Posters' Poll

[Mr. Ypsi]

Still a disappointing nine ballots.  I'll begin typing up the results in about an hour unless I hear from anyone.

[Mr. Ypsi]

It's just nine.
That's NOT fine.

(Sorry 'bout that! )

1.  Midd       221 (1,1,1,1,1,1,1,3,3)
2.  Hope       215 (1,1,2,2,2,2,2,3,4)
3.  UWW       193 (2,3,4,4,5,5,5,6,7)
4.  MIT         172 (3,4,4,4,5,5,7,7,23)
t5. VaWes     168 (2,3,3,3,4,6,7,12,-)
t5. Amherst    168 (5,5,5,6,6,6,9,9,15)
7.  Whitworth  150 (5,6,7,8,9,10,12,13,14)
8.  UMHB        149 (3,6,6,7,8,9,10,11.25)
9.  CMS          135 (2,8,8,9,10,10,11,15,-)
10. UWSP        126 (2,7,9,10,10,13,14,17,-)
11. F & M        120 (8,8,8,11,11,12,14,16,-)
12. Cabrini       110 (7,8,9,9,13,13,15,24,-)
13. NYU            99 (10,11,11,14,16,16,18,19,20)
14. WashU        76 (4,11,15,15,17,19,25,-,-)
15. Wooster      74 (12,13,16,16,17,19,20,21,-)
16. Augie          71 (10,14,15,15,19,19,19,-,-)
17. IWU            69 (7,12,18,18,19,20,21,24,-)
18. Emory          59 (12,12,14,19,20,22,24,-,-)
19. Transy         54 (11,16,17,21,21,22,22,24,-)
t20 Lake Forest   50 (8,9,17,20,-,-,-,-,-)
t20 Williams        50 (11,14,18,20,21,22,-,-,-)
t22 Birm-S          46 (10,12,13,25,25,25,-,-,-)
t22 Grinnell          46 (4,14,17,23,-,-,-,-,-)
24. UWRF            44 (6,13,15,-,-,-,-,-,-)
25. RIC               40 (12,16,17,22,23,-,-,-,-)

26. Wheaton        39 (15,18,20,20,21,23)
27. Witt              37 (16,18,18,21,23,23)
28. Willy Pat        28 (16,18,20,22)
29. E. Conn         26 (13,14,25)
30. Randy Mac     20 (21,22,23,23,24,24,25)
t31 OWU             13 (19,22,24)
t31 WPI              13 (13)
33. Keene St.       10 (17,25)
34. Oswego          9 (17)
35. Lycoming        8 (18)
36. Albertus Magnus  6 (22,25,25)
t37 Keystone        5 (23,24)
t37 St. Joseph's    5 (21)
39. Hanover         2 (24)
40. NCC               1

[Mr. Ypsi]

Since the whole point of PP is stimulating conversation, I'll commence.

While I can't even comprehend not having Va Wes in the top 25 (or top 5, for that matter ), the voter who left them off entirely has already explained himself.

CMS and UWSP are interesting - 7 of 9 voters placed them reasonably near where they ended, but each had a #2 and was left entirely off a ballot: would the 'extremes' care to justify their votes?

I just don't understand Birmingham-Southern.  Before the 'official' poll came out, I had them #10 (the 'real' poll had them #11).  I KNOW the SCAC is weak (and now weaker with DePauw bolting to the NCAC), but still ...!  3 high votes, 3 #25s, and 3 NVs?

To me, at least, #26 Wheaton, #27 Witt, and (especially) #30 Randy Mac are more worthy of top 25 status (having 6, 6, and 7 votes) than #24 UWRF, and t20 Lake Forest and t22 Grinnell (with 3, 4, and 4 votes).  The hazards of such a small voting population (hint, hint!).

And NUMBER FOUR votes for WashU and Grinnell - can I get some of what you're smoking?!

