FB: New England Small College Athletic Conference

[Back2BackBantam]

Curious to hear other's thoughts on Fetter being named New England DII-DIII Player of the Year, but the Nescac coaches voting on him to share the title with Richardson. Kind of weird how he can be voted as the best player in all of New England DII and DIII but not even voted solely as such in his own conference if you ask me (which no one did).

[Nescacman]

Chaz and cardiacEph should host a nescac podcast-some real innovative football minds there guessing neither played a lick of meaningful football.

Interesting coaching news forthcoming from the Liberty league to an Ivy opening. Will be interesting to see if any nescac coordinators will be in mix for that LL opening.

We heard the same news KAT and it is interesting. Good for that HCOF. He deserves the shot. It will be interesting to see who moves into the LL HCOF spot and the impact it has on the potential Colby HCOF opening.

[GroundandPound]

While it is indisputable that Trinity's offense was the best in the NESCAC in 2023, I believe that the best defense in the NESCAC in 2023 was actually Middlebury's defense.
I believe the most significant and relevant measurement of the quality and performance of a  defense is the average points allowed per game.  Yes, Trinity's defense did allow the fewest points per game 12.8 compared to Middlebury's 13.4 points per game. You may be saying whoa... https://nescac.com/stats.aspx?path=football&year=2023 states 15.0 points per game.  Remember, however, Middlebury's offense allowed two touchdowns based on turnovers.  Hence, Middlebury's defense only allowed 13.4 points per game.  If Trinity's offense allowed any turnover touchdowns, let me know, and I will adjust this number to accurately reflect the points their defense actually allowed.  So, you may ask, if Trinity's defense allowed 12.8 points per game, and Middlebury's defense allowed .6 of a point more per game and you think the most significant measurement of a defense is how many points per game allowed, why on earth do you think Middlebury's defense was better than Trinity's defense in 2023?  I believe if you look under those important numbers, you will find two reasons that may convince you Middlebury's defense was actually the NESCAC's best in in 2023. 

First, Middlebury's offense committed 21 turnovers and Trinity's offense only committed 9 turnovers which is 11thn in all of D3. https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/d3/current/team/461
This means that Middlebury's defense faced 12 more possessions than Trinity's defense due to offensive turnovers, and yet still only allowed .6 of a point more per game.  Second, Middlebury's offense only possessed the ball for 26 minutes per game (the lowest in the NESCAC) and Trinity's offense possessed the ball for 32 minutes per game, second in the NESCAC after Bowdoin. https://nescac.com/stats.aspx?path=football&year=2023  Thus, Middlebury's defense was on the field a whopping six minutes more per game than Trinity's defense, and still only allowed .6 of a point more per game than Trinity's defense.   This my fellow NESCAC fans is why I believe Middlebury's defense was the best defense in the NESCAC in 2023.   One variable that may affect my opinion (which is worth what you paid for it) is how many points were scored against Trinity in the fourth quarter when mostly backups were playing on Trinity's defense.  In case you were wondering, Trinity's defense forced 27 turnovers. 20 of which were interceptions, and Middlebury's defense forced 22 turnovers, 13 of which were interceptions.  I think some of the credit for Trinity's higher number of interceptions belongs to Trinity's beastly offense because they got ahead early and significantly in most games, and forced teams to pass more to try and catch up, which leads to more interceptions.  Feel free to disagree, but for now I believe Middlebury's defense was the best defense in the NESCAC in 2023.  How many feathers did I rustle?

[Nescacman]

Congratulations to Eph alum Union HCOF Poppe getting the Columbia job...great step up by him...will be interesting to see who gets the Dutchmen HCOF spot...also interesting to see how this impacts the NESCAC coaching ranks...Big Kat was on this as well.

[lumbercat]

Norwich HC job opened up too.

