Pool C

Greek Tragedy · February 28, 2009, 09:44:58 PM

Update when results come in.

I left out the regular season records so it fits.

RED means they have lost, regular season/conference tourney is complete and they are Pool C eligible.

BLUE means they have won the Pool A bid from their respective conference

Atlantic	REG	CONF.	RESULTS
Richard Stockton	20-2	NJAC	BEAT William Paterson; BEAT Rutgers-Newark in NJAC Final
Farmingdale State	23-2	SKY	BEAT SUNY-Old Westbury; LOST to St. Joseph's (L.I.) in SKY Finals
Monclair State	16-5	NJAC	LOST to Rutgers-Newark in NJAC semis
William Paterson	20-6	NJAC	LOST to Richard Stockton in NJAC semis
Baruch	20-3	CUNYAC	BEAT Lehman; LOST to Brooklyn in CUNYAC Final.

EAST	REG	CONF	RESULTS
Ithaca	22-1	E8	LOST Nazareth in E8 semis
St. Lawrence	17-5	LL	BEAT Clarkson; LOST to RPI in Liberty League Final
Hamilton	16-2	LL	LOST to RPI in LL semis
Utica	17-8	E8	LOST to Rochester Tech in E8 semis.
Rochester	16-8	UAA	LOST to Carnegie Mellon on Sat.

Great Lakes	REG	CONF	RESULTS
John Carroll	18-3	OAC	BEAT Heidelberg; BEAT Muskingum; BEAT Capital in OAC Final
Capital	20-3	OAC	BEAT Mount Union, BEAT Ohio Northern; LOST to John Carroll in OAC Final
Carnegie Mellon	14-5	UAA	BEAT Rochester
Wooster	18-4	NCAC	BEAT Denison; BEAT Kenyon; BEAT Wabash in NCAC Final
Calvin	12-2	MIAA	BEAT Trine; BEAT Olivet; LOST to Hope in MIAA Final
Ohio Wesleyan	16-6	NCAC	LOST to Allegheny in NCAC quarterfinals

Middle Atlantic	REG	CONF	RESULTS
St. Mary's (Md)	18-2	CAC	LOST to Marymount in CAC semis
Franklin & Marshall	20-4	CC	BEAT Muhlenberg; plays Gettysburg in Centennial Conference Final on Sun.
DeSales	18-5	MACF	BEAT Wilkes; BEAT Manhattanville in MACF Final
Widener	18-5	MACC	BEAT Messiah; BEAT Elizabethtown in MACC Final.
Gwynedd-Mercy	19-4	CSAC	BEAT Baptist Bible; BEAT Cabrini CSAC Final.
McDaniel	16-6	CC	LOST to Gettysburg in CC semis.
Cabrini	19-6	CSAC	BEAT Keystone; LOST to Gwynedd-Mercy in CSAC Final.
Scranton	18-6	LAND	BEAT Catholic; BEAT Susquehanna in LAND Final.

Midwest	REG	CONF	RESULTS
Wheaton (IL)	18-3	CCIW	BEAT North Central (Ill); plays Elmhurst in CCIW Final on Sat.
Washington U.	21-2	UAA	BEAT Chicago on Sat.
Elmhurst	19-6	CCIW	BEAT Augustana; plays Wheaton (IL) in CCIW Final on Sat.
Transylvania	16-3	HCAC	BEAT Anderson; BEAT Franklin in HCAC Final.
Lawrence	17-6	MWC	BEAT Carroll; BEAT Grinnell in MWC Final.
Augustana	17-7	CCIW	LOST to Elmhurst in CCIW semis
Carroll	16-7	MWC	LOST to Lawrence in MWC semis
North Central (IL)	14-7	CCIW	LOST to Wheaton (IL) in CCIW semis.

