MBB: NEWMAC

[Hugenerd]

Since they did not play each other, in my view the only other way to say one is better is indeed to use the progress throught the NCAAs as the measuring stick.  In my mind, there is not doubt that MIT is better.  MIT is the best team I have seen over the last year as actually using the inside game.  It frees up their outside shooters.  Saw Amherst last year at WPI and while thier guards where exceptional, their interoir game was not a focus of what they did.  They have talented guys but they are under-utilized.

Bottom line, MIT is the BEST team from this region, opinions can differ, the RESULTS do not!  They are the only one left standing from the Northeast, if you think someone is better, then they should be still playing!

I still have reservations about MITs depth, but they have proven on the court so far it is not a hinderance.  I do however fear they will have major issues after next year if coach Anderson plays the big 4 over 30 minutes a game again.

In 05-06, Bartolotta's freshman year, we had a deep senior class and some talented young players (I say 'we' because I was an assistant that year) and played at least 10 deep.  I think it depends on Anderson's comfort level with the maturity and intensity of the players.  He isn't going to put someone out there that he feels is not ready, when there is someone in front of him he feels he can play almost the entire game without having a dropoff in productivity.

[Hugenerd]

Here is an article from after the CSI game on Friday, kind words from TJ Tibbs on Mitch Kates:

"We had an opportunity to win and the better team won," said Tibbs, who had a remarkable 40-point showing last Saturday night in a 77-67 win over Rhode Island College to clinch CSI's first Sweet 16 appearance. "Mitchell Kates was just outstanding tonight. I think he was the difference. He's a great player on a great team."

http://www.silive.com/colleges/index.ssf/2012/03/college_of_staten_island_mens_17.html

[Hugenerd]

All region teams announced,  Hollingsworth 2nd team, Kates 3rd team.  Berthiaume gets first team, Carr 4th team.  I honestly dont understand how you can rate Berthiaume as a better guard than Kates, unless all you look at is ppg.  All of Kates' stats are better besides ppg, and he is doing it on a much better team where he has to share shots with a much better players.  I hope that Kates gets more consideration for AA after everyone has seen what he can do against the best competition in the country.

http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-region/2011-12/northeast-men

Anderson named coach of the year for the region

[Pat Coleman]

All region teams announced,  Hollingsworth 2nd team, Kates 3rd team.  Berthiaume gets first team, Carr 4th team.  I honestly dont understand how you can rate Berthiaume as a better guard than Kates, unless all you look at is ppg.

Why did the people who saw him night in and night out vote him NEWMAC athlete of the year, then?

[Hugenerd]

All region teams announced,  Hollingsworth 2nd team, Kates 3rd team.  Berthiaume gets first team, Carr 4th team.  I honestly dont understand how you can rate Berthiaume as a better guard than Kates, unless all you look at is ppg.

Why did the people who saw him night in and night out vote him NEWMAC athlete of the year, then?

I was confused by that also (see my earlier posts).  I believe that the process in the NEWMAC is the coach only nominates 1 player for POY, so Coach Anderson may have nominated Hollingsworth and therefore people thought Berthiaume deserved it over Hollingsworth.  Kates numbers may not jump off the page at you for the regular season, but anyone that has seen him play knows his value to the team and his overall talent.  In the tourney he has taken more responsibility and the results are obvious.  He is an unselfish guy, so he has no problem letting the bigs score if that is where the advantage is, and that is a lot of what has happened during the regular season. I have no doubt that if he really wanted to average 20 ppg, he could have, but that would not have been what was best for the team in the long haul.

I've seen Berthiaume play at least 5 times this year and clearly you know my opinion.

[mass_d3fan]

Congrats to the NEWMAC players who were selected All-Region!!!!

I do agree with you HN...Kates MUST be ahead of Berthiaume.  Berthiaume is deserving of  All-Region, just not ahead of Kates.

[Pat Coleman]

All region teams announced,  Hollingsworth 2nd team, Kates 3rd team.  Berthiaume gets first team, Carr 4th team.  I honestly dont understand how you can rate Berthiaume as a better guard than Kates, unless all you look at is ppg.

Why did the people who saw him night in and night out vote him NEWMAC athlete of the year, then?

I was confused by that also (see my earlier posts).  Maybe votes were split between MIT players (Hollingsworth vs. Kates)?

I've seen Berthiaume play at least 5 times this year and clearly you know my opinion.

I knew your opinion before you offered it. MIT uber alles.

[Hugenerd]

All region teams announced,  Hollingsworth 2nd team, Kates 3rd team.  Berthiaume gets first team, Carr 4th team.  I honestly dont understand how you can rate Berthiaume as a better guard than Kates, unless all you look at is ppg.

Why did the people who saw him night in and night out vote him NEWMAC athlete of the year, then?

I was confused by that also (see my earlier posts).  Maybe votes were split between MIT players (Hollingsworth vs. Kates)?

I've seen Berthiaume play at least 5 times this year and clearly you know my opinion.

I knew your opinion before you offered it. MIT uber alles.

Look at my modified post above, I posted my original comments before thinking about the process for NEWMAC POY.  It may just be that he was never up for consideration (actually, I am very certain this was the case, you can have Dave ask Coach Anderson this weekend if you like).

Ask any PG MIT has played over the past 2 weeks who they would rather face 1 on 1.

