MBB: Colonial States Athletic Conference

[mailsy]

Last year Wesley won 92-77 at home. Lemons was gone. But Aaron was there he played in just his second game. Played 26 minutes and had 15 points. Game was tied at 74 with less 4 minutes to go. Cabrini only scored 3 points the rest of the way. Missed to many shots. Went 1-11 from the field and 0-2 from the line at the end whereas Wesley went 12-13 at the line and was 3-5 from the field.

I see a different game on the 3rd. But there is a whole lot of basketball to be played before then.

[Clutch]

Cabrini needs to move to another conference Mailsy, that conference is not strong. Not taking anything away from Cabrini, but they may not be undefeated if they played night in and night out against better conference opponents, they have played tougher out of conf games this year and proven themselves on the road in the tourney, but from today until Wesley they should win every game with ease.  Waiting for the CSAC conference to fold.

[lefty2]

Cabrini needs to move to another conference Mailsy, that conference is not strong. Not taking anything away from Cabrini, but they may not be undefeated if they played night in and night out against better conference opponents, they have played tougher out of conf games this year and proven themselves on the road in the tourney, but from today until Wesley they should win every game with ease.  Waiting for the CSAC conference to fold.

Why should Cabrini leave the CSAC and where should they go?

[CCHoopster]

Cabrini needs to move to another conference Mailsy, that conference is not strong. Not taking anything away from Cabrini, but they may not be undefeated if they played night in and night out against better conference opponents, they have played tougher out of conf games this year and proven themselves on the road in the tourney, but from today until Wesley they should win every game with ease.  Waiting for the CSAC conference to fold.

Why would the CSAC fold? Not every conference is going to be the NESCAC, ODAC ect.... Maybe some of the schools in the CSAC need to simply recruit better players.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

CSAC isn't going any where and honestly Cabrini isn't either... I do see a conference where Cabrini fits in with all of their sports, academic standards, etc. For now... that is where Cabrini is residing.

[Clutch]

OK, it just that I remember when Cabrini played Alvernia, Allentown (desales) Eastern, Misericordia, night in and night out, not tiny little schools, I would have thought Cabrini would have been in the MAC, just had a hunch this conference would not survive to much longer if the economy takes a worse turn with some of the schools in this conference.  There would probably be someone else to fill in if a program folds I guess, so the conference will go on as long as kids are coming to the school.  Could see Cabrini in the Capital too.

[Clutch]

Please, not saying Cabrini does not play a tough schedule out of conference, just some of their numbers may not be as good statistically if they had to play in a better conference, your point is well taken about the conference needing to recruit better athletes, but, their budgets restrict them when a school has financial issues. Seems as if some choose to go to a community college to save money then transfer, and in Cabrini's geographical area there is a saturation of colleges and universities in the Philadelphia area to compete with all the small schools.  Did not mean to ruffle any feathers guys.

[lefty2]

Please, not saying Cabrini does not play a tough schedule out of conference, just some of their numbers may not be as good statistically if they had to play in a better conference, your point is well taken about the conference needing to recruit better athletes, but, their budgets restrict them when a school has financial issues. Seems as if some choose to go to a community college to save money then transfer, and in Cabrini's geographical area there is a saturation of colleges and universities in the Philadelphia area to compete with all the small schools.  Did not mean to ruffle any feathers guys.

I'm not ruffled.  I was just wondering.

[Clutch]

Thanks Lefty, hey noticed Wesley won again.  Cabrini and Wesley game is really shaping up to be a good one.
Could mean hosting a playoff game if these teams stay hot.

[kate]

Truly, I live for the day when people stop referencing "academic standards" when they're discussing Division 3 sports.  Size and locations of colleges are the most important.  NO ONE knows the academic credentials of a student athlete but the registrar's office.  IMHO it's just wrong to keep harping on it!

[sunny]

Truly, I live for the day when people stop referencing "academic standards" when they're discussing Division 3 sports.  Size and locations of colleges are the most important.  NO ONE knows the academic credentials of a student athlete but the registrar's office.  IMHO it's just wrong to keep harping on it!

