MBB: Colonial States Athletic Conference

[mailsy]

I'm not adverse to change.  But sometimes changing something still doesn't make it work.    Change for the sake of change doesn't work either.  I've seen both.   

This G Wash situation is just weird if you ask me.

It's a good thing no one is asking you.  But I agree.  I don't know how old you are hIdeUmm.  But sometimes young people do stupid things.  Even with good role models, sometimes young people do things that those of us who are older and wiser would not do.  ie Michael Phelps

[IUuKno]

Hardly change for the sake of change, but if you didn't see the issue I was addressing before you can always re-read 

[hIdeUmm]

You get really sensitive when posters come at gwash. how many time does a young person have to make a bad decisions before he hurts the team? so he did something stupid and sits out the semi final game.  he sits out for how long and then is a no show in the biggest game cabrini has had in YEARS. the second best player or best player based on opinion and he is on the bench because of a stupid decision? is this ok by cabrini standards?


And no one asked you to respond and post about the neutral site for the championship but you took the liberty so i thought id chime in :-) :-) :-)

[mailsy]

Congratulations to both GMC(#5) and Cabrini(#7) for being ranked regionally this past week. 

Hardly change for the sake of change, but if you didn't see the issue I was addressing before you can always re-read 

I did read and reread.  I'm making the statement and my opinion is that the current format works well for most schools.  Because your gym only can handle so few people, get a bigger gym.  Because you would rather see a neutral site doesn't make my opinion any less relevant.     Also, what I say doesn't make yours any less relevant either. 

You get really sensitive when posters come at gwash. how many time does a young person have to make a bad decisions before he hurts the team? so he did something stupid and sits out the semi final game.  he sits out for how long and then is a no show in the biggest game cabrini has had in YEARS. the second best player or best player based on opinion and he is on the bench because of a stupid decision? is this ok by cabrini standards?


And no one asked you to respond and post about the neutral site for the championship but you took the liberty so i thought id chime in :-) :-) :-)

I'm not sensitive to him.  I was making a point. If you noticed the  you would also realized I was joshing.  What he did was really stupid and he won't get any more chances.  This is his fault he was the one who let his team down, his coaches his fellow students and the fans of the team down.  His teammates decided that he wouldn't play and they came through in spite of him.  I would maybe even sit him for the game at GMC to make a point.  I am by no means defending what he did.  I was very disappointed in his actions.  But these kids are college students.  Sometimes college students do really stupid things.  Sometimes we forget the things we did as youth.  Maybe this will be his wake up call and if not he will be off the team.  So I'm not defending his actions, I was trying to put things into perspective.  8)

[lefty2]

This argument is not going to go anywhere.  It alll sounds so wonderful. But this is not D1.  Most of the other gyms have capacity of greater than a 1000. ( BBC-1500, Cab-1200, Cent 1200, GMC-1200, Keystone-1000). The others (Marywood 800, PBU-800, NC-300) have less. 

If Marywood's gym only holds 800 people, we all need to go on a diet!

[IUuKno]

haha yea there is no way that is the figure on the new facility which might be the nicest in the league

[Wolfpac]

Hey lets relax here it was just a suggestion. And remember Cabrini's gym doubles the size of Immaculata (which holds 660 people by the way). Last year the players stood in line for tickets to their own game. The students were allowed to buy 1. GMC fans didnt show up to support the Griffins so more IU fans got in HOWEVER, HALF the tickets were available to GMC they just didnt utilize them. i believe it is a CSAC rule that HALF the tickets MUST BE available to the other school so in the end is that really Home Court advantage with the fans?


This G Wash situation is just weird if you ask me.


With him they have a chance but i think its a 89- 80 GMC game with him.
Without him its 93-74 GMC.


BUT YET AGAIN THATS WHY THEY PLAY THE GAME!

If you knew the whole situation about GW you would not be questioning the circumstances.  It is not for anyone else to worry about it.  Between coach, player, and school.  Relax....GW is a fine young man.  If you were in the situation it would make sense. Lets move on.  Will he play? you will have to wait and see.

The neutral site concept is unacceptable.  Dig into some endowment funds and build a larger facility.   Parking and many other variables come into play as well as Title 9 expenditures so the issue is dead it will never happen.   If you saw some of the bands that took up 2 whole sections at the Dixon Center during  a couple of tournament games you would understand completely.  Not another school's fault how ticket sales are handled.  I think GMC and Cabrini do a pretty good job. Consequently when a school earns the right to have a home game advantage it should not be denied due to constraints.  Watch the game on Closed circuit TV like Neuman does and let life go on........ Mailsy get there early.

