Pool C

[Titan Q]

La Crosse still has head to head win over Augustana and a sweep over Eau Claire with a 21-6 record but significant lower SOS and terrible NCSOS, if it gets pushed to secondary.  Will be interesting to see if they drop out of the final rankings or if the RAC decides to keep them above those two teams they've beat.

I agree that spots 7 and 8 in the Central - between Eau Claire, La Crosse, and Augustana (You Pick Two) - is really tight.

[Greek Tragedy]

Well, they've lost twice since the rankings came out and they haven't moved.

[Titan Q]

Well, they've lost twice since the rankings came out and they haven't moved.

The Central RAC used the head-to-head over NCC as long as they could.

The party is over now.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Well, they've lost twice since the rankings came out and they haven't moved.

The Central RAC used the head-to-head over NCC as long as they could.

The party is over now.

But that isn't changing the conversation from removing Benedictine completely from the rankings.

I just don't think Benedictine disappears from the convo here. I think the clues are undefeated in vRRO (including North Central which helps when looking at other teams other than NCC) and the fact that an SOS near .500 isn't a death nail like it has been in the past. We have seen that in several other places around Division III.

[Titan Q]

I just don't think Benedictine disappears from the convo here. I think the clues are undefeated in vRRO (including North Central which helps when looking at other teams other than NCC) and the fact that an SOS near .500 isn't a death nail like it has been in the past. We have seen that in several other places around Division III.

I think they are absolutely in the convo, but after losing 3 of their final 5 games (MSOE, Concordia WI, MSOE), their resume is no longer as good as the teams they are competing with.  For a while there they had a great WP to help balance the low SOS...that is no longer the case.

.769/.507/3-0 is just not good enough to be ranked ahead of Eau Claire and Augustana in my opinion.


* UW-Eau Claire: .704/.590/3-7
* Augustana: .720/.568/2-6
* UW-La Crosse: .778/.541/1-5
* Benedictine: .769/.507/3-0


I'm pretty sure BU comes in 4th there...or 3rd at best.  If 3rd, they are not ranked in the Central.

[Smitty Oom]

Saying you are undefeated against ranked teams is like saying MJ is the best basketball player because he never lost in the finals, but he lost multiple times in the earlier rounds, presumably teams that are worse they should have beat.  Meanwhile LBJ gets dinged for being 3-6 in the finals. Making it to the finals 9 times is incredible and should be rewarded.

DISCLAIMER: (Not saying MJ isn't the GOAT, just think the finals record is a weak argument)

[Greek Tragedy]

I just don't think Benedictine disappears from the convo here. I think the clues are undefeated in vRRO (including North Central which helps when looking at other teams other than NCC) and the fact that an SOS near .500 isn't a death nail like it has been in the past. We have seen that in several other places around Division III.

I think they are absolutely in the convo, but after losing 3 of their final 5 games (MSOE, Concordia WI, MSOE), their resume is no longer as good as the teams they are competing with.  For a while there they had a great WP to help balance the low SOS...that is no longer the case.

.769/.507/3-0 is just not good enough to be ranked ahead of Eau Claire and Augustana in my opinion.


* UW-Eau Claire: .704/.590/3-7
* Augustana: .720/.568/2-6
* UW-La Crosse: .778/.541/1-5
* Benedictine: .769/.507/3-0


I'm pretty sure BU comes in 4th there...or 3rd at best.  If 3rd, they are not ranked in the Central.

If you just put those numbers up as Team A and Team B, La Crosse would win that argument everytime for me.

[Onward on, John Carroll]

With the Wabash loss and John Carroll's second win over Marietta, is there any chance John Carroll would be considered or even get to the line for a pool C bid?

[Titan Q]

Adding assumed losses for Augustana and Eau Claire in the CCIW and WIAC title games, I would order these...

7. UW-La Crosse: .778 (21-6)/.541/3-5 (rank UW-Eau Claire and add 2 wins vs RRO)

8. UW-Eau Claire: .679 (19-9)/.589/3-8
-------

9. Benedictine: .769 (20-6)/.507/3-0

10. Augustana: .704 (19-8)/.568/2-7


I think Augustana is the team that is in the most trouble of the four -- meaning, they might be the lowest ranked team of the group.

[Titan Q]

With the Wabash loss and John Carroll's second win over Marietta, is there any chance John Carroll would be considered or even get to the line for a pool C bid?

John Carroll should now hit the board after Marietta and Wooster get in, and have a chance at the end.  The numbers/projections below are now a few days old, but I post it for context of the types of resumes John Carroll could be on the board win.  Their 3-3 RRO would put them in consideration here.