Northeast	REG	CONF	RESULTS
Worcester Tech	20-3	NEWMAC	LOST to Springfield in NEWMAC semis
Middlebury	20-2	NESCAC	BEAT Bowdoin; plays Amherst in NESCAC Final on Sun.
Elms	23-1	NECC	BEAT Wheelock; BEAT Becker in NECC Final
Rhode Island Coll.	21-4	LEC	BEAT Southern Maine; BEAT Keene State; LOST to Mass-Dartmouth in LEC Final
Mass-Dartmouth	20-3	LEC	BEAT Mass-Boston; BEAT Western Connecticut; BEAT RIC in LEC Final
Salem State	19-5	MASCAC	BEAT Framingham State; LOST to Bridgewater State in MASCAC Final.
Bridgewater State	17-4	MASCAC	BEAT Westfield State; BEAT Salem State in MASCAC Final
Brandeis	16-8	UAA	BEAT New York University
Amherst	18-5	NESCAC	BEAT Williams; plays Middlebury in NESCAC Final on Sun.
Bowdoin	17-8	NESCAC	LOST to Middlebury in NESCAC semis

South	REG	CONF	RESULTS
Trinity (Texas)	19-3	SCAC	BEAT Sewanee; LOST to Southwestern in SCAC semis
Texas-Dallas	19-4	ASC	BEAT Sul Ross State; BEAT Mary Hardin-Baylor; plays Mississippi College in ASC Final on Sun.
Guilford	20-4	ODAC	LOST to Washington and Lee in ODAC quarters.
Randolph-Macon	18-2	ODAC	LOST Virginia Wesleyan in ODAC quarters.
Centre	16-4	SCAC	BEAT Austin; BEAT Hendrix; plays Southwestern in SCAC Final on Sat.
McMurry	17-5	ASC	BEAT Texas-Tyler; LOST to Mississippi College in ASC semis
DePauw	15-5	SCAC	LOST Southwestern in SCAC quarters.
Roanoke	14-6	ODAC	LOST Hampden-Sydney in ODAC quarters.

West	REG	CONF	RESULTS
St. Thomas	24-0	MIAC	BEAT Gustavus Adolphus; plays Bethel in MIAC Final on Sat.
Puget Sound	20-0	NWC	BEAT Lewis and Clark; plays Whitworth in NWC Final on Sat.
UW-Stevens Point	20-4	WIAC	BEAT Oshkosh; BEAT Platteville in WIAC Final
UW-Whitewater	20-4	WIAC	BEAT River Falls; LOST to Platteville
UW-Platteville	16-4	WIAC	BEAT Whitewater; LOST to Stevens Point in WIAC Final
Buena Vista	20-2	IIAC	LOST to Wartburg in IIAC semis
CMS	16-4	SCIAC	BEAT Caltech; BEAT Cal. Lutheran; plays Ponoma-Pitzer in SCIAC Final on Sat.
Whitworth	18-5	NWC	BEAT Linfield; plays Puget Sound in NWC Final on Sat.

Mr. Ypsi · February 28, 2009, 09:46:32 PM

Quote from: sharmony on February 28, 2009, 09:42:26 PM
Is the loser of Elmhurst and Wheaton a lock for a Pool C bid?

Yes.

But Wheaton would go much quicker than Elmhurst.

sharmony · February 28, 2009, 10:08:50 PM

That's what I thought. Thanks.

Mr. Ypsi · February 28, 2009, 10:17:26 PM

Elmhurst led for about 39 minutes, but Wheaton prevails.

Elmhurst should go maybe 10-12 in C. What's interesting is that Augie will be next up for the Midwest. While their credentials are not the greatest, has the Midwest ever failed to get a second C (at least since expansion)?

watcher · February 28, 2009, 10:22:12 PM

as it stands now with all these upsets what teams would you say bubbles have been busted or very close on the edge

Titan Q · February 28, 2009, 10:43:24 PM

I think 14 Pool C's are accounted for (in no particular order)...

1. UW-Whitewater
2. Buena Vista
3. St. Mary's (Md)
4. Guilford
5. UW-Platteville
6. Elmhurst
7. Capital
8. Rhode Island
9. Hamilton or St. Lawrence
10. Salem St.
11. Trinity-Tx
12. Ithaca
13. Farmingdale St.
14. Worcester Poly

Next up (in no particular order)...

* Randolph-Macon
* St. Lawrence
* Augustana
* Carnegie-Mellon
* Calvin
* Amherst
* Whitworth
* Hamilton or St. Lawrence
* Brandeis

The teams that end up being outside the top 4 in this group will be the big losers from today.

Bubble Burster in progress: Whitworth @ Puget Sound

Bubble Burster games tomorrow...

Middlebury (vs Amherst)
Centre (vs Southwestern)
Franklin & Marshall (vs Gettysburg)
Texas-Dallas (vs Mississippi Coll)

Pat Coleman · February 28, 2009, 10:49:48 PM

Quote from: Thunder Dutch on February 28, 2009, 06:13:12 PM
Question: when do at-large teams and brackets get announced? Is d3hoops going to have some kind of selection show? or on ncaa.com?

