BB: CCIW: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Mr. Ypsi]

Greg, I think you are treading MUCH too lightly on Wheaton's baseball 'heritage'!

Let's face it, until the middle of the last decade, Wheaton baseball was NPU football, or (lately) Millikin basketball.  MOST years they finished dead last.  For Driggers to even keep them from backsliding is a MAJOR accomplishment.  And this year they tied for THIRD (done in by tie-breakers from being in the tourney).  Despite the carping from the newbie (sorry for the slur, norfrank ), I think Driggers did a helluva job.

While I'd like to see all CCIW teams remain competitive, I fear Wheaton fans may look back on Driggers' time as 'the good old days'.

[norfrank]

Give us s coach with a little fire in his belly. This years team as well as three previous two years had plenty of talent and should have been much better and should have been in the tourney. If Wheaton had had Johnson as coach I believe they would have made regionals. This is based on their cuurent talent level and knowledge that Johnson can recruit.

[norfrank]

Mr. Y.   Driggers'success came with Elder's players. While I would love to go into specifics about why Wheaton can do better I don't want to go further down the path of negativity.  I have gone too far already.

[Gregory Sager]

I'm not sure what Wheaton fans are thinking when they wistfully look at a coach like Luke Johnson and think how great it would be to have someone like him wearing a cap that has the big 'W' on it. The idea of a Johnsonesque coach at Wheaton is pretty comical. He'd last about five seconds before the Wheaton administration threw him out on his kiester for subverting its idea of what a leader and molder of young Christian men should be. There were plenty of people around Wheaton who found former men's basketball coach Bill Harris to be a little too "edgy" (an adjective I heard employed about him from Wheaton folks a time or two), and Bill Harris, ex-Marine or not, was a total marshmallow compared to Luke Johnson. Luke is intense, he is profane, he has a glare that could reduce a Navy SEAL to tears, he will go toe-to-toe with anyone who crosses him and will not back down from any confrontation, he will play the sort of mind games with his players, opposing players, opposing coaches, and umpires that would fill Wheaton administrators with dismay, and he is so totally competitive that if his mother was wearing an opponent's uniform and crowding the plate he'd tell his pitcher to give her some 85 mph chin music.

The typical Wheaton student-athlete -- affluent, well-mannered, likeable, a bit milquetoast -- is definitely not the Luke Johnson type. And I don't think that they'd respond well to a coach like him. Heck, lots of Wheaton basketball players whined about the far less ferocious Bill Harris -- and he recruited them.

To go back to the Marines thing, picturing Luke Johnson as the Wheaton baseball coach is like picturing Gunnery Sgt. Hartman from Full Metal Jacket running a Cub Scout camp.

[BigPoppa]

There is no way Luke Johnson lands at Wheaton!!! Doesn't fit the mold there and would not recruit Wheaton-like ball players. I doubt he'd make it through the move in process before the first alum complaint arrived.

[norfrank]

Granted Johnson might be a little rough for Wheaton. I guess we just would like someone that displays a little passion. I have seen Johnson play those mind games with opponents. I guess when I see him, I see a coach you hate if you play against him but love if you play for him.

Take away the profanity and I have no issue with someone who has coaches with passion and can be rough on his players. Players don't need to be babied, they need to be pushed to get better. From what I saw of Johnson, he was always thinking ahead, he had his players backs and was not afraid to take chances to succeed. This is what I mean when I say a coach of Johnson's nature would have helped Wheaton to be more successful. I have seen enough CCIW games to understand it is a tough conference. However, it is a conference that Wheaton could have been very successful in over the past few years. They should have been in the playoffs at least two of the last three years. 

The talent was there. The team had two All Americans (Martin and Golz) this year and one player (Zeller) that was previously named an All American. Combine this with another player(Mller) that was two time all region. Another player that was a quality starter (Rahn) and another all conference player (Swider).

[norfrank]

There is no way Luke Johnson lands at Wheaton!!! Doesn't fit the mold there and would not recruit Wheaton-like ball players. I doubt he'd make it through the move in process before the first alum complaint arrived.

This is obvious. We just want someone with the baseball saavy and drive that Johnson displays.

[Ralph Turner]

From my outside observation of Coach Driggers, he and his family lived the lives compatible and respectful of Wheaton life and moral codes, but the players that he brought to McMurry were a bit rougher than the Wheaton mold.  Maybe that explains the success at McMurry.

