Pool C

titanfan · February 21, 2006, 09:46:01 PM

Sac,

I'm pretty sure that for the 4 team "sectionals", all of the games are played at one site, as you described in your example. But for those 3 team sectionals, the first game is a home game for one of the two teams, and the winner of that game travels to the team that gets a bye.

In other words, if we remove Transy in your example,

North Central would play at Hope on Thursday night.
The winner of that game would then go to Calvin on Saturday to play.

Gregory Sager · February 21, 2006, 09:48:12 PM

Just to avoid confusion, we should keep the terminology straight. The sectionals are the Sweet Sixteen and Elite Eight games played on the second weekend of the tourney -- not the first- and second-round games played on the first weekend.

sac · February 21, 2006, 09:54:25 PM

Clearly we have confusion

I am strictly talking about FIRST and SECOND round games which will be played at ONE site.

........am I missing something.?

.........or is everyone else?

titanfan · February 21, 2006, 09:54:48 PM

Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 21, 2006, 09:48:12 PM
Just to avoid confusion, we should keep the terminology straight. The sectionals are the Sweet Sixteen and Elite Eight games played on the second weekend of the tourney -- not the first- and second-round games played on the first weekend.

Thanks for clarifying that Greg. I wasn't really sure what to call those, thus the quotes around sectionals. Maybe we could call them pods.

titanfan · February 21, 2006, 09:56:17 PM

Sac, I thought that was only true for the 4 team "pods". Since there are 5 teams that get a bye, we have 5 "pods" with only 3 teams. I believe the first round game in those 5 pods would be a home game for someone, and then the winner would travel to the bye team.

smedindy · February 21, 2006, 10:04:34 PM

Gregory -

Yes somehow, Tufts has 60 SOS points HIGHER than most of the rest of the NESCAC. They certainly are playing a tougher caliber of team than the rest of their mates.

AND by this time Massey will see right through a mediocre team with a bad SOS in a bad conference. Likewise a team with patsies dotting most of their schedule. They also played some NESCAC teams twice.

Gregory Sager · February 21, 2006, 10:12:24 PM

Quote from: titanfan on February 21, 2006, 09:56:17 PM
Sac, I thought that was only true for the 4 team "pods". Since there are 5 teams that get a bye, we have 5 "pods" with only 3 teams. I believe the first round game in those 5 pods would be a home game for someone, and then the winner would travel to the bye team.

Perhaps we can call the four-team pairings "pods" and the three-team pairings "tripods".

Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:04:34 PMYes somehow, Tufts has 60 SOS points HIGHER than most of the rest of the NESCAC. They certainly are playing a tougher caliber of team than the rest of their mates.

Again, though, that's completely relative to the region.

Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:04:34 PMAND by this time Massey will see right through a mediocre team with a bad SOS in a bad conference. Likewise a team with patsies dotting most of their schedule. They also played some NESCAC teams twice.

Again, who said that the NESCAC is a "bad conference"? I've said otherwise twice thus far in this conversation. And Tufts hasn't played any other NESCAC teams twice, unless you're talking about the conference tourney. Only the WAW and CBB triads play each other twice apiece.

smedindy · February 21, 2006, 10:17:45 PM

No, it's not completely relative to the region. That's compared NATIONALLY - they have a top 50 schedule. You don't get that high up by picking on the patsies, even IN region.

I realize the NE is bad. I do the power ratings and they always have a lot of the bottom 10, but Tufts isn't playing those clowns.

And my statement about mediocre teams beating up on horrid teams was about the teams that Tufts plays, not the NESCAC. The Massey ratings would penalize Tufts if it played teams like that, in both their power ranking AND in their SOS. That's what I was talking about. Teams like Norwich, who have a Massey of 273 and a SOS of 380.

I apologize, I didn't realize that second Williams game was a conference tourney game.

David Collinge · February 21, 2006, 10:22:26 PM

I believe the NCAA-sanctioned term for the first and second round games, regardless of whether they are tripods or quadropods, is "regionals."

formerbant10 · February 21, 2006, 10:25:14 PM

Mr. Sager has it dead on for Tufts. Williams was the only repeat game and that was in the conference tourney.

The biggest difference between Tufts schedule and some of the others is that the teams Tufts historically plays are having better years than the teams that, for example, Trinity has played. Tufts has Keene St. Mass-Boston, Mass-Dartmouth, and MIT all having decent to good years. Trinity has Eastern CT (I'm aware they lost this game), Western CT, Babson, Clark, Springfield, and Lasell all having down years compared to the previous few.

So Tufts @ Plymouth, @ Keene, @ Wheaton are all very good wins for QOWI because they are in region.

And 3 of Trinity's best wins vs. Cortland St, @ Franklin & Marshall, @ Ursinus are all great wins, but aren't worth a dime for QOWI because they are out of region.

Look at Trinity's schedule last year, even with all their losses their QOWI was higher than some tournament teams because Western CT had a great year, Springfield had a great year, Rhode Island College had a great year.

Throughout the years, the schedules of these teams do not change much. Many of the out-of-conference games are rich with tradition and have been played for many years now. This year just happens to have Tufts opponents doing better.

smedindy · February 21, 2006, 10:29:50 PM

Yeah, but I'm not talking about that infernal QOWI, though, in my arguements.

sac · February 21, 2006, 10:30:19 PM

Quote from: titanfan on February 21, 2006, 09:56:17 PM
Sac, I thought that was only true for the 4 team "pods". Since there are 5 teams that get a bye, we have 5 "pods" with only 3 teams. I believe the first round game in those 5 pods would be a home game for someone, and then the winner would travel to the bye team.

Ok if thats the case I simply gave an initial poor example

formerbant10 · February 21, 2006, 10:33:28 PM

I understand you're not talking about the QOWI.

What I was trying to say (my apologies if it wasn't clear) about Tufts is that their schedule does not change too much year to year. The reason why their SOS is higher this year is because the teams they are playing in New England (and have been forever) are winning their games this year.

It also helps to have Wittenberg on your schedule.

I wasn't trying to disagree with you on Tufts schedule, just trying to shed some more light on the subject.

Gregory Sager · February 21, 2006, 10:42:17 PM

Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:17:45 PM
No, it's not completely relative to the region. That's compared NATIONALLY - they have a top 50 schedule. You don't get that high up by picking on the patsies, even IN region.

It's still relative, because that's the database from which Tufts' power rating is constructed. No matter whether they're twice removed or three times removed from the dregs of the region in terms of games played, you're still talking about strata within a degraded database. The surest antidote to counteracting the degraded database (the inferior level of play within the region as a whole) is to make the best teams play each other more, i.e., having the NESCAC play a double round-robin.

smedindy · February 21, 2006, 10:44:36 PM

Thanks, I appreciate the info. And having Wittenberg does help, for sure.

I was surprised myself to see a NESCAC team with that high of a SOS but all the cards must have fallen right with Tufts.

Greg - I would agree the NESCAC needs to play a double round robin. However, Tufts this year is not playing the degraded teams at all. They seem to have avoided the SOS killers like Norwich, et. al.