MBB: USA South Conference

[narch]

It looks this debate is centered around the mascots of "lions"  Monarchs, Lions, and Pride (Grant it Narch has the understanding Pride meaning lady lions.  Where pride means leader of the pack or pride-group of lions) 

you can cite whatever dictionary you want...a PRIDE of lions is composed primarily of female lions that are subordinate to a dominant male, or MONARCH - the female/male ratio is typically around 8 to 1 among mature cats...sounds like a bunch of lady lions to me

however, none of this is germane to the conversation at hand...this debate has absolutely NOTHING to do with mascots, and i'm not sure why you would think it did

[narch]

Narch, as soon as the Monarchs lose you will be blaming the refs. What a dickhead.

if i ever blame officials for a loss, please feel free to call me out...i can assure you that i never have, but i can't guarantee i never will

and your inability to debate a point in a mature and intellectual fashion (and, i might point out, within the parameters of the terms of service you agreed to when registering on this website) speaks volumes...we're discussing officiating and you retort to childish name calling - brilliant!

[notamensa]

nooooo! tell me we didnt just lose to vwc by one point!

[notamensa]

from fishtankfan on the odac board -

"Congratulations to the Marlins on winning the season opener.  Another heart-stopper, another come from behind victory with under 5 seconds left.  CNU played a good game and the Marlins had their problems but they pulled out another unbelievable win .  Marlins led early and often and were up 38-35 at the half  but CNU hung in there and played tough.  The Marlins' experience won it for them in the end through sheer determination and never say die attitude.  No other reason to explain it.  They should have lost but didn't.  The defense kept them in the game and Macedo made the adjustments needed to pull the game out.  If every game goes down to the wire like this one... VWC will have to give out pacemakers to all their fans.. WTGGGGGG Marlins...29 in a row...and counting.  Congrats to CNU for giving the Marlins almost all they could handle tonight." 

[narch]

Good teams adjust, huh? OK, since you seem to be 100% sure of your position, tell me how you'd "adjust" to this hypothetical situation...So tell me, Mr. "officiating DOES NOT determine the outcome of games", how are you going to adjust to that situation?

first off, it's narch (or mr. narch), not "mr. officiating does not determine the outcome of games", although i had been considering changing my handle, and that was one of the possibilities

here is how a good TEAM would adjust...another individual would step up and contribute...i see it all the time...guys ADJUST and fill roles they aren't accustomed to - i didn't say it was easy, i simply said that's what needed to happen

All I said was that, "a ref was the MVP of the Ferrum/Piedmont game" ... meaning literally, that he was an overly significant (and wrongful) determining factor in the outcome of the game ... and he was. That's not an excuse ... that's a fact.

see, to me, this still sounds a lot like you feel the officials determined the OUTCOME of the game, as in had they not called those fouls, piedmont would have won...and you're calling it a FACT - is it POSSIBLE that the officials were correct on each of the fouls they called?  is it possible that had the player in question been available to play, the outcome might have been the same...i mean, the player in question did have 7 turnovers in that game...might he have given ferrrum an extra possession or 2 by way of turnover had he been in the game longer?  maybe the player in question was effective BECAUSE he only played 18 minutes and was fresh when he was in the game...who knows? - it seems an awfully big leap to assume that ONE PLAYER would have completely changed the outcome of a game...but then, i believe in the TEAM concept (something i KNOW the piedmont coach espouses, as well)

i'd personally like to think that if piedmont had shot better than 37% overall and 27% from 3 they could have won...maybe if they hadn't turned the ball over 19 times the outcome would have been different...perhaps if they had kept ferrum off the offensive glass, they would have won...instead, you chose to blame (at least partially) the loss on the officials - that's your prerogative, but i stand behind my statement of opinion..."officiating DOES NOT determine the outcome of games" - feel free to quote me at ANY POINT in the future, and understand i fully realize i'm drawing a line in the sand...i've drawn it before, i'm sure i'll draw it again - also, feel free to disagree with my opinion - realize, however, that in my mind, anyone who moans about officials in relation to the outcome of a game sounds like they are whining

the lions are still my 2nd favorite d3 team, and you're still my favorite gsac poster, though (although scottiedoug is gaining on you with posts like the ones earlier )

