FB: New Jersey Athletic Conference

[Bombers798891]

Also, Michigan State, Missouri and Oklahoma have all beaten numerous top 25 teams throughout the season.

Victories over current Top 25 teams in BCS Standings

Michigan State: 1 (Wisconsin)
Oklahoma: 1 (Florida State)
Missouri: 1 (Oklahoma)

They're kind of one-and-done in that regard. So numerous may not be the right word

[JT]

BTW, as a TCNJ fan, I wish I had something to argue about... or a tiebreaker rule that would affect me...

All it takes is for Hamilton to pull another spolier against Rowan, and you will.  Nothing is settled yet.  Still two games left.

I know the TCNJ players are drooling.

[footballfan75]

Also, Michigan State, Missouri and Oklahoma have all beaten numerous top 25 teams throughout the season.

Victories over current Top 25 teams in BCS Standings

Michigan State: 1 (Wisconsin)
Oklahoma: 1 (Florida State)
Missouri: 1 (Oklahoma)

They're kind of one-and-done in that regard. So numerous may not be the right word

I think what he was saying is they beat those team while they were ranked in the top 25 (Mich St beat Mich while Mich was in the top 10)

[pg04]

Or Cortland could lose to Willy P or MSU to Brockport or WIlly P!  

Willy P has 2 chances to shape the race!  

Of course I'd like Brockport to play spoiler...

[phil]

BTW, as a TCNJ fan, I wish I had something to argue about... or a tiebreaker rule that would affect me...

All it takes is for Hamilton to pull another spolier against Rowan, and you will.  Nothing is settled yet.  Still two games left.

I know the TCNJ players are drooling.

I won't be holding my breath after TCNJ lost by 39 points to Rowan each of the last two years. Seems like the days of the Lions having close games against Rowan – no matter the records – are over.

[Bombers798891]

Also, Michigan State, Missouri and Oklahoma have all beaten numerous top 25 teams throughout the season.

Victories over current Top 25 teams in BCS Standings

Michigan State: 1 (Wisconsin)
Oklahoma: 1 (Florida State)
Missouri: 1 (Oklahoma)

They're kind of one-and-done in that regard. So numerous may not be the right word

I think what he was saying is they beat those team while they were ranked in the top 25 (Mich St beat Mich while Mich was in the top 10)

Yeah, but does that really give us an accurate representation of a team? Does anyone really think MSU deserves more credit that Ohio State will get for beating a Michigan team that's going to wind up with at least 5 losses? Should Alabama get more credit than MSU for beating Penn State because it happened before we realized the Nittany Lions weren't that good?

[Jonny Utah]

I think the main point you guys are missing is that there are so many teams with 1 or 2 losses, a 13 spot drop in the rankings isn't that unusual, especially when you were raked at the bottom of the undefeated teams in the first place.

Oklahoma was #1 in the country in week 8.  They lose and drop 8 spots to #9 in week 9.  Where do you think TCU would be ranked if they lost?

Missouri loses and drops 7 spots.

Michigan State drops 9 spots (11 spots in the coaches poll)

Understood, but the teams you mentioned lost by an average of 18 points and dropped less than Montclair. Montclair lost by a point on a missed chip-shot field goal at the end of the game. Under the circumstances, I would have to assume that Montclair could have dropped several spots even if the field goal was made and MSU won 12-10.

Again that is true.  But I  think Michigan State, Missouri, Oklahoma or Iowa can beat any team in the country at home.

I don't see Montclair State having a chance to win a game against the top 10 teams.

Also, Michigan State, Missouri and Oklahoma have all beaten numerous top 25 teams throughout the season.

Hmmmm, so the NJAC became the WAC of D3 somewhere along the way.
Worst thing the NJAC has done was to include Morrisville, WestConn and Buffalo St. The inclusion of Brockport hasn't benefitted the NJAC either – but who could have predicted their mediocrity. At least in the past teams like TCNJ, Rowan, Montclair and Cortland had extra games to prove themselves outside the conference (as tough as scheduling was with the lack of teams willing to schedule them). Still, your comment that Rowan, Montclair or Cortland wouldn't have a chance to beat a top 10 team seems a little strong...

No, the WAC has Boise State, and I think they could beat a top 10 team.  If it makes you feel any better I don't think any E8, LL or NEFC could beat a top 10 either (or MAC team besides Del Val.)

[JT]

I think the main point you guys are missing is that there are so many teams with 1 or 2 losses, a 13 spot drop in the rankings isn't that unusual, especially when you were raked at the bottom of the undefeated teams in the first place.

Oklahoma was #1 in the country in week 8.  They lose and drop 8 spots to #9 in week 9.  Where do you think TCU would be ranked if they lost?

Missouri loses and drops 7 spots.

Michigan State drops 9 spots (11 spots in the coaches poll)

Understood, but the teams you mentioned lost by an average of 18 points and dropped less than Montclair. Montclair lost by a point on a missed chip-shot field goal at the end of the game. Under the circumstances, I would have to assume that Montclair could have dropped several spots even if the field goal was made and MSU won 12-10.

Again that is true.  But I  think Michigan State, Missouri, Oklahoma or Iowa can beