Posters' Poll

[KnightSlappy]

t31 Calvin            7 (19)

http://miaa.org/sports/mbkb/2013-14/index

To put it bluntly - I have a hard time accepting any votes from someone who made this selection.  I do understand the rigors of participating (I have done it myself in the past) but seriously???  Is this a vote for who are the best 25 teams in the country (based on their actual performance) or is it simply who the voter likes best? 

And please know this is not about Hope receiving no votes.  I totally understand peoples reluctance to vote for a team with that many losses (although I bet we could have a wonderful debate about their potential ranking with that lofty SOS).

It should be noted that I didn't turn in a ballot. So it probably wasn't a 'Calvin fan' homer pick (I'm not aware of any other Calvin fans who have been voting).

But, yes, thank you sac for linking to the standings to point out that, at 18-5, Calvin has the best record of any MIAA school. 

[smedindy]

Calvin is #34 in Massey. So it's not a huge outlier...

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I was keeping Calvin in the running for a while; they are clearly the most impressive MIAA team this year.  Then they got walloped by Hope, who is not good this year.  That sealed the deal for me.  I could see someone closer to the situation making a more detailed determination on it.

Quite frankly, I'm not surprised by any school people rank below about 12 or 15.  There are just no great candidates and so many borderline ones this year.

[Titan Q]

I was keeping Calvin in the running for a while; they are clearly the most impressive MIAA team this year.  Then they got walloped by Hope, who is not good this year.  That sealed the deal for me.  I could see someone closer to the situation making a more detailed determination on it.

I feel like Hope is a Top 25 team...somewhere between 20-25.

If Hope had Cabrini's schedule, they're be ranked about #3 right now and everyone would think they're awesome.

[KnightSlappy]

I was keeping Calvin in the running for a while; they are clearly the most impressive MIAA team this year.  Then they got walloped by Hope, who is not good this year.  That sealed the deal for me.  I could see someone closer to the situation making a more detailed determination on it.

Quite frankly, I'm not surprised by any school people rank below about 12 or 15.  There are just no great candidates and so many borderline ones this year.

I think you're begging the question here. Hope being "not good this year" is a statement that should be backed up by evidence. They've won 16 of their last 18, including wins over Calvin (2), Carthage, and Centre (and only one of those was at home).

[smedindy]

I feel like Hope is a Top 25 team...somewhere between 20-25.

If Hope had Cabrini's schedule, they're be ranked about #3 right now and everyone would think they're awesome.
[/quote]

The power numbers wouldn't fib, though. Cabrini is 17 and Hope is 23 in Massey. So, yeah, practically even steven.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

I feel like Hope is a Top 25 team...somewhere between 20-25.

If Hope had Cabrini's schedule, they're be ranked about #3 right now and everyone would think they're awesome.

The power numbers wouldn't fib, though. Cabrini is 17 and Hope is 23 in Massey. So, yeah, practically even steven.

Massey SOS

Hope - 11
Cabrini - 183

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I was keeping Calvin in the running for a while; they are clearly the most impressive MIAA team this year.  Then they got walloped by Hope, who is not good this year.  That sealed the deal for me.  I could see someone closer to the situation making a more detailed determination on it.

I feel like Hope is a Top 25 team...somewhere between 20-25.

If Hope had Cabrini's schedule, they're be ranked about #3 right now and everyone would think they're awesome.

I'm not convinced Cabrini is a good team.  I've watched them play more over the last three or four years than any other school.  Yes, the have quite possibly the best player in the country, but that team does not look good.  You watch them on the floor and they're fearless and aggressive, but they don't appear overly talented.  They just seem to keep winning.

I sort of think about teams with the question, "All things being equal (in terms of bracket positioning and strength of opponents), would I expect these teams to make the second weekend?"  For Cabrini and Hope, I'd say, "probably not, but it wouldn't surprise me."  That says probably somewhere in the 30-50 range and probably not a great candidate for the Top 25.  I believe in Cabrini because they just seem to keep winning games.  Hope has lost a number of games I wouldn't expect a good Hope team to lose, thus: not good this year.

I try very hard not to use past performance as a guide, but at some point you have to give credit to coaching or system or some other intangible that makes an otherwise ordinary team consistently outperform expectations.