[mass_d3fan]

Pat,

His selection was a bit out of character for the conference.  First time in many years that the POY did not come from the 1st or 2nd place team.  Truthfully I felt Hollingsworth and Carr were the front runners for it going into the 2nd MIT/WPI matchup.  I felt Hollingsworth sealed it up that night.

HN is right, the only category where he was ahead of the other contenders was ppg.  HN can regale you with a full breakdown of how WPI's A. Coleman won the award over MIT's JB even though JB average almost 10 ppg more than Coleman!

[Hugenerd]

Exactly mass. And since when is NEWMAC POY a good indicator of all region? The year mass is talking about, Coleman was POY and 3rd team all region, Bartolotta was first team.

[toooldtoplay]

It is a shame the PPG always seems to enter the equation when honors are on the table. When you look at point guards there is so much more. Berthuime didn't even play much point against MIT and actually looked only to score and had little other responsibility. He did do that VERY well. If you look at what Mitchell Kates has done in the NEWMAC playoffs and other close (Tufts) games this year you would not argue the point. Against some of the best point guards in DIII he has outplayed each of them every game while handling the ball 90% of the time and dealing with any pressure that came his way. 

Kates numbers in the NEWMAC playoffs and NCAA tourney (6 games) are 21.3 PPG, 4.5 rebounds, 6.8 assists and 2.3 steals. Find better numbers than those anywhere against that kind of comp in all back to back games.

With the largest margin of victory this year in DIII a player should not be penalized for not be a scoring machine in blowouts. The reason MIT is where it is might just be because of this type of unselfish play.

[Pat Coleman]

Well, don't worry. The All-American team always takes postseason play into account and we are not bound by a regular-season award when choosing All-Americans. Too bad the NEWMAC can't manage to give its best player the award that seems to be set aside for it.

[Hugenerd]

Well, don't worry. The All-American team always takes postseason play into account and we are not bound by a regular-season award when choosing All-Americans. Too bad the NEWMAC can't manage to give its best player the award that seems to be set aside for it.

I know you are saying that tongue in cheek, but its the truth. You have seen it yourself in the way votes were conducted with Bartolotta and if you have seen any of Kates' last 6 postseason games, you have seen it for yourself in Kates' play (I know your knock on Hollingsworth 2 years ago was NEWMAC tourney performance). Unfortunately, for whatever reason, the NEWMAC seems to choose their POY based on different criteria every year.

[Hugenerd]

In addition to winning Region Coach of the Year, congrats to Coach Anderson for winning his 250th career game with the win over F&M.

[rlk]

Well, don't worry. The All-American team always takes postseason play into account and we are not bound by a regular-season award when choosing All-Americans. Too bad the NEWMAC can't manage to give its best player the award that seems to be set aside for it.

I know you are saying that tongue in cheek, but its the truth. You have seen it yourself in the way votes were conducted with Bartolotta and if you have seen any of Kates' last 6 postseason games, you have seen it for yourself in Kates' play (I know your knock on Hollingsworth 2 years ago was NEWMAC tourney performance). Unfortunately, for whatever reason, the NEWMAC seems to choose their POY based on different criteria every year.

I agree.  Kates simply controls the game out there.  The team has no shortage of scoring threats, and I'm sure Kates doesn't have a care in the world whether it's Hollingsworth, Tashman, Karraker, and/or himself who scores.  Definitely count me a member of the Mitch Kates fan club.

I haven't made it to any of their games beyond the NEWMAC championship, but you could see there -- and Saturday night, against Franklin & Marshall, that when the game's on the line, he takes over.  Not necessarily scoring everything, but if you sag off one of the other guys to keep him down, someone's going to get an open look.  And if you don't, you're probably going to be eating his dust on the way to the rim.  He also appears to have an uncanny sense of when things are starting to get out of hand, and he'll slow it down to let things get back in control.  I remember one play against F&M; the shot clock was down to about 12 seconds, and he actually backed it out to midcourt just to calm everyone down.  The announcer couldn't believe what he saw.  I don't remember if he took it in himself or dished it to Karraker or what, but I don't think the possession ended badly for the Engineers.  That's real leadership -- reading the team and the whole situation, not letting himself get rushed, and making good decisions.

I've been photographing a lot of MIT games over the past several years, and it's always a blast when he picks off a pass and takes it coast to coast (I set up at the baseline right next to our basket, firing 8 frames/second).  So I usually haven't had a chance to watch him play D, but last night he looked seriously sharp doing that too.  He got away with gambling on a steal a few times, because he's quick enough to front his man even if he doesn't get it.

Oh, and I have some video clips of MIT vs. Harvard in 2009, in his freshman season (Jeremy Lin's senior year).  I'm not sure why Oliver McNally was guarding him rather than Lin, but McNally was pretty quick himself.  So after a few passes where nobody gets open, he calls for the ball, backs it out to halfcourt, gives the team a few hand signals, takes it to his left a few steps seemingly without a care in the world, does a few crossover dribbles, does a couple of quick hip fakes, and just blasts right past McNally like he's standing still.  Didn't make the layup through heavy traffic in the paint, but it was plenty impressive.

I'll admit that the mid 1980's, when I managed the team, wasn't the most glorious era in MIT basketball, but it was a great bunch of guys and one of the highlights of my student days.  It's been a lot of fun to watch over the past several years, but this year they've turned it up a couple of notches.  The precision and quickness on both ends of the court is just a joy to witness.