BB: CCIW: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Gregory Sager]

With men on second and third, one out, Elmhurst intentionally walked A. J. Nathan to get to  ... Kevin Callahan?!!   Winning run moments later.

Millikin was already eliminated.  I believe that IWU's win eliminated Carthage and that Carthage eliminated Wheaton.  Are the other five still all alive, or is the 'Final Four' already determined?

Tourney is set:  NPU, IWU, EC, AC

Yep. As I said in my post from about twenty minutes ago, Wheaton lost two out of three to all three teams that are currently tied for second: AC, EC, and IWU. Thus, Wheaton is eliminated.

The second, third, and fourth tourney spots still need to be sorted out. Here's how the head-to-head tiebreakers stand:

Elmhurst > Augustana (2-1)
Augustana > Illinois Wesleyan (2-1)
Elmhurst = Illinois Wesleyan (1-1), pending tomorrow's outcome

[Mr. Ypsi]

With men on second and third, one out, Elmhurst intentionally walked A. J. Nathan to get to  ... Kevin Callahan?!!

No, Callahan was the one who was intentionally walked. Nathan got on (a single, I believe) and then took second on a passed ball before Callahan was intentionally walked.

Nope - I had it right.  Men on second and third, they intentionally walked Nathan.  Callahan made them pay for the 'insult', his third RBI of the game.

Thanks to all - I figured out even before I came back on that NPU had eliminated NCC, so the 'Final Four' was set.  Tomorrow is just for who gets NPU at home first!

Titans, tomorrow DOES matter!  By my prognostications, if you lose tomorrow, you are on life-support for a Pool C next weekend.  If you win, you are probably on the good side of the bubble as long as you win at least one game.  Nonetheless, win the AQ and leave no doubt!!

[voiceofseason]

Is a CCIW tournament legal with NEITHER Carthage or IWU in it?!

Not only legit, but beautiful as well.

CLEAR proof of the old adage:

"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."

My definition of beauty involves Dennis Martel having to pay to get into the ballpark to watch the CCIW tourney as a spectator. Can't happen now, since 11-10 Wheaton loses tiebreakers to all three of the other teams vying for playoff spots, as Augie, Elmhurst, and IWU are all 11-9 as of today -- but I would have loved to see it. So would basically everyone who follows NPU baseball, as Viking Blue can attest. He posted this during the Augie vs. IWU series:

Put one on the board for Augustana in the top of the tenth.  4-3 Augie.  After hearing some of the details about last weekend in Bloomington....GO VIKINGS!

... and I think he spoke for all of us who root for the Park.

This is an interesting post.

[Gregory Sager]

With men on second and third, one out, Elmhurst intentionally walked A. J. Nathan to get to  ... Kevin Callahan?!!

No, Callahan was the one who was intentionally walked. Nathan got on (a single, I believe) and then took second on a passed ball before Callahan was intentionally walked.

Nope - I had it right.  Men on second and third, they intentionally walked Nathan.  Callahan made them pay for the 'insult', his third RBI of the game.

You're right. I was looking at the 12th inning, when Nathan was HBP to lead off the inning, advanced to second on a PB, and then Callahan was intentionally walked.

But, as far as the 13th inning was concerned, Elmhurst skipper Joel Southern played it by the book. By walking Nathan in that situation, he put the force play back into effect. Callahan, who is both hard-hitting and slow-moving, is a prime double-play target.

Is a CCIW tournament legal with NEITHER Carthage or IWU in it?!

Not only legit, but beautiful as well.

CLEAR proof of the old adage:

"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."

My definition of beauty involves Dennis Martel having to pay to get into the ballpark to watch the CCIW tourney as a spectator. Can't happen now, since 11-10 Wheaton loses tiebreakers to all three of the other teams vying for playoff spots, as Augie, Elmhurst, and IWU are all 11-9 as of today -- but I would have loved to see it. So would basically everyone who follows NPU baseball, as Viking Blue can attest. He posted this during the Augie vs. IWU series:

Put one on the board for Augustana in the top of the tenth.  4-3 Augie.  After hearing some of the details about last weekend in Bloomington....GO VIKINGS!

... and I think he spoke for all of us who root for the Park.

This is an interesting post.

I don't know if it's interesting or not. All I know is that Dennis Martel is not exactly a much-beloved figure as far as NPU is concerned. He wasn't before (and that goes back aways, both among baseball people and basketball people), and he most certainly isn't now after the incident in question.

[OshDude]

Why parse language? Say what happened or don't. It doesn't do much good to make in-crowd references that lead to inferences.

[Gregory Sager]

Why parse language? Say what happened or don't. It doesn't do much good to make in-crowd references that lead to inferences.

I'm not sure that it would be constructive to do so. Let's just say that this incident:

There was plenty of gamesmanship, including the two coaches having a rather intimate (translation: nose to nose) debate in the first inning of Game 1.  I don't know what was said, but it appeared Coach Martel didn't like some things coming out of the NP dugout, and it appeared Coach Johnson didn't like some of the things coming out of Coach Martel's mouth.   