Round 19
AT - Eastern (MACF): .609/.561/4-5
C - UW-Eau Claire: .680/.580/2-7
E - Rochester (UAA): .667/.586/2-6
GL - Wabash (NCAC): .680/.545/1-5
MA - Muhlenberg (CC): .720/.522/1-4
NE - Trinity CT (NESCAC): .680/.547/3-4
S - Guilford (ODAC): .720/.550/2-4
W - Whitworth (NWC): .800/.520/1-2

Round 20
AT - Eastern (MACF): .609/.561/4-5
C - UW-Eau Claire: .680/.580/2-7
E - Rochester (UAA): .667/.586/2-6
GL - Wabash (NCAC): .680/.545/1-5
MA - Muhlenberg (CC): .720/.522/1-4
NE - Trinity CT (NESCAC): .680/.547/3-4
S - Guilford (ODAC): .720/.550/2-4
W - Loras (ARC): .680/.539/1-3

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I just don't think Benedictine disappears from the convo here. I think the clues are undefeated in vRRO (including North Central which helps when looking at other teams other than NCC) and the fact that an SOS near .500 isn't a death nail like it has been in the past. We have seen that in several other places around Division III.

I think they are absolutely in the convo, but after losing 3 of their final 5 games (MSOE, Concordia WI, MSOE), their resume is no longer as good as the teams they are competing with.  For a while there they had a great WP to help balance the low SOS...that is no longer the case.

.769/.507/3-0 is just not good enough to be ranked ahead of Eau Claire and Augustana in my opinion.


* UW-Eau Claire: .704/.590/3-7
* Augustana: .720/.568/2-6
* UW-La Crosse: .778/.541/1-5
* Benedictine: .769/.507/3-0


I'm pretty sure BU comes in 4th there...or 3rd at best.  If 3rd, they are not ranked in the Central.

If you just put those numbers up as Team A and Team B, La Crosse would win that argument everytime for me.

That 1-5 vs the 3-0 is going to make a big difference.  It always does.  Now, if Eau Claire gets ranked, that drastically improves LAX's vRRO to 3-5, and I think then they're a shoe-in.  Eau Claire is the rising tide that lifts all WIAC boats.

[Titan Q]

That 1-5 vs the 3-0 is going to make a big difference.  It always does.  Now, if Eau Claire gets ranked, that drastically improves LAX's vRRO to 3-5, and I think then they're a shoe-in.  Eau Claire is the rising tide that lifts all WIAC boats.

Yes, I think Eau Claire is a really safe bet to get ranked...and once they do, that boosts the UW-La Crosse resume in a huge way.  Picking up 2 RRO wins is enormous.

I think this is what, criteria wise, finally bumps Benedictine out (to #9).

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

That 1-5 vs the 3-0 is going to make a big difference.  It always does.  Now, if Eau Claire gets ranked, that drastically improves LAX's vRRO to 3-5, and I think then they're a shoe-in.  Eau Claire is the rising tide that lifts all WIAC boats.

Yes, I think Eau Claire is a really safe bet to get ranked...and once they do, that boosts the UW-La Crosse resume in a huge way.  Picking up 2 RRO wins is enormous.

I think this is what, criteria wise, finally bumps Benedictine out (to #9).

The funnier thing is that once Eau Claire is ranked, that 3-5 vRRO for LAX might keep LaCrosse ahead of Eau Claire due to the 2-0 head to head record.  It isn't a lock that it would happen (their NCSOS are very different), but if they don't get to the secondary criteria, it would be a tougher comparison.

Also, it's too bad Augie drew IWU and not Elmhurst.  The win over Elmhurst would help their Pool C resume more.

[Titan Q]

The funnier thing is that once Eau Claire is ranked, that 3-5 vRRO for LAX might keep LaCrosse ahead of Eau Claire due to the 2-0 head to head record.  It isn't a lock that it would happen (their NCSOS are very different), but if they don't get to the secondary criteria, it would be a tougher comparison.

Also, it's too bad Augie drew IWU and not Elmhurst.  The win over Elmhurst would help their Pool C resume more.

Yes, exactly.  Plus LaCrosse is 2-0 vs UW-Eau Claire.  That is why I went with...

Adding assumed losses for Augustana and Eau Claire in the CCIW and WIAC title games, I would order these...

7. UW-La Crosse: .778 (21-6)/.541/3-5 (rank UW-Eau Claire and add 2 wins vs RRO)

8. UW-Eau Claire: .679 (19-9)/.589/3-8
-------

9. Benedictine: .769 (20-6)/.507/3-0

10. Augustana: .704 (19-8)/.568/2-7


I think Augustana is the team that is in the most trouble of the four -- meaning, they might be the lowest ranked team of the group.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

It seems the WIAC is a near lock for three teams with a decent shot at four.  That's nuts.