Just for the record, though I bleed green, I was the #24 voter for IWU!  Thanks, guys, and I hope they do well in the tourney, but right now they are NOT #17!  (I reserve the right to change my mind if they upset Augie in Rock Island tonight! )

[augie_superfan]

I didn't vote for Birmingham-Southern.  I'm sure the reason for such a wide spread on them is that they've played pretty much no one. Just glancing at the schedule, I don't see a team that I'd even consider top 75.  So beating all those teams is good, but in my book, it only proves they are above the top 75. (For the record, I have them checking in at #34 in my extended rankings)

I do agree that more voters would smooth out some things with a few high rankings pushing teams up higher.  I'm guilty of that with UWRF and my #15 ranking.  I actually had them #16 last week and with all the attrition, I found them quickly moving towards the top 10.  Eventhough I think they have that capability, I had to hold them back.  I think they are clearly talented enough to be a top 25 team though.  I wasn't too comfortable with the #15 ranking but I feel after my top 10, it's pretty even between the next 25 teams or so.  Hopefully the parity will bring about a fun tournament this year.

The one team I am a lone wolf on is Cabrini (I left them off my ballot...unoficially #32).  Just like B-S, their only loss on the year is to an above average Centre team.  They haven't played a tough schedule either but they do play a lot of conference games so I guess I can't fault them too much.  They had a decent non-conference win last night against Eastern so maybe they will creep in to my top 25 next week.

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

Since the whole point of PP is stimulating conversation, I'll commence.

While I can't even comprehend not having Va Wes in the top 25 (or top 5, for that matter ), the voter who left them off entirely has already explained himself.

CMS and UWSP are interesting - 7 of 9 voters placed them reasonably near where they ended, but each had a #2 and was left entirely off a ballot: would the 'extremes' care to justify their votes?

CMS #2 from me. They've lost one game which was on the road in 2ot. Since they're a west coast school they get a little bit of a break in terms of looking at opponents. Maybe people are keeping them lower because 4 of their wins were non-D3 opponents.

I just don't understand Birmingham-Southern.  Before the 'official' poll came out, I had them #10 (the 'real' poll had them #11).  I KNOW the SCAC is weak (and now weaker with DePauw bolting to the NCAC), but still ...!  3 high votes, 3 #25s, and 3 NVs?

To me, at least, #26 Wheaton, #27 Witt, and (especially) #30 Randy Mac are more worthy of top 25 status (having 6, 6, and 7 votes) than #24 UWRF, and t20 Lake Forest and t22 Grinnell (with 3, 4, and 4 votes).  The hazards of such a small voting population (hint, hint!).

And NUMBER FOUR votes for WashU and Grinnell - can I get some of what you're smoking?!

Looking at Grinnell's schedule 4th may be a tad high. We'll see where I move them next week. I had them 11th in the first poll and the teams ahead of them kept losing and falling below them. But come on... 6 people have Birmingham Southern in the top 25 (I finally slipped them in at 25) but only 4 have Grinnell? Unless I'm missing something, I just can't see how I should put BSU ahead of Grinnell. Both have just one loss and Grinnell has at least played a couple good teams.

Just for the record, though I bleed green, I was the #24 voter for IWU!  Thanks, guys, and I hope they do well in the tourney, but right now they are NOT #17!  (I reserve the right to change my mind if they upset Augie in Rock Island tonight! )

I dropped them from 14th to 18th this week. I initially dropped them about 5 spots further, but I couldn't find enough teams to be ahead of them so I had to move them back up.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Re: IWU.  Gonna have to think this one further!  I had Augie 15th; AT Augie, IWU went to OT before losing by 2.  Maybe you guys are right and they ARE 17th!

[Mr. Ypsi]

BTW, if the committee keeps to its usual 'West Coast' island, looks like a heckuva 1st or 2nd round game: CMS and Whitworth have been neck-and-neck in both our poll and the 'real' poll!

[frodotwo]

This is one of the tougher years for ranking that I can remember. SO many 1 or 2 loss teams. Problem with those are that many have played no one. I've seen more UWSP games, but have watched a number of other teams via streaming video and it is tough to slot some of them. (I even watched Berry beat Rust last week - just to see if M. Wilson is a AA - not really in my opinion). I've used a couple of different systems for info (D3 BB index and Massey) for SOS and the like. It was tough to slot some teams that have played very weak schedules - Midd - MIT - Cabrini - F&M - all have gaudy records against schedules in the bottom third for SOS. But.....they keep winning while other teams lose. Other teams in strong conferences keep beating each other up (UAA - CCIW - WIAC - NWC).