It's not simply about "academic standards," but I do think a lot of schools desire to be in conferences with schools whom they often recruit students and student-athletes directly against. Obviously, there are some for whom that is never going to be entirely possible (Merchant Marine, for example) and I do think this pertains especially to the Northeast and Mid-Atlantic geographic areas of the country because of the high concentration of all sorts of schools (though the SAA and UAA are two examples of conferences who are very spread out geographically but choose to align themselves with what they consider are "similar schools.")  For the schools in the Northwest Conference, they don't have much choice due to geographic realities, unless they wanted to leave Division III, for example. The NEAC is also a conference with a very different mission, so to speak. It has found a niche as a Northeast/Mid-Atlantic conference for schools who cannot find another league or who are just transitioning into Division III and will eventually be planning a move to another conference. There is really nothing wrong with the reason any specific conference exists at the Division III level, just as there's nothing inherently wrong about a school deciding another conference might be a better fit, for whatever reason.

I will concede that "like-minded" is a phrase that has been co-opted by liberal arts schools who want to make a statement about the quality of their education without actually having the guts to do so. That's not the original meaning behind the phrase, however.

[lefty2]

Truly, I live for the day when people stop referencing "academic standards" when they're discussing Division 3 sports.  Size and locations of colleges are the most important.  NO ONE knows the academic credentials of a student athlete but the registrar's office.  IMHO it's just wrong to keep harping on it!

Kate,

Don't kid yourself about who knows a student's academic credentials.

Coaches know if they can get a recruit accepted at their institution and find it frustrating when a player who couldn't get into school A goes on to be a star at school B - in the same conference.

While most of the institutions in your beloved MAC are similar in size and cost, there is a wide range of academic standards.  Hence, the reason some schools chose to leave and compete against 'like-minded' institutions.

[kate]

Sunny and Lefty - would I ever love to have a sit down conversation with both of you!    Like the Patriot League, the vast number of D3 schools here in the east are highly competitive, for general students and student athletes.  I can see some college president saying "we have to establish a brand here".  Make people think that we're totally "cerebral".  Sports are a pleasant by-product.  o.K., the Patriot League now awards scholarships.   Moravian is just about 5 miles from my home, and my brother is a Super proud Lehigh grad.  I do read the newspapers, and much of what I read makes me wonder about "like-minded".  To play the devil's advocate here, I'd much rather have any kid on a playing field or court than trying to rob me or rip me off.  To quote a tremendous slogan - "a mind is a terrible thing to waste".   Lefty, I sure wish you appreciated the MAC the way I have for the last 17 years!

[sunny]

To play the devil's advocate here, I'd much rather have any kid on a playing field or court than trying to rob me or rip me off.

I'm not sure what this has to do with the topic of schools aligning themselves athletically with schools that they recruit against for students. I in no way would question the value of any college nor anyone's pursuit of higher education, be it a doctorate or a six-month pre-professional program.

Division III is a big tent and I'm glad it is made up of a wide variety of schools. At the conference level, schools can organize for whatever reason they see fit - number of sports, size of school, geographic location, majors, similar profile among incoming students, religious affiliation, state university system association, even access to an AQ. I don't see any problem in that whatsoever.

[Clutch]

Kate, you have me confused, you are the one that brought up academic standards, my post regarding  Cabrini, and recruits suggests financial stability of the college, the location , and the saturation of colleges in the Philly suburbs. I did not mention anything about academic standards.  Its all about the allocation of money in one way or another. Not to mention the support an institution could provide to help a student succeed both on and off the court. To quote Sunny, "Division III is a big tent" is a good thing.  The variety offers a tailored education and academic experience for all types of students. I have seen it first hand with a student not being accepted to a college because of academic ability, then goes onto a different institution succeeds both on and off court, only because an institution gave him or her a shot at it,  the academic standards are something regulated by the state, or the accreditation body not sure what you mean.  Unless you are referring to the aptitude or intelligence of the prospective student?  I would also think that SAT scores come into play more for selecting a "cerebral" school.  I guess it depends if you are going to school to play sports, get an education, or both.