Pool C

[sac]

I do have to formally apologize to Becker.  The oldest school in the tournament is not the worst.  Apparently Scranton is also quite bad.

I don't have my worksheet in front of me but I had Medgar Evers and Wells rated very low, I can't recall who exactly was #61.  Becker actually came out somewhere in the middle of the field.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I do have to formally apologize to Becker.  The oldest school in the tournament is not the worst.  Apparently Scranton is also quite bad.

I don't have my worksheet in front of me but I had Medgar Evers and Wells rated very low, I can't recall who exactly was #61.  Becker actually came out somewhere in the middle of the field.

No, I think Wells has to be the worst.  I would have said Husson before their performance tonight.  Becker proved me, and their reputation and schedule wrong this evening.

[fritzdis]

Becker proved me, and their reputation and schedule wrong this evening.

Knowing nothing of their reputation, I'm not sure I understand what's so terrible about their schedule.  They went undefeated in their conference (where they have no control over the quality of their opponents) until the championship game.  They won at RIC (T-1st in LEC reg. season), went 1-1 against WPI (1st in NEWMAC reg. season), lost at Salem State (1st in MASCAC reg. season), beat Anna Maria (not a "big" win, I know, but 1st in CCC reg. season), and had a "bad" loss at Albertus Magnus (T-2nd in GNAC reg. season).

I understand they played a few very bad teams out of conference, and they didn't play anyone from the NESCAC.  Otherwise, it seems they scheduled several of the best second-tier teams in the region.  I'm not suggesting they should be considered among the top teams in D3, but it seems awfully harsh to have considered them among the very worst teams in the field because of that schedule.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Becker proved me, and their reputation and schedule wrong this evening.

Knowing nothing of their reputation, I'm not sure I understand what's so terrible about their schedule.  They went undefeated in their conference (where they have no control over the quality of their opponents) until the championship game.  They won at RIC (T-1st in LEC reg. season), went 1-1 against WPI (1st in NEWMAC reg. season), lost at Salem State (1st in MASCAC reg. season), beat Anna Maria (not a "big" win, I know, but 1st in CCC reg. season), and had a "bad" loss at Albertus Magnus (T-2nd in GNAC reg. season).

I understand they played a few very bad teams out of conference, and they didn't play anyone from the NESCAC.  Otherwise, it seems they scheduled several of the best second-tier teams in the region.  I'm not suggesting they should be considered among the top teams in D3, but it seems awfully harsh to have considered them among the very worst teams in the field because of that schedule.

Almost every one of those "big" wins was over teams when they were playing poorly.  RIC, AMC, and WPI were much better at the end of the year than at the beginning.  Even so, other than WPI, none of those teams are more than middling NE region schools.

[fritzdis]

Becker proved me, and their reputation and schedule wrong this evening.

Knowing nothing of their reputation, I'm not sure I understand what's so terrible about their schedule.  They went undefeated in their conference (where they have no control over the quality of their opponents) until the championship game.  They won at RIC (T-1st in LEC reg. season), went 1-1 against WPI (1st in NEWMAC reg. season), lost at Salem State (1st in MASCAC reg. season), beat Anna Maria (not a "big" win, I know, but 1st in CCC reg. season), and had a "bad" loss at Albertus Magnus (T-2nd in GNAC reg. season).

I understand they played a few very bad teams out of conference, and they didn't play anyone from the NESCAC.  Otherwise, it seems they scheduled several of the best second-tier teams in the region.  I'm not suggesting they should be considered among the top teams in D3, but it seems awfully harsh to have considered them among the very worst teams in the field because of that schedule.

Almost every one of those "big" wins was over teams when they were playing poorly.  RIC, AMC, and WPI were much better at the end of the year than at the beginning.  Even so, other than WPI, none of those teams are more than middling NE region schools.

RIC won their next 6 games (Becker was their first).  WPI won the 2 games prior to their first meeting (a Becker win), as well as the 3 games following it (mostly against bad competition, but all with ease).  The 2nd WPI game (a Becker loss) was Becker's 1st game after Christmas (and WPI's 2nd - they lost their 1st to WCU then won 13 in a row), so the "timing" argument could go in Becker's favor there.  Admittedly, simply looking back at the results doesn't tell you whether the teams were necessarily playing at high levels when they met Becker, but the results don't seem to indicate that Becker caught them at just the right times.

I think Penn State-Behrend might consider RIC better than middling.

I have no problem with the idea that Becker's resume was among the 10-15 worst entering the tournament, but to single them out as possibly the worst because of the schedule seems strange to me.  I apologize if you stated other reasons in prior posts, as I have not been following this thread in its entirety.

