MBB: Colonial States Athletic Conference

[chairman]

Ralph-

Almost all the current PAC Schools sit somewhere inside the geographic range of the new MAC Commonwealth. With Widener already there, and Arcadia joining, the bulk of the PAC fit inside the triangle formed by those two and Albright.

In terms of going outside the league to attract quality teams into the conference, it is probably going to be difficult to do. No MAC teams seem uncomfortable enough to leave, and certainly no Centennial schools are on their way out, so it comes down to the NEAC or schools without conference affiliation. There are schools with sufficient academic credibility, but without really deep athletic programs.

The ironic thing for Arcadia is that they fled the PAC to try to associate with a "more exclusive and academic" group of schools. That Alvernia, which fits neither description, is joining them from the PAC has got to have Arcadia's President spitting fire.

I know that the Arcadia and Wesley moves caught no one by surprise. I would be interested to know how many of the Presidents and or Conference office personnel saw the Alvernia/Miseri moves coming.

[Ralph Turner]

+1 Chairman!  That helps me understand that area of the country better.

There are no "independents".

As I see the academic pecking/prestige order, may I assume that it approximates this:

1) Centennial
2) Landmark
3a & b) MAC's
4) PennAC
5) NEAC

On the periphery we have the Capital at about a "solid 3"; Skyline, a "3";  NJAC a "very solid 3, weak 2".

Just a rough guess...

Thanks!

[chizwiz]

Ralph, that seems correct.

[WolfPAC]

As for AQ's what happens in the PAC?

Who is going to leave the NEAC?  Would it not be a step up for anyone from there to join the PAC leaving it even more dilluted?

May as well just combine the pac and neac and make one conference with 2 divisions then.

[WolfPAC]

Could this be good for the PAC though in terms of better competition though Chiz?

Instead of Marywoods and Rosemonts?? 

[NEPAFAN]

This about sums it up...

http://www.thetimes-tribune.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=18076204&BRD=2185&PAG=461&dept_id=416049&rfi=6

[WolfPAC]

Where does this leave the PAC?

What schools will fill in as the MAC situation that took place?

Centenary?  Baptist Bible?  Chestnut Hill? 

How is this good for the PAC?

[hoopzwiz]

Being from Scranton, the Miseri rumors have been flying for years.  Frankly, I'm surprised it has taken so long for them to be invited.

As for Alvernia, thats shocking to me.
They don't seem to be a good fit for the league as far as the "like academic institutions" goes.  In addition, a move to the Commonwealth would make more sense.  In Reading, great rivalry with Albright.  Plus, Alvernia in the Freedom pushes Arcadia to the other side. 
Apparently someone didn't want Alvernia in the Commonwealth. 
Maybe the school down the street?

[gamefan]

Centenary is in to replace Wesley or Arcadia for next year as was reported earlier this year.
Baptist Bible was discussed but there was no more on that subject.

I am surprised that Marywood did not jump out for travel reasons!

Wolfpac any word from your favorite school on coaching candidates?

[hoopzwiz]

Centenary is in to replace Wesley or Arcadia for next year as was reported earlier this year.
Baptist Bible was discussed but there was no more on that subject.

I am surprised that Marywood did not jump out for travel reasons!

Wolfpac any word from your favorite school on coaching candidates?

Perhaps there's nowhere for Marywood to jump.
It would be foolish to leave if noone is inviting you in.

[Jon]

Being from Scranton, the Miseri rumors have been flying for years.  Frankly, I'm surprised it has taken so long for them to be invited.

As for Alvernia, thats shocking to me.
They don't seem to be a good fit for the league as far as the "like academic institutions" goes.  In addition, a move to the Commonwealth would make more sense.  In Reading, great rivalry with Albright.  Plus, Alvernia in the Freedom pushes Arcadia to the other side. 
Apparently someone didn't want Alvernia in the Commonwealth. 
Maybe the school down the street?

Hoops, I agree with you on your alignment opinion due to our location, but I'm pretty sure  our soccer and field hockey coaches aren't organizing a push for Commonwealth alignment.  I'd be interested to hear your academic perception of the Vern.  The school is working hard to contintually improve academic standing, but I don't think current standings warrant shock at our invitation.

[WolfPAC]

Centenary is in to replace Wesley or Arcadia for next year as was reported earlier this year.
Baptist Bible was discussed but there was no more on that subject.

I am surprised that Marywood did not jump out for travel reasons!

Wolfpac any word from your favorite school on coaching candidates?

game...

All is quiet on the Western front at the moment... only rumor known to me is that somehow the position will be full-time.   Why the hell did they get rid of Dzik?

It is the hope of many that someone from the Dzik era will take the job according to some prior posts as well.    Don't know anything.  Just hoping the AD is on top of her game over there this time.

If the president leaves..... all kinds of possibilities could occur.

[WolfPAC]

Jon,

Objectively speaking,  how do you view the strength of the PAC without the Vern and Mis.. ?

[Jon]

I'll keep this strickly basketball since I am posting on d3hoops.com...

Clearly the strength takes a hit initially, but there's promise in the rapid growth at Immaculata.  The consistency in competition could improve rapidly in the near future.  The new facilities at Marywood should help the recruiting up there.  GMC should be able to build around another solid post player in Smith.  At the end of the day, success is all about recruiting.  Smart coaches will find ways to take advantage of whatever their situation to bring in talent.

[chairman]

Jon-

Had Susquehanna, Juniata, Scranton and the like stayed in, Alvernia might have felt a little out of place with the top end of the conference, but there are several schools in the Freedom now that are not traditionally academic powerhouses. I wouild agree that Albright would want no part of an Alvernia in the Commonwealth, and that the field hockey and soccer coaches want no part of the Commonwealth. That being said. There is no guaranteeing that those in the MAC now are staying. It would not surprise me at all to see at least one more move to the Landmark.

One thing in Conference affiliations that is interesting is that perceived academic quality is way more important than actual academic strength. While I have no doubt that the Vern has strengthened themselves academically and worked to bring in higher and higher level students, it is surprising that they were able to convince the people in the MAC of that on a level sufficient to be granted acceptance. On the other hand, your point Jon, and mine earlier, is that the MAC has lost a little bit of the brass on it's star academically (which is fine by me) with the defections to the Landmark.

A thought on the NJAC Ralph. The conference is incredibly diverse in terms of academic quality, admissions standards, etc. TCNJ has a very good reputation, and would really fit right in the Landmark (except for the fact that no one in that Conference was in the mood to get their brains beat in EVERYTHING-except basketball really). There are schools at the other end of the spectrum that are really fancy junior colleges. The admissions standards are minimal, graduation rates small, and tuition extremely cheap. So the NJAC is tough to put in a slot.

Other than that, you hit things on the head pretty well. The 4's want to be 3's the 3's want to be two's and the two's know that the Centennial will never open it's doors, so they try to keep their club as exclusive as they can, which is why the Landmark Conference was founded.

The big problem the Landmark had was that they brought in Stevens, but Stevens forgot to come along, and then there was scrambling. As I mentioned before, I don't think the whole thing is done.