[lumbercat]

Curious to hear other's thoughts on Fetter being named New England DII-DIII Player of the Year, but the Nescac coaches voting on him to share the title with Richardson. Kind of weird how he can be voted as the best player in all of New England DII and DIII but not even voted solely as such in his own conference if you ask me (which no one did).

Wow- curious.
NM alluded to some ill feelings in the ranks.

[TheFlock]

Excellent points by G&P, but then you also have to take into account how many teams left their starters in and scored on the Trinity Defense's 3rd string and First Years.  In fact the Co-OPOTY was racking up his stats against 3rd stringers. I'd be curious if anyone knows how many TD's were given up by Trinity in this unbalanced manner.  I also saw a post that Trinity is the only team in College Football (all levels) to give up 0 rushing TD's the whole season.  We all must admit that this is pretty impressive.

[Nescacman]

Really interesting to see how many FBS and FCS offers Richardson has received so far (15+). Obviously, talented kid but we're sure the 2023 success of Tomlinson and Lutz in the CAA this year has something to do with the interest Richardson is receiving.

As an aside, not sure we've seen anything here on this but Donovan Wood has also entered the transfer portal. Seems like the NESCAC is officially a WR "factory". Who's next, Sean Clapp?

[Back2BackBantam]

Excellent points by G&P, but then you also have to take into account how many teams left their starters in and scored on the Trinity Defense's 3rd string and First Years.  In fact the Co-OPOTY was racking up his stats against 3rd stringers. I'd be curious if anyone knows how many TD's were given up by Trinity in this unbalanced manner.  I also saw a post that Trinity is the only team in College Football (all levels) to give up 0 rushing TD's the whole season.  We all must admit that this is pretty impressive.

I can say with some confidence that 33 of the 115 points allowed by Trinity this year were allowed once the starter was pulled (another 6 were on a blocked punt), which would bring that total of 115 down to 76 points total, divided by the 9 games would be 8.4 ppg allowed by Trinity's starting rotation. Obviously, the same math can be done for Middlebury's defense to a somewhat lesser extent.

However, I would like to argue G&P's conclusion of Middlebury having the better defense in other ways. First off, the Trinity defense allowed nearly 100 less yards per game than the Pant's, and sported a 36% RZ Def compared to Middlebury's 53%.  Trinity also allowed merely 2.3 yards per carry on the ground compared to Midd's 3.3, and as stated, 0 total rushing TDs on the year. As for G&P's ToP argument, I wish there were a stat for number of 3 & out's produced by a defense. I think that would be a manor factor in that statistic.

Another interesting stat is that Midd opponents had the most penalties called against them in the league, compared to Trin having the second least opponent penalties. Similarly, Trin was called for the second most in the league whereas Midd was called for the 3rd least. Now, some say this is discipline or skill based, others may call it luck or just simply NESCAC refereeing. I simply just found it to be an interesting stat, especially that of the penalties against.

Either way, I think it would be very nitpicky and would require a whole lot of explaining and reasoning to argue that Midd has the best defense in the conference this year, especially when nearly every single defensive stat would say otherwise.

[LochNescac]

Really interesting to see how many FBS and FCS offers Richardson has received so far (15+). Obviously, talented kid but we're sure the 2023 success of Tomlinson and Lutz in the CAA this year has something to do with the interest Richardson is receiving.

As an aside, not sure we've seen anything here on this but Donovan Wood has also entered the transfer portal. Seems like the NESCAC is officially a WR "factory". Who's next, Sean Clapp?

Richardson is GOOD...it looks like FBS/FCS programs agree....

[GroundandPound]

B2BBantam, Thank you for your informative input.  As I mentioned, there was one variable that may affect my opinion which was how many points were scored against Trinity in the fourth quarter when the majority of players on the defense were back-ups.  Assuming your number of 33 points were given up by the defense with the majority of players as back-ups is accurate, and 7 points came from a blocked punt (which should not be attributed to points allowed by Trinity's defense) then Trinity's starting defense allowed about 115-40= 75 points which is 8.3 points per game compared to Middlebury's 13.4 points per game.  There were no games where Middlebury gave up points with mostly back ups in on defense. Therefore, it appears Trinity's starting defense allowed 5 points fewer per game than Middlebury's starting defense. 