Oh well, Mailsy this weekend is GMC/ Cabrini men and women for the first CSAC championships in basketball.  Should be  war do not under estimate coaching abilities.  Get the buses ready Mailsy.  GMC just loves those Cavs fans coming up there from next door.  May the best team win.

[Wolfpac]

Sorry I forgot to mention, the crowd does not win the game.  The ball has to go into the basket.

[mailsy]

This argument is not going to go anywhere.  It alll sounds so wonderful. But this is not D1.  Most of the other gyms have capacity of greater than a 1000. ( BBC-1500, Cab-1200, Cent 1200, GMC-1200, Keystone-1000). The others (Marywood 800, PBU-800, NC-300) have less. 

If Marywood's gym only holds 800 people, we all need to go on a diet!

+1
I was only reading from the D3hoops number about gym capacity.

[Coach C]

On the neutral site - In the days before the PAC, some of the local schools played in the ESAC that had a championship weekend at a site that rotated among the members.  It was a great atmosphere and really made for a fun weekend of getting to know players, coaches and fans from the other teams.  A few other conferences have, at times played at a larger local venue similar to Villanova's pavillion.

It's not impossible to do it, but my guess is that it's not going to happen.

On Glenn Washington.  Let's hope he has learned his lesson and this series of problems has concluded. 

[Wolfpac]

On the neutral site - In the days before the PAC, some of the local schools played in the ESAC that had a championship weekend at a site that rotated among the members.  It was a great atmosphere and really made for a fun weekend of getting to know players, coaches and fans from the other teams.  A few other conferences have, at times played at a larger local venue similar to Villanova's pavillion.

It's not impossible to do it, but my guess is that it's not going to happen.

On Glenn Washington.  Let's hope he has learned his lesson and this series of problems has concluded. 

Ahhhh .... Coach C.  I remember those District 19/ Keystone Athletic Conference, NAIA, EPAC, and ECAC championships very well in the 80's and 90's.   Brings chills back.   In those circumstances I would agree with you about a neutral site game.  In light of this in today's world in the CSAC conference championships I do not think it is warranted.  The most recent memory of a neutral site game was the regionals at Catholic University. What a weekend of shopping and fun.  The gym was roped off in 4 sections each day with different tickets all day long for the events of hoops. The Cavs met up with E'town in the Sweet 16 and lost it in the last seconds on a 3 with a bad screen.  Anyhow....it was fun, educational, and one was exposed to many opinions and styles of bball with the forum created by the playoff site.  It was truly fun to have a vested interest and become more exposed to the coaches, fans, and players across the region. Catholic U. did a good job in organizing such an event as well.

To this end, I believe in the current situation a neutral site would only be feasible if enough interest was generated for the games before the tourney.  At this level in this region saturated with D1 and D2 schools it would not work.  I understand the passion amongst the posters and new posters who have small facilities similiar to a sardine can but that is life.

Please understand Hide, Tony, Iukno, Mailsy, Chair, Lefty, and even the mighty Chizwiz I believe understands but although there is interest in our handful of people here it does not warrant a neutral site.  We should be glad our discussions are positive in terms of survival of the conference with an automatic bid not being the topic of discussion rather than a neutral location.   Perhaps someday in the future if finances and academics allow the growth of D3 in the region to blossom in an athletic sense when they realize these smaller institutions with low enrollments are on the map could enough interest be generated to establish a neutral site. 

Personally for what my opinion is worth... I think all you guys are great that post and if we had our way because of the creation of P. Coleman and D3 perhaps with more fan interest and voting in conference if the institution size grows we could establish a neutral site with a rotation of staff.  Kind of think it would be a positive thing for all aspects of an institution regarding communication, media, production, staffing etc.. for all the conference institutions.  There would probably be many double headers available to see for all but logistically the conference would need to coordinate a cost effective travel budget for some institutions.  With Title 9 and equal expenditures as well as time slots for women it could be a problem.   I think with the small enrollment in our institutions it would not work without a large following each game.    Again, I understand the passion of our posters who have to deal with small facilities when they may have a real basketball program developing without them having a voice in facility development or planning but this is D3 not D1 unfortunately.   Sorry to dissappoint anyone with a small facility or parking area but it is a sad fact of life.  Imagine IU or Rosemont men or women going to the Final Four and not getting a larger facility with a serious program.  The admin has to be on board with all of you guys sadly. 