Yes, we'll have a show on Hoopsville on Monday morning.

Hugenerd · February 28, 2009, 11:31:32 PM

Another Pool C might be in trouble. UPS is down 9 with under 8 minutes to go. They are losing to Whitworth, who was ranked #8 in the West last week but are likely a weak bubble team if they dont win this game.

pabegg · February 28, 2009, 11:35:36 PM

Locks for Pool C

Locks for Pool C for eliminated teams (7)

UW-Whitewater
UW-Platteville
Elmhurst
Capital
Rhode Island College
Ithaca
Worcester Polytech

Locks for Pool C if loses (2)

Puget Sound   F Sat
Middlebury   F Sun

So there are 7 to 9 Pool C locks, leaving 9 to 11 bids

Probable Pool C

Probable Pool C for eliminated teams (9)

Buena Vista
Guilford
Randolph-Macon
St. Mary's (Md.)
Hamilton
Salem State
SUNY-Farmingdale
St. Lawrence
Trinity (Texas)

Probable Pool C if loses final (3)

Texas-Dallas   F Sun
Franklin and Marshall   F Sun
Centre   F Sun

There are 9 to 12 Pool C bids here. That's almost certainly too many.

In Contention if there are any bids left

In Contention eliminated teams (5)

Augustana
Calvin
McMurry
McDaniel
Carnegie Mellon

In Contention and Pool A underdog (2)

Whitworth   F Sat
Amherst   F Sun

magicman · February 28, 2009, 11:42:06 PM

Whitworth up 65-60 with 4:45 to go

Hugenerd · February 28, 2009, 11:44:19 PM

Quote from: pabegg on February 28, 2009, 11:35:36 PM
Locks for Pool C

Locks for Pool C for eliminated teams (7)

UW-Whitewater
UW-Platteville
Elmhurst
Capital
Rhode Island College
Ithaca
Worcester Polytech

Locks for Pool C if loses (2)

Puget Sound   F Sat
Middlebury   F Sun

So there are 7 to 9 Pool C locks, leaving 9 to 11 bids

Probable Pool C

Probable Pool C for eliminated teams (9)

Buena Vista
Guilford
Randolph-Macon
St. Mary's (Md.)
Hamilton
Salem State
SUNY-Farmingdale
St. Lawrence
Trinity (Texas)

Probable Pool C if loses final (3)

Texas-Dallas   F Sun
Franklin and Marshall   F Sun
Centre   F Sun

There are 9 to 12 Pool C bids here. That's almost certainly too many.

In Contention if there are any bids left

In Contention eliminated teams (5)

Augustana
Calvin
McMurry
McDaniel
Carnegie Mellon

In Contention and Pool A underdog (2)

Whitworth   F Sat
Amherst   F Sun

Pabegg,

I dont know if this is me being a homer or what, but could you tell me what distinguishes Capital so greatly from Carnegie Mellon. Obviously Capital has the in-region winning percentage (22-4 vs. 15-5), but CMU seems to hold the advantage in all the other criteria. CMU will have higher OWP/OOWP, CMU is 2-0 against great lakes region opponents (Capital is 1-2 if Ohio Wesleyan drops off the final rankings, or 2-2 if they stay), there is obviously no head-to-head, but against common oppenents CMU is 1-0 and Capital is 1-2. Would it be completely inconceivable for CMU to be ranked ahead of Capital in the final GL rankings (lets say if JCU were #1, for CMU to be #2, and then Capital at #3)? Obviously the committee does not look purely at winning percentage because Brandeis was ranked ahead of Amherst last week, CMU was ranked ahead of Wooster and Calvin, etc.

Any commments or explanation would be great.

Hugenerd · February 28, 2009, 11:47:02 PM

UPS in a whole lot of trouble, down 68-60, Whitworth shooting FTs, under 3 to go.

Just like that UPS cuts it to 4 with under 2 remaining.