[narch]

from fishtankfan on the odac board -

"Congratulations to the Marlins on winning the season opener.  Another heart-stopper, another come from behind victory with under 5 seconds left.  CNU played a good game and the Marlins had their problems but they pulled out another unbelievable win .  Marlins led early and often and were up 38-35 at the half  but CNU hung in there and played tough.  The Marlins' experience won it for them in the end through sheer determination and never say die attitude.  No other reason to explain it.  They should have lost but didn't.  The defense kept them in the game and Macedo made the adjustments needed to pull the game out.  If every game goes down to the wire like this one... VWC will have to give out pacemakers to all their fans.. WTGGGGGG Marlins...29 in a row...and counting.  Congrats to CNU for giving the Marlins almost all they could handle tonight." 

sounds like a great game...too bad the capts couldn't pull it out

[cnubbballer]

Great college game tonight!  Captains let one get away, up 71 – 66 with two minutes left.  VWC scored the last six points to pull it out.  Two sophomores played well, both finished with 15 points.  Blasingame played well against Adair the college player of the year in 2006.  Adair is one heck of a smart player, but Blasingame used his height advantage well against him.  Nice to see him be aggressive on the offensive end, hope to see more of that.  Davon hit some big shots and did a great job of running the offense!

Ed, Korey and Donta all had some outstanding moments. 

Blasingame missed a one and one with about 25 seconds left.  But the real story was "turnovers!"  We had 17 to VWC's 7.  Couple of key ones at the end.  Theo Baker has a great future at CNU.  Nice job by Mike Witham and Justin Kraut off the bench when the team got into foul trouble. 

[narch]

i also think that york (ny) should definitely get some votes. how could they not have had even a single vote in the pre-season top-25 when they were voted pre-season #1 in their division (2 divisions in their conference)? they were a ncaa tournament team, after all.

they (york) were also 15-13 last year...getting pre-season top 25 votes after a season like that is tough and being #1 in your conference doesn't necessarily mean you're a top 25 team - the monarchs won 3 straight conference championships and won 17, 18 and 20 games (against a tough non-conference schedule) in those 3 years, and i don't think they got ANY pre-season top 25 votes (although i could be wrong...they may have gotten a few last year)

[Capt-Schemer]

lost 71-72 to the defending national champs...does that qualify as a "heartbreaker"?  OK...I get it...We failed to adjust to a "Closely called" game Friday against York, but how do you adjust to what I witnessed tonight?  Was that also a "tightly called" game, or am I justified in crediting one particular fella in stripes with something close to a 10 point swing tonight.  BTW...rumor is Mark Blasingame was credited with ZERO blocked shots tonight...rumor.
OK....enough about that (I tend to wear my emotions a bit far down the sleeve at times)>  Bottom line--The Captains looked good tonight, I think they flat out-played the Marlins and came up short, kind of like Seatle did in last years Super Bowl after spanking the Steelers for 60 minutes.  How about that #24!?  Didn't get any shots off tonight, but put up some pretty nice "D" when he came in to spell Dante' for foul trouble. 

[Rikki_Tikki_Tavi]

LOL @ how about that 24!! Way to give some kudos Capt!!I listened to the entire game tonight and what a game it was. I think it gave me heart palpatations!! Man!! Reminded me of the two times the Capts played Lincoln last year!! Whew, they sounded good, now they need to go out and get two this weekend and then prepare for RMC next Tuesday.

[Capt-Schemer]

You can bet the come line on CNU this weekend Rikki--They really did look like the Captains of Feb/Mar 2006.

[Pat Coleman]

Narch, as soon as the Monarchs lose you will be blaming the refs. What a ...

Hmm ... who's the (word removed) here?