So I guess I penalize those stronger teams for losing against quality opponents more than I should, while rewarding those that haven't really been challenged, but still win.  My 7-11 are MIT - Cabrini - MHB -CMS - F&M and all could easily be 15-19. Is one loss MIT better than 4 loss Augie? I don't necessarily think so but Augie losing 3 in a row made it tough to keep them ahead of the pack.

[sac]

I wasn't able to vote this week but I'm not sure my votes would have changed much.  I do think Witt is underrated, and I would not and have not voted for Cabrini or Birm-Southern, plus I've had F&M low in my polls each week.

[Ralph Turner]

My Top 25 was more consonant with the big poll than the Posters' Poll.

I have Augie at #10 which may be too high, but I like them better at #10 than the next 7-8 teams!
I have UWSP at #7 but for the same reason as Augie.  The WIAC produces!  UWRF is a reach for me, and so they are on my watch list.

I have Williams at #11, but they lost to 2 Top 10 teams this week!

UMHB is that good.  Just remember that they will go on the road for the Sweet 16 with only 1 in-region loss!  IMHO, flying to "elsewhere" in D-III is a 7 point handicap, regardless!

I have to put BSC, Cabrini and F&M in there somewhere, so they are in the mid-teens.  I think that F&M always has the easiest road to the Final Four.  There are so many conferences in their vicinity, that they may only see 1 quality team in their bracket of 16!  IMHO all the other brackets usually include 3-4 quality teams and there may be as many as 11 quality teams in the Bracket of Death in WIAC/CCIW country.

[KnightSlappy]

I have no idea what to make of the Little East. One day it seems like they all must be overrated, but then they knock off Middlebury.

[stag44]

BTW, if the committee keeps to its usual 'West Coast' island, looks like a heckuva 1st or 2nd round game: CMS and Whitworth have been neck-and-neck in both our poll and the 'real' poll!

It sure is looking that way - Maybe they are able to get the TX, and MN teams in together in a 4 team pod, but it may very well be a SCIAC-NWC showdown. What would be interesting is if both WW and CMS lose in their conference tourneys but get At-Large bids- would that cause a SCIAC and NWC first round match up, or would they group all 4 together in a pod and cross them?

Its all hearsay right now - they both still have lots of games to take care of to even get a bid!

[KnightSlappy]

Since the whole point of PP is stimulating conversation, I'll commence.

While I can't even comprehend not having Va Wes in the top 25 (or top 5, for that matter ), the voter who left them off entirely has already explained himself.

CMS and UWSP are interesting - 7 of 9 voters placed them reasonably near where they ended, but each had a #2 and was left entirely off a ballot: would the 'extremes' care to justify their votes?

I just don't understand Birmingham-Southern.  Before the 'official' poll came out, I had them #10 (the 'real' poll had them #11).  I KNOW the SCAC is weak (and now weaker with DePauw bolting to the NCAC), but still ...!  3 high votes, 3 #25s, and 3 NVs?

To me, at least, #26 Wheaton, #27 Witt, and (especially) #30 Randy Mac are more worthy of top 25 status (having 6, 6, and 7 votes) than #24 UWRF, and t20 Lake Forest and t22 Grinnell (with 3, 4, and 4 votes).  The hazards of such a small voting population (hint, hint!).

And NUMBER FOUR votes for WashU and Grinnell - can I get some of what you're smoking?!

Just for the record, though I bleed green, I was the #24 voter for IWU!  Thanks, guys, and I hope they do well in the tourney, but right now they are NOT #17!  (I reserve the right to change my mind if they upset Augie in Rock Island tonight! )

On Wash U: they've played 18 D3 games, and only three have been against teams that are sub-.500
On Virginia Wesleyan: They've played 19 D3 games, and 11 have been against teams that are sub-.500

[smedindy]

I do think Witt is underrated, for sure. And I can't say OWU and Wabash and DePauw are worse than they were a couple of weeks ago. They just keep beating on each other.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I'm in.  Glad I didn't vote for Grinnell last week.  Hartwick was my #26 this week; they're destined to lose.