 235 DE/LB/TE, Cardinal Hayes (NY)
Brady Stahelski, 6'4 190 WR, Deerfield