[sac]

Hope has lost a number of games I wouldn't expect a good Hope team to lose, thus: not good this year.

I know I'm cherry picking quotes here, but what?

They've lost at #1 UWSP, #2 UWW, at home to #4 Illinois Wesleyan, neutral court to Wheaton who's been ranked nearly all year and has a chance to win the CCIW Saturday.  A loss to Cornerstone who is ranked #3 in NAIA II and has lost once since playing Hope to a D2.  The only loss they maybe shouldn't have had was at Albion.  A road loss in a conference game which nearly every good D3 team will have at least one of those.

How many D3 teams would have actually done better vs that schedule?

[Greek Tragedy]

So they've lost every game noted. 

How many D3 teams would have actually done better vs that schedule?

I guess all someone would have to do is win ONE of those games! 

[7express]

It should be noted that I didn't turn in a ballot. So it probably wasn't a 'Calvin fan' homer pick (I'm not aware of any other Calvin fans who have been voting).

I put in the Calvin vote.  Even after the loss to hope, they only fell to #26 on my ballot.  And if you want to know why their so high, look back at 2 things I said this week:
1) from Saturday: "9 teams from 15-25 in my poll last week lost at least 1 game this week. "
2) from Sunday (and pay attention to the bolded part): "My poll's in.  1-10 for the most part was pretty easy, at least to me.  Didn't really have much of a problem with 22-25 either (SOMEONE has to occupy those spots, and the votes for those 4 spots are minuscule at best and will barely register overall anyway).  11-21 was a real PITA.  I bumped up some teams I had screwed in recent weeks (like the Brockport's & Texas Dallas's of the world) and threw darts for the rest and see where it landed."

So the combination of: 1) Not a lot of very good teams 2) a bunch of teams losing last week and 3) were just on the outside, that's why they got the bump.

[sac]

[smedindy]

I feel like Hope is a Top 25 team...somewhere between 20-25.

If Hope had Cabrini's schedule, they're be ranked about #3 right now and everyone would think they're awesome.

The power numbers wouldn't fib, though. Cabrini is 17 and Hope is 23 in Massey. So, yeah, practically even steven.

Massey SOS

Hope - 11
Cabrini - 183

Power numbers take into account the SOS.

[smedindy]

I was keeping Calvin in the running for a while; they are clearly the most impressive MIAA team this year.  Then they got walloped by Hope, who is not good this year.  That sealed the deal for me.  I could see someone closer to the situation making a more detailed determination on it.

I feel like Hope is a Top 25 team...somewhere between 20-25.

If Hope had Cabrini's schedule, they're be ranked about #3 right now and everyone would think they're awesome.

I'm not convinced Cabrini is a good team.  I've watched them play more over the last three or four years than any other school.  Yes, the have quite possibly the best player in the country, but that team does not look good.  You watch them on the floor and they're fearless and aggressive, but they don't appear overly talented.  They just seem to keep winning.

I sort of think about teams with the question, "All things being equal (in terms of bracket positioning and strength of opponents), would I expect these teams to make the second weekend?"  For Cabrini and Hope, I'd say, "probably not, but it wouldn't surprise me."  That says probably somewhere in the 30-50 range and probably not a great candidate for the Top 25.  I believe in Cabrini because they just seem to keep winning games.  Hope has lost a number of games I wouldn't expect a good Hope team to lose, thus: not good this year.

I try very hard not to use past performance as a guide, but at some point you have to give credit to coaching or system or some other intangible that makes an otherwise ordinary team consistently outperform expectations.

How can someone be NOT GOOD if they're in the top 30 to 50 teams in ALL of D-3?

[Flying Dutch Fan]

I feel like Hope is a Top 25 team...somewhere between 20-25.

If Hope had Cabrini's schedule, they're be ranked about #3 right now and everyone would think they're awesome.

The power numbers wouldn't fib, though. Cabrini is 17 and Hope is 23 in Massey. So, yeah, practically even steven.

Massey SOS

Hope - 11
Cabrini - 183

I'm well aware of that, but it doesn't change the fact that there is a large difference in the schedules these two have played.


Power numbers take into account the SOS.