2 Point game, under :56 to play, UPS with the ball.

pradam · February 28, 2009, 11:53:31 PM

Quote from: pabegg on February 28, 2009, 11:35:36 PM
Locks for Pool C

Locks for Pool C for eliminated teams (7)

UW-Whitewater
UW-Platteville
Elmhurst
Capital
Rhode Island College
Ithaca
Worcester Polytech

Locks for Pool C if loses (2)

Puget Sound   F Sat
Middlebury   F Sun

So there are 7 to 9 Pool C locks, leaving 9 to 11 bids

Probable Pool C

Probable Pool C for eliminated teams (9)

Buena Vista
Guilford
Randolph-Macon
St. Mary's (Md.)
Hamilton
Salem State
SUNY-Farmingdale
St. Lawrence
Trinity (Texas)

Probable Pool C if loses final (3)

Texas-Dallas   F Sun
Franklin and Marshall   F Sun
Centre   F Sun

There are 9 to 12 Pool C bids here. That's almost certainly too many.

In Contention if there are any bids left

In Contention eliminated teams (5)

Augustana
Calvin
McMurry
McDaniel
Carnegie Mellon

In Contention and Pool A underdog (2)

Whitworth   F Sat
Amherst   F Sun

This may also be my "homerism" talking, but what distinguishes Augustana/Calvin/McMurry/McDaniel from Brandeis? I get that Carnegie has a leg up, but why those four? (I'm asking honestly, not being mean or anything). Calvin, McMurry and McDaniel all have eight regional losses, like Brandeis, but lower OWP numbers (I'd guess). Glancing quickly at the schedules, the only win against a currently regional-ranked opponent between the three of them is McDaniel's win over F&M (and that was a split). Brandeis beat RIC and Amherst, plus Carnegie twice.

Augustana's only win against a regionally-ranked team was Elmhurst, if I'm not mistaken. They have the high OWP, but no real wins to show for it.

Also, I'm confused as to why Hamilton is such a lock. They have six regional losses in a weak region and only one win against a regionally-ranked opponent (Utica). What am I missing?

Just curious. I'm sure there are explanations that I'm missing.

pradam · February 28, 2009, 11:55:53 PM

Quote from: pradam on February 28, 2009, 11:53:31 PM
Quote from: pabegg on February 28, 2009, 11:35:36 PM
Locks for Pool C

Locks for Pool C for eliminated teams (7)

UW-Whitewater
UW-Platteville
Elmhurst
Capital
Rhode Island College
Ithaca
Worcester Polytech

Locks for Pool C if loses (2)

Puget Sound   F Sat
Middlebury   F Sun

So there are 7 to 9 Pool C locks, leaving 9 to 11 bids

Probable Pool C

Probable Pool C for eliminated teams (9)

Buena Vista
Guilford
Randolph-Macon
St. Mary's (Md.)
Hamilton
Salem State
SUNY-Farmingdale
St. Lawrence
Trinity (Texas)

Probable Pool C if loses final (3)

Texas-Dallas   F Sun
Franklin and Marshall   F Sun
Centre   F Sun

There are 9 to 12 Pool C bids here. That's almost certainly too many.

In Contention if there are any bids left

In Contention eliminated teams (5)

Augustana
Calvin
McMurry
McDaniel
Carnegie Mellon

In Contention and Pool A underdog (2)

Whitworth   F Sat
Amherst   F Sun

This may also be my "homerism" talking, but what distinguishes Augustana/Calvin/McMurry/McDaniel from Brandeis? I get that Carnegie has a leg up, but why those four? (I'm asking honestly, not being mean or anything). Calvin, McMurry and McDaniel all have eight regional losses, like Brandeis, but lower OWP numbers (I'd guess). Glancing quickly at the schedules, the only win against a currently regional-ranked opponent between the three of them is McDaniel's win over F&M (and that was a split). Brandeis beat RIC and Amherst, plus Carnegie twice.

Augustana's only win against a regionally-ranked team was Elmhurst, if I'm not mistaken. They have the high OWP, but no real wins to show for it.

Also, I'm confused as to why Hamilton is such a lock. They have six regional losses in a weak region and only one win against a regionally-ranked opponent (Utica). What am I missing?

Just curious. I'm sure there are explanations that I'm missing.

Ahh...forget it. I was looking at overall record, not regional record.

Hugenerd · February 28, 2009, 11:57:30 PM

UPS and Whitworth tied with :13 left. Great come back either way for UPS (but Im hoping they win).

AND WE ARE GOING TO OT. UPS has to feel good about that, being down 9 with under 3 to go. If you have a chance, look at the play by play of the last minute, huge shot making for both teams. UPS hit a 3 to go up by 1, but Whit countered with a 3 of their own to go up 2, but UPS made another shot to tie it with :14 left.