You made a solid point that time of possession is not solely controlled by the offense and that a defense plays a roll on this stat by creating more three and outs.  What is the likely point impact of 11 fewer possessions faced by Trinity's defense compared with Middlebury's defense resulting from more offensive turnovers by Middlebury's offense than Trinity's offense?  I do not know, but doubt that it is close to 5 points a game.  My opinion now, assuming your stat that about 33 points were given up in the fourth quarter by a Trinity defense with mostly back-ups playing is accurate, is that Trinity had a slightly better defense than Middlebury. 

With respect to your argument that yards allowed, or average yards per play, or redzone percentage favored Trinity, that is true, but most would agree those stats are practically meaningless in judging a defense compared with points allowed.  Why?  Because points win or lose games, not yards or average yards per play.  I believe almost all of us would want a defense that gives up 10 points per game and 400 yards per game over a defense that yields 12 or 15 points per game and 200 yards per game.   

[GroundandPound]

https://twitter.com/Jaden_Rich5
JMU and Wisconsin offers

[Charlie]

Curious to hear other's thoughts on Fetter being named New England DII-DIII Player of the Year, but the Nescac coaches voting on him to share the title with Richardson. Kind of weird how he can be voted as the best player in all of New England DII and DIII but not even voted solely as such in his own conference if you ask me (which no one did).

Crazy football is decided between the sidelines and performance based. So are you telling me that Peyton Manning yelling at players and Tom Brady yelling at his players and Coaches means they were not MVP. Absurd that these Coaches let feelings instead of facts cloud there judgement. Hands down best player in NESCAC.

[Charlie]

B2BBantam, Thank you for your informative input.  As I mentioned, there was one variable that may affect my opinion which was how many points were scored against Trinity in the fourth quarter when the majority of players on the defense were back-ups.  Assuming your number of 33 points were given up by the defense with the majority of players as back-ups is accurate, and 7 points came from a blocked punt (which should not be attributed to points allowed by Trinity's defense) then Trinity's starting defense allowed about 115-40= 75 points which is 8.3 points per game compared to Middlebury's 13.4 points per game.  There were no games where Middlebury gave up points with mostly back ups in on defense. Therefore, it appears Trinity's starting defense allowed 5 points fewer per game than Middlebury's starting defense. 

You made a solid point that time of possession is not solely controlled by the offense and that a defense plays a roll on this stat by creating more three and outs.  What is the likely point impact of 11 fewer possessions faced by Trinity's defense compared with Middlebury's defense resulting from more offensive turnovers by Middlebury's offense than Trinity's offense?  I do not know, but doubt that it is close to 5 points a game.  My opinion now, assuming your stat that about 33 points were given up in the fourth quarter by a Trinity defense with mostly back-ups playing is accurate, is that Trinity had a slightly better defense than Middlebury. 

With respect to your argument that yards allowed, or average yards per play, or redzone percentage favored Trinity, that is true, but most would agree those stats are practically meaningless in judging a defense compared with points allowed.  Why?  Because points win or lose games, not yards or average yards per play.  I believe almost all of us would want a defense that gives up 10 points per game and 400 yards per game over a defense that yields 12 or 15 points per game and 200 yards per game.   

Let's face facts Middlebury should have lost to Williams this year. If Williams had any type of in game Coaching they would have won this game. This would all be a moot point if Williams had better coaching.

In the Trinity game Trinity marched up and down the field and lost the game on Offensive play calling and better Coaching maneuvers by Middlebury simple as that. If Trinity scored this would all be academic but the Coaching blunder at the end of the game has caused this situation. This is why Middlebury HC got the Coaching of the year award. Now I am not taking anything away from Middlebury. Despite what I just stated they found ways to win games and made the plays with a little luck at the end of games. The fact that they lost to a Wesleyan team that Trinity blew put by 50 point speaks volumes.