(There are no BMW's or Lexus's on the McMurry Campus.  Kids got sent off to college with the family 2003 Corolla or the ten-year-old F-150 pickup.  McMurry is basically 2/3's Caucasian, 1/6 Hispanic/Tejano, and 1/6 black. We are standard middle class/working middle class Texas. These kids' parents probably report at work to the Wheaton kids' parents.  We have a very large number of first generation college graduates.  The contrast in demographics between McMurry and Wheaton was on full display at a men's basketball game at Wheaton in November 2010.  We are definitely cut from different bolts of cloth.          )

The interesting speculation will be what he does at ETBU.  They, too, are a mid-level ASC team which lost out on the playoffs in a three-way tie for third on tie-breakers. McMurry and ETBU are from the same Texas demographics.  Let's see if he can turn the ETBU program around and get them into the playoffs on a consistent basis.

I hope that Wheaton can build on what he has done.  This is clearly a team that is in the mid-level of the CCIW, well-established conference with a real core of high quality program. Losing a playoff slot by tie-breakers is tough.  I don't have a CCIW favorite. I like the banter of the fans in the conference, so I follow it regularly.  I wish you the best.


Respectfully, thank you for the kind words for my discussion of Wheaton's facilities. I tried to provide as much information as possible for outside-of-CCIW fans.

[Ralph Turner]

It is true that Driggers was brought in to raise money to build a field.  I believe he was successful in this (~$1.5 million in 3+ years) and I don't think anyone at Wheaton is surprised he is moving on.   

The site for a new baseball facility was always an issue.  The original plan was to build a permanent baseball facility on Lawson field. This would have been ideal as it is college-owned and only a block north of campus.  Delivering a huge blow to the program, the surrounding residential neighborhood blocked the construction.   

If it were up to me, whatever they call that over-the-top-for-D3 soccer stadium would've been simply replaced with the new baseball facility.

$1.5M!  That is nice!

[izzy stradlin]

Any ideas of who could be the next head coach at Wheaton?

I am hearing Neal Reasland

I hinted at this earlier, but at the top of Wheaton's wish list (and by a wide margin) will be Steve Duncan of WashU (Wheaton '02).  Duncan is a young, intense, highly driven competitor.  He is in a great situation at WashU, so luring him to Wheaton will be difficult.  Duncan was a assistant on two Johns Hopkins World Series teams. He took WashU to the regionals in his second season this year with a very strong first recruiting class and only 3 seniors.   

After Duncan, I have no idea. 

[norfrank]

From my outside observation of Coach Driggers, he and his family lived the lives compatible and respectful of Wheaton life and moral codes, but the players that he brought to McMurry were a bit rougher than the Wheaton mold.  Maybe that explains the success at McMurry.

Put quite frankly, I take a lot of offense when people try and make the comment that Chrisitan athletes aren't tough or successful. We display emotion, we are intense and we as hard as possible to be successful. Someone referenced Bill Harris (Wheaton Basketball) as someone who could display intensity in the right way.  Another example is Mike Singletary. There are many other examples I could give but I don't want to turn this into a religious discussion. And yes, before someone mentions this I could be accussed of (and probably deservingly so) of being unchristian in expressing my dissatisfaction at how the program has been run. Being a christian does not mean we are meek. Being a christian does not mean we can't excel at our endeavors. No serious athlete (christian or not) will ever accept losing as being a part of their life. Your assessment of why McMurry may have been more successful is a missplaced statement. You also make the assessment that every Wheaton student comes from a privileged background. Again, another false assessment. Sure some come from money but that does not apply to every student athlete.

[norfrank]

Any ideas of who could be the next head coach at Wheaton?

I am hearing Neal Reasland

I hinted at this earlier, but at the top of Wheaton's wish list (and by a wide margin) will be Steve Duncan of WashU (Wheaton '02).  Duncan is a young, intense, highly driven competitor.  He is in a great situation at WashU, so luring him to Wheaton will be difficult.  Duncan was a assistant on two Johns Hopkins World Series teams. He took WashU to the regionals in his second season this year with a very strong first recruiting class and only 3 seniors.   

After Duncan, I have no idea.

Agree that Duncan would be a huge upgrade.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Mr. Y.   Driggers'success came with Elder's players. While I would love to go into specifics about why Wheaton can do better I don't want to go further down the path of negativity.  I have gone too far already.