[PrideSportBBallGuy]

The mascot reference was a reference to which fans seemed to debate over the issue.  None of us backed down.  Something lions are known not to do, and that is back down. (it was a joke)

[old_lion]

All I said was that, "a ref was the MVP of the Ferrum/Piedmont game" ... meaning literally, that he was an overly significant (and wrongful) determining factor in the outcome of the game ... and he was. That's not an excuse ... that's a fact.

see, to me, this ,(1) still sounds a lot like you feel the officials determined the OUTCOME of the game as in had they not called those fouls, piedmont would have won...and you're calling it a FACT - (2) is it POSSIBLE that the officials were correct on each of the fouls they called? (3) is it possible that had the player in question been available to play, the outcome might have been the same  ...i mean, the player in question did have 7 turnovers in that game...might he have given ferrrum an extra possession or 2 by way of turnover had he been in the game longer?  (4) maybe the player in question was effective BECAUSE he only played 18 minutes and was fresh when he was in the game  ...who knows? - it seems an awfully big leap to assume that ONE PLAYER would have completely changed the outcome of a game...but then,(5)  i believe in the TEAM concept (something i KNOW the piedmont coach espouses, as well)

i'd personally like to think that (6) if piedmont had shot better than 37% overall and 27% from 3 they could have won...maybe if they hadn't turned the ball over 19 times the outcome would have been different...perhaps if they had kept ferrum off the offensive glass,  they would have won...instead, you chose to blame (at least partially) the loss on the officials - that's your prerogative, but i stand behind my statement of opinion..."officiating DOES NOT determine the outcome of games" - feel free to quote me at ANY POINT in the future, and understand i fully realize i'm drawing a line in the sand...i've drawn it before, i'm sure i'll draw it again - also, feel free to disagree with my opinion - realize, however, that in my mind, anyone who moans about officials in relation to the outcome of a game (7) sounds like they are whining

the lions are still my 2nd favorite d3 team, and (8) you're still my favorite gsac poster, though (although scottiedoug is gaining on you with posts like the ones earlier )

(1) No, that would be silly ... there are way too many variables involved to say any one of then determined the outcome, 100%. I thought my quote you posted above was pretty clear ... read it one more time. He was an overly significant (and wrongful) determining factor in the outcome of the game ... that's the fact.

(2) No

(3) Certainly, but not likely.

(4) Now you're pushing it ... He played 5 minutes in the 2nd half. I think he is well-conditioned enough to have gutted it out for another few minutes had the crap-for-brains, incompetent officials not forced him to the bench with not one, but two atrociously bad calls.

(5) No one believes in the TEAM concept more than Piedmont does ... or than I do. And our guys did step up big time, over compensated, and came pretty close to pulling it out anyway. But the fact remains, at least at this point in the season, Baldwin is by far our most accomplished big man. And while his wrongful forced absence for most of the 2nd half certainly didn't determine the OUTCOME 100% ... gosh, to say that would just be silly ... I would say, let's see ...  how can I put this succinctly? Oh, I know ... it was an overly significant (and wrongful) determining factor in the outcome of the game.    That's a teaching technique ... it's called spaced repetition ... you keep repeating key concepts and sooner or later, it soaks in. 

(6) Let's see ... shoot better and keep Ferrum off the glass ... believe it or not, we thought of that. We even tried our best to do just that. Here's a thought ... I bet our chances of actually doing it would have been significantly improved had our best rebounder and scorer been allowed to play the 2nd half. 

(7) I agree, I was whining ... You should have seen me at the time ... I was also pissing, moanin' and bitchin ... but that still doesn't mean Mr. Crap-for-brains, incompetent official didn't unjustly force our best big man to the bench.

(8) Your favorite GSAC poster? I believe there's a term for that ... it's called "damning with faint praise" ... but thanks, anyway. 

I've got to give you credit, Mr. Narch ... you're relentless, you're starting to wear me down ... much like Ferrum's superior size wore us down after Mr. Crap-for-brains, incompetent official unjustly forced our best big man to the bench. BTW, while I certainly wouldn't say that determined the OUTCOME 100% ... unquestionably, it was an overly significant (and wrongful) determining factor in the outcome of the game. That's all.

Spaced repetition, baby ... spaced repetition ...   

[Rikki_Tikki_Tavi]

Narch, as soon as the Monarchs lose you will be blaming the refs. What a ...

Hmm ... who's the (word removed) here?

LOL good call Mr. Coleman!!