[LustyLarryintheToilet]

On the topic of the worst Pool C team, when you take last night into the equation I have to throw Gwynedd Mercy into the conversation.  GMC's only stake to a pool C berth was going 2-1 against Keystone.  They went 0-3 vs Cabrini, and lost their only remotely legitimate non-conference game vs York.  No disrespect to Buffalo St, but there you have a team that had some luck due to Oswego's first round conf tourney upset, and they pulled away convincingly in the 2nd half. 

[Pat Coleman]

Sometimes the bracket makes it easy to pick surprise teams.

[sac]

I do have to formally apologize to Becker.  The oldest school in the tournament is not the worst.  Apparently Scranton is also quite bad.

I don't have my worksheet in front of me but I had Medgar Evers and Wells rated very low, I can't recall who exactly was #61.  Becker actually came out somewhere in the middle of the field.

Becker came in at #38 on my sheet out of 60.

The bottom 5 on my sheet were

56. Hartwick
57. Deleware Valley
58. Medgar Evers
59. Salve Regina
60. Wells.

Of my bottom 12 only Johnson And Wales won in the first round.

[Mr. Ypsi]

sac, note that the tourney has 61 teams.

Or were you mercifully omitting mention of #61?!

[sac]

sac, note that the tourney has 61 teams.

Or were you mercifully omitting mention of #61?!

Wasn't able to rate Husson, sorry thought the quote contained that info.

[Ralph Turner]

...
Becker came in at #38 on my sheet out of 60.

The bottom on 5 my sheet were

56. Hartwick
57. Deleware Valley
58. Medgar Evers
59. Salve Regina
60. Wells.

Of my bottom 12 only Johnson And Wales won in the first round.

Where was J&W's opponent Ramapo ranked in your index?

[sac]

...
Becker came in at #38 on my sheet out of 60.

The bottom on 5 my sheet were

56. Hartwick
57. Deleware Valley
58. Medgar Evers
59. Salve Regina
60. Wells.

Of my bottom 12 only Johnson And Wales won in the first round.

Where was J&W's opponent Ramapo ranked in your index?

I'll have to get back to you later on that one, its on another computer and it doesn't like me right now.  I know they weren't among the top 25.

I have MHB and McMurry as an even matchup, how's that compare to your thinking?

[Ralph Turner]

...
Becker came in at #38 on my sheet out of 60.

The bottom on 5 my sheet were

56. Hartwick
57. Deleware Valley
58. Medgar Evers
59. Salve Regina
60. Wells.

Of my bottom 12 only Johnson And Wales won in the first round.

Where was J&W's opponent Ramapo ranked in your index?

I'll have to get back to you later on that one, its on another computer and it doesn't like me right now.  I know they weren't among the top 25.

I have MHB and McMurry as an even matchup, how's that compare to your thinking?

Yes, all three ASC teams are equal.  UMHB and McM seem to have UT-D's number, but in round robin play in the ASC, they end up with roughly the same records in a season.  UT-D may match up better against non-ASC national opponents, tho'.  It is really funny in this conference!

[Ralph Turner]

...
Becker came in at #38 on my sheet out of 60.

The bottom on 5 my sheet were

56. Hartwick
57. Deleware Valley
58. Medgar Evers
59. Salve Regina
60. Wells.

Of my bottom 12 only Johnson And Wales won in the first round.

Where was J&W's opponent Ramapo ranked in your index?

I'll have to get back to you later on that one, its on another computer and it doesn't like me right now.  I know they weren't among the top 25.

I have MHB and McMurry as an even matchup, how's that compare to your thinking?

Yes, all three ASC teams are equal.  UMHB and McM seem to have UT-D's number, but in round robin play in the ASC, they end up with roughly the same records in a season.  UT-D may match up better against non-ASC national opponents, tho'.  It is really funny in this conference!

Of course it is UMHB leading 35-19 with 2:00 minutes in the half.  UMHB is really hot tonight!

The Wisdom of Hoopsville

"You wanna play that first round game."


UMHB 58, McMurry 53;  5 minutes left.

UMHB 62, McMurry 59; 1:15 left.

It was 40-24 at the half.

UMHB 69 McM 67;  0:01.2 sec

Final -- UMHB 70 at McM 67

[sac]

Going into tonight, I had 3 games as statistical toss-ups.

Augustana 88 Hope 80 OT
Mary Hardin-Baylor 70 McMurry 67
Cabrini 91 Purchase 84

I had two games as statistical mismatches

UWSP 76 Luther 56
Williams 84 Becker 63