Sorry to babble at all of you just an opinion from the Wolf.  Perhaps with some lobbying efforts by the students to generate some interest things may change in some ways for the better.   We should be grateful though for the play in our conference.  It could have been much worse.  Keystone, and Centenary , Baptist Bible, and despite the record Phil Bible are assets. Maybe when those teams come of age, things will change and we will be talking about how it was without neutral sites in our older years.

Enjoy the tourney.......Wolfpac...   Oh yeah, you can win with GW or without GW if you notice.  It would be nice to have him back in the line-up to cut down some nets.

[lefty2]

Actually, the PAC utilized the Final Four format up until at least the 2000-2001 season.

The semi's and finals were played at the top seed on Friday/Saturday.

It didn't solve the "small gym complex," but it was exciting, except when the host got upset in the semi's.

[Wolfpac]

Actually, the PAC utilized the Final Four format up until at least the 2000-2001 season.

The semi's and finals were played at the top seed on Friday/Saturday.

It didn't solve the "small gym complex," but it was exciting, except when the host got upset in the semi's.

Thats right Lefty, just that the Cavs have not been in too many finals in the PAC recently so I forgot.   Your point is taken about the host losing.  Amazingly the crowd does not win the game despite the emotions and cheering.  Love those hecklers during the free throws. It is pure fun except when the students get a little carried away and disrespect someone on the personal level.   A larger facility is convenient though for the fans with a more comfortable seating arrangement instead of getting crushed by someone 390 lbs sitting next to you and breathing heavily with a nasty smell from dinner even with breath mints and perfume or cologne.

Sorry for the detailed account but you never know what you are going to get when you are packed into a sardine can in the heat of the moment unless you sit with all your peers.

My issue has been and do not mean to disrespect or discredit an official but it seems the quality of refs has gone down.  There is not a consistent crew out there lately.  I just do not understand how at this level the officials are not more highly trained so the game is not impacted negatively. I could not do better I admit but so much is on the line in the competitive nature of the games and bad calls need to be minimized especially in the playoffs.  Seems it is tick for tack and the game cannot flow especially when a ref is standing 3ft away and blows the call.  Then an official 20 yards away blows the whistle as they rotate the floor and bail out the other guy.  I have seen so much of this lately.  It is disgusting for both teams.   Missed calls are a fact of life but they are not doing the best job lately.   Perhaps the commissioner needs to come out to the games more often.   Not crying about it but it destroys a game played at a high level when the crowd and coach see the obvious nothing called then a make up call down the other end on a ticky tack foul destroying the flow of the game.   The 5 second rule and 3 second rule is gone it seems as well as a moving pick or screen which I see countless times.  Getting ridiculous.......anyone else feel that way?   Sometimes on a busy Saturday filled with games you one that cannot run the floor.

[mailsy]

It is going to be a fun night tomorrow at the Griffin Complex.  I expect a hard fought game.  I know it will be tough for the Cavs.  GMC is very talented and deadly at home.  But it's not over.  Nothing is over.  It wasn't over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor and it's not over til the fat lady sings.  I think Cabrini has a shot.  Slim.  8) But that's why they play the games. Last year GMC was the heavy favorite in the women's championship and Cabrini came through.  So why not the men this year.  Good luck Cabrini.

GO CAVS BEAT GWYNEDD!!!  8)  8)  8)

[IUuKno]

"Never tell a young person that anything cannot be done. God may have been waiting centuries for someone ignorant enough of the impossible to do that very thing."

Lots of action here I like it...even when there are only two teams left....Well let me say one last thing bout the neutral site thing i started, which brought on discussion and was good, but anyway I wasnt trying to start a facebook group (modern day picketting) about it and demand immediate action I was simply throwing an idea out there for consideration at some point...as a former MAC I can tell you that we would have played that game outside in the freezing cold if it meant all our family, friends and fans could have watched, and I am well aware a new gym at IU is probably not on the top of a laundry list of renovations but enough of that...

As for an issue that may come up and Wolf glanced over...in what circumstances can the automatic bid be taken away?  I am just curious if anyone has insight on whether there is some sort of conference evaluation method done periodically or something....

And as for officiating...God knows we have had some characters ref in this league...just a personal opinon, but high school refs should stick to high school its a different game and when you get some of these guys bouncing between college and high school they usually very good, just throwing that out there

*the beggining of that quote is what mattered, im not suggesting anyone is ignorant*