Any person who has any football acumen knows that they last play of the game was a blunder on Trinity's part uncharacteristic of this program. Middleburys game plan was smart and Trinity's was not. Despite the tactical blunders by Trinity the game was still close and they should have won. Having said all that Trinity's dominance in the NESCAC this year is unparalleled. But they were the best team on paper and while it stinks the league has Co champions so be it. But you cannot say that Trinity was not the most dominant statistical program in every category in the NESCAC.

[TheSecondBrother]

Excellent points by G&P, but then you also have to take into account how many teams left their starters in and scored on the Trinity Defense's 3rd string and First Years.  In fact the Co-OPOTY was racking up his stats against 3rd stringers. I'd be curious if anyone knows how many TD's were given up by Trinity in this unbalanced manner.  I also saw a post that Trinity is the only team in College Football (all levels) to give up 0 rushing TD's the whole season.  We all must admit that this is pretty impressive.

I can say with some confidence that 33 of the 115 points allowed by Trinity this year were allowed once the starter was pulled (another 6 were on a blocked punt), which would bring that total of 115 down to 76 points total, divided by the 9 games would be 8.4 ppg allowed by Trinity's starting rotation. Obviously, the same math can be done for Middlebury's defense to a somewhat lesser extent.

However, I would like to argue G&P's conclusion of Middlebury having the better defense in other ways. First off, the Trinity defense allowed nearly 100 less yards per game than the Pant's, and sported a 36% RZ Def compared to Middlebury's 53%.  Trinity also allowed merely 2.3 yards per carry on the ground compared to Midd's 3.3, and as stated, 0 total rushing TDs on the year. As for G&P's ToP argument, I wish there were a stat for number of 3 & out's produced by a defense. I think that would be a manor factor in that statistic.

Another interesting stat is that Midd opponents had the most penalties called against them in the league, compared to Trin having the second least opponent penalties. Similarly, Trin was called for the second most in the league whereas Midd was called for the 3rd least. Now, some say this is discipline or skill based, others may call it luck or just simply NESCAC refereeing. I simply just found it to be an interesting stat, especially that of the penalties against.

Either way, I think it would be very nitpicky and would require a whole lot of explaining and reasoning to argue that Midd has the best defense in the conference this year, especially when nearly every single defensive stat would say otherwise.

If football games were played on paper, Trinity would be outright champs. Unfortunately for Trinity, they are not. I believe an important point to consider this that Middlebury's defense won them games. When the pressure was on and Middlebury needed a play, the defense made the plays that needed to happen. To Trinity's credit, in all but one game their offense was able to put teams away to the point where they did not need to rely on their defense. However, in the one game Trinity's offense needed their counterpart to get a stop, what happened... Trinity let up a 68-yard double move for the go-ahead touchdown. The next drive when Middlebury needed a stop, they picked off the OPOY. Bad call or not, when Middlebury needed a stop on the one-yard line, they got it. When Middlebury was up by two points against Tufts, with their third-string quarterback, and needed a stop, they forced a fumble. When Tufts got the ball AGAIN later in that game, Middlebury came away with a pick-six to win the game. In the Williams game, which Charlie says the Panthers should have lost, Middlebury's defense held Williams to 1 passing yard and 3 points, in a game where Middlebury gave up SEVEN turnovers. Statistically, Trinity may have had a better season, but when the bullets were flying Middlebury's defense made plays to win them games, and eventually the NESCAC championship. On another note, the Offense that was undeniably the best in the league this year was held to ZERO touchdowns against Middlebury. I don't think people talk about that feat enough, the offense that everyone has unanimously hailed as one of the best we have seen in recent memory in the NESCAC did not find the endzone against Middlebury's defense. When we look back on this season, whose defense will we talk about?