... involved Martel saying some things that were way over the line, as far as the NPU baseball team and its supporters are concerned.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Greg, I totally agree that walking Nathan with one out, men on second and third was by-the-book (heck, almost all mangers would do it if Babe Ruth himself was the next batter! ); doesn't mean Callahan can't feel offended!   Just a 'tad' more incentive.

And I LIKE it when Kevin gets a 'tad' more incentive!   It could mean the difference between Grand Chute and staying home next weekend!

[voiceofseason]

Why parse language? Say what happened or don't. It doesn't do much good to make in-crowd references that lead to inferences.

I'm not sure that it would be constructive to do so. Let's just say that this incident:

There was plenty of gamesmanship, including the two coaches having a rather intimate (translation: nose to nose) debate in the first inning of Game 1.  I don't know what was said, but it appeared Coach Martel didn't like some things coming out of the NP dugout, and it appeared Coach Johnson didn't like some of the things coming out of Coach Martel's mouth.   

... involved Martel saying some things that were way over the line, as far as the NPU baseball team and its supporters are concerned.

I did not realize you were at the game - I would have introduced myself.

Coach Martel didn't like some things coming out of the NPU dugout - and probably addressed it in a way that isn't normally expected.  I think there was a point there - but I also think it wasn't the best way to handle things.  I would rather see teams perform on the field - who cares what is said in the dugouts.  The scoreboard is the final measure.

I do know the coach's had a discussion the next morning before game 3.  Whether Coach Johnson thought it was productive or not I don't know - I've never talked to him.

At this point, I would rather just say congrats to NPU on winning the conference, and I look forward to seeing the tournament play out.  I would love to go but it isn't likely - IWU will also be hosting the NCAA Regional softball tournament next weekend, so will likely stay in town for that.

I saw two very competitive games between IWU and Elmhurst today.  I would expect that to carry over to the tournament next weekend, as the margin of error between teams seems very miminal this year.  If North Central had pulled out the two games today instead of North Park, we would be going into the final day with FIVE 11-9 teams.  That would have been crazy!

[Gregory Sager]

Elmhurst gets no love in this room, since there's no Elmhurst fans here to sing the praises of the 'jays. But I have to tip my cap to the job that Joel Southern has done this season. The 'jays were picked to finish seventh in the preseason poll this year, with six of the other seven coaches putting them next to the bottom, just above Millikin. But if Elmhurst wins at home tomorrow, EC will finish no worse than in a tie for second, and will clinch the #2 seed in next weekend's tourney. That's a mighty big leap from low expectations to high finish, so congrats to Southern and the 'jays for that.

I did not realize you were at the game - I would have introduced myself.

I wasn't there. I heard afterwards about what Martel said from Luke Johnson.

Coach Martel didn't like some things coming out of the NPU dugout - and probably addressed it in a way that isn't normally expected.  I think there was a point there - but I also think it wasn't the best way to handle things.  I would rather see teams perform on the field - who cares what is said in the dugouts.  The scoreboard is the final measure.

I agree with you there.

As for what the Vikings were saying in the dugout, it's true that they lead the league in bench jockeying. Luke Johnson wants an active and noisy dugout, but he does have to police them when they get out of line -- they're 18-to-21-year-olds, after all -- and he has done so fairly often.

Aside from what Dennis Martel specifically said in that conversation that has inflamed matters so much, though, I think that the idea at work here is that you're probably not going to get much cooperation between head coaches in this kind of a context. What I mean by that is that I've been struck over the years by how little love lost there is between several of the head coaches in CCIW baseball. It's a marked contrast to CCIW basketball and CCIW football, where all of the coaches are either on friendly terms or at least tolerate each other (with the glaring exception of Carthage's and Augie's basketball coaches). Given the history between Johnson and Martel, and between Martel and NPU in general, it's no surprise that things degenerated immediately between them in that game. The question is, though: At what point does the matter go from gamesmanship and/or legitimate grievances to something that is much, much worse?

At this point, I would rather just say congrats to NPU on winning the conference, and I look forward to seeing the tournament play out.  I would love to go but it isn't likely - IWU will also be hosting the NCAA Regional softball tournament next weekend, so will likely stay in town for that.

Sorry to hear that. I'd enjoy meeting you. Perhaps next season.

I saw two very competitive games between IWU and Elmhurst today.  I would expect that to carry over to the tournament next weekend, as the margin of error between teams seems very miminal this year.  If North Central had pulled out the two games today instead of North Park, we would be going into the final day with FIVE 11-9 teams.  That would have been crazy!

There indeed has been a lot of balance in the league this season. In fact, NPU is going to end up with the worst record for a CCIW champion (either 14-7 or 13-8) since the CCIW went to the current format in 1999. (Not that this bothers us one bit, mind you. ) And the number of sweeps in CCIW play thus far -- five -- has to be an all-time low as well.

It's a much more fun league to follow with so many teams being competitive, rather than the "Carthage, Wesleyan, Augie, and the five dwarfs" syndrome that had been the norm for about two decades or so up until a couple of seasons ago.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Greg, five years ago IWU romped to the best season any CCIW team ever had (20-1) then totally flamed out in both the conference and regional tourneys (0-2 in each, both at home).  Two years ago they barely limped into the conference tourney and went on to win the big Walnut-and-Bronze doorstop.  Aside from making the conference tourney, I've given up worrying about regular-season records - it just doesn't matter!

At this point, NPU, Augie, Elmhurst, and IWU are all 0-0.  May a CCIW team win it all in Grand Chute!  (Preferably IWU, but I'll root for whoever gets there!)

(And, yes, I realize there is still a conference and regional tourney before worrying about the World Series - that is the luxury of a fan vs. a coach or player - we can dream ahead! )

[Viking Blue]

Delayed reaction:  YES!

[BBFan62]

Elmhurst gets no love in this room, since there's no Elmhurst fans here to sing the praises of the 'jays. But I have to tip my cap to the job that Joel Southern has done this season. The 'jays were picked to finish seventh in the preseason poll this year, with six of the other seven coaches putting them next to the bottom, just above Millikin. But if Elmhurst wins at home tomorrow, EC will finish no worse than in a tie for second, and will clinch the #2 seed in next weekend's tourney. That's a mighty big leap from low expectations to high finish, so congrats to Southern and the 'jays for that.

I did not realize you were at the game - I would have introduced myself.

I wasn't there. I heard afterwards about what Martel said from Luke Johnson.

Coach Martel didn't like some things coming out of the NPU dugout - and probably addressed it in a way that isn't normally expected.  I think there was a point there - but I also think it wasn't the best way to handle things.  I would rather see teams perform on the field - who cares what is said in the dugouts.  The scoreboard is the final measure.

I agree with you there.

As for what the Vikings were saying in the dugout, it's true that they lead the league in bench jockeying. Luke Johnson wants an active and noisy dugout, but he does have to police them when they get out of line -- they're 18-to-21-year-olds, after all -- and he has done so fairly often.

Aside from what Dennis Martel specifically said in that conversation that has inflamed matters so much, though, I think that the idea at work here is that you're probably not going to get much cooperation between head coaches in this kind of a context. What I mean by that is that I've been struck over the years by how little love lost there is between several of the head coaches in CCIW baseball. It's a marked contrast to CCIW basketball and CCIW football, where all of the coaches are either on friendly terms or at least tolerate each other (with the glaring exception of Carthage's and Augie's basketball coaches). Given the history between Johnson and Martel, and between Martel and NPU in general, it's no surprise that things degenerated immediately between them in that game. The question is, though: At what point does the matter go from gamesmanship and/or legitimate grievances to something that is much, much worse?

At this point, I would rather just say congrats to NPU on winning the conference, and I look forward to seeing the tournament play out.  I would love to go but it isn't likely - IWU will also be hosting the NCAA Regional softball tournament next weekend, so will likely stay in town for that.

Sorry to hear that. I'd enjoy meeting you. Perhaps next season.

I saw two very competitive games between IWU and Elmhurst today.  I would expect that to carry over to the tournament next weekend, as the margin of error between teams seems very miminal this year.  If North Central had pulled out the two games today instead of North Park, we would be going into the final day with FIVE 11-9 teams.  That would have been crazy!

There indeed has been a lot of balance in the league this season. In fact, NPU is going to end up with the worst record for a CCIW champion (either 14-7 or 13-8) since the CCIW went to the current format in 1999. (Not that this bothers us one bit, mind you. ) And the number of sweeps in CCIW play thus far -- five -- has to be an all-time low as well.

It's a much more fun league to follow with so many teams being competitive, rather than the "Carthage, Wesleyan, Augie, and the five dwarfs" syndrome that had been the norm for about two decades or so up until a couple of seasons ago.

I'll give the 'Jays some love.......also love to IWU. Brian Evans, the second-baseman for the 'Jays was a high school teammate of AJ Nathan, Anthony Kopp, and Kevin Sullivan. My son (plays out East) played with them. I'm very excited that Elmhurst & IWU will be in the tourney regardless of the outcome today. If my sons' team does not make the playoffs then I'll gladly drive down to my old neighborhood and watch the playoffs at NPU. But, I'm hoping that I'll need to be out east!

[BigPoppa]

I am guessing that NPU may sneak into the regional rankings this week. Wheaton should drop out altogether. Not sure where IWU will land this week.

[D3Vike11]

I am guessing that NPU may sneak into the regional rankings this week. Wheaton should drop out altogether. Not sure where IWU will land this week.

If Wesleyan loses 2 of 3 to Elmhurst then they could drop down to 4/5. Also, I noticed that the 3rd game of Wesleyan and Millikin is missing on Wesleyan's schedule. Did they play that game? After today they will only have played 39 games according to all of their schedules (CCIW, D3baseball, Wesleyan's, and Millikin's)

Found it, but they still only have 39 games total on their schedule.

[BigPoppa]

They were rained out with Illinois state last week. Doubt it will be made up.