First year - sure (true of any coach).

Fourth year (tied for 3rd, when the Wheaton norm until 7-8 years ago was 7th or 8th) - not so much.

I've never seen them play, so I certainly won't try to debate specifics, but based on past history, you may well miss Coach Driggers.

[norfrank]

Tied for third; but, lost the tiebreaker with every team in front of them.

[Gregory Sager]

From my outside observation of Coach Driggers, he and his family lived the lives compatible and respectful of Wheaton life and moral codes, but the players that he brought to McMurry were a bit rougher than the Wheaton mold.  Maybe that explains the success at McMurry.

(There are no BMW's or Lexus's on the McMurry Campus.  Kids got sent off to college with the family 2003 Corolla or the ten-year-old F-150 pickup.  McMurry is basically 2/3's Caucasian, 1/6 Hispanic/Tejano, and 1/6 black. We are standard middle class/working middle class Texas. These kids' parents probably report at work to the Wheaton kids' parents.  We have a very large number of first generation college graduates.  The contrast in demographics between McMurry and Wheaton was on full display at a men's basketball game at Wheaton in November 2010.  We are definitely cut from different bolts of cloth.          )

I think that you've pretty accurately described the difference between the kind of guys that Luke Johnson recruits and the typical Wheaton student-athlete as well, Ralph. As I've mentioned before, Luke fosters a real blue-collar feel among his players that's adopted even by the kids who come from a bit of money.

I hinted at this earlier, but at the top of Wheaton's wish list (and by a wide margin) will be Steve Duncan of WashU (Wheaton '02).  Duncan is a young, intense, highly driven competitor.  He is in a great situation at WashU, so luring him to Wheaton will be difficult.  Duncan was a assistant on two Johns Hopkins World Series teams. He took WashU to the regionals in his second season this year with a very strong first recruiting class and only 3 seniors.

That would be quite a steal. A head-coaching position at Wash U is typically considered to be a destination job, not a springboard to something else. But, on the other hand, you can't discount the allure of coaching at your alma mater. For a lot of coaches, taking the job at your alma mater can be a strong motivation to leave what others might consider to be the perfect job.

From my outside observation of Coach Driggers, he and his family lived the lives compatible and respectful of Wheaton life and moral codes, but the players that he brought to McMurry were a bit rougher than the Wheaton mold.  Maybe that explains the success at McMurry.

Put quite frankly, I take a lot of offense when people try and make the comment that Chrisitan athletes aren't tough or successful. We display emotion, we are intense and we as hard as possible to be successful. Someone referenced Bill Harris (Wheaton Basketball) as someone who could display intensity in the right way.  Another example is Mike Singletary. There are many other examples I could give but I don't want to turn this into a religious discussion. And yes, before someone mentions this I could be accussed of (and probably deservingly so) of being unchristian in expressing my dissatisfaction at how the program has been run. Being a christian does not mean we are meek. Being a christian does not mean we can't excel at our endeavors. No serious athlete (christian or not) will ever accept losing as being a part of their life. Your assessment of why McMurry may have been more successful is a missplaced statement. You also make the assessment that every Wheaton student comes from a privileged background. Again, another false assessment. Sure some come from money but that does not apply to every student athlete.

I think that you've misunderstood what Ralph meant by "rougher." I think that he was speaking in socioeconomic terms, not competitive terms. Ralph's about the last person who posts on d3boards.com who would ever badmouth a Christian athlete for any reason.

I don't think that anyone who is familiar with Wheaton athletics would ever doubt the competitive fire and dedication to success of which its student-athletes are capable. The school's across-the-board success over the years in this league speaks for itself. Wheaton's men's basketball players are usually considered to be the best-conditioned and most disciplined players in the CCIW, and I'm sure that if you went into the CCIW football room and asked you'd get similar high kudos with regard to the mental makeup and competitiveness of Wheaton football players. As for soccer, which as I said has been Wheaton's signature sport, one former NPU soccer player said it best when he said about Wheaton, "We may beat them, but we don't outwork them." It's a very strong rivalry, but NPU's respect for Wheaton on the soccer pitch has as much to do with Wheaton's collective drive as a team to succeed as it does with Wheaton's tremendous history in that sport.

And, yeah, the stereotype that Wheaton players are all the products of upper-middle-class or wealthy homes is not entirely true. But there's certainly enough truth to the stereotype for it to be noted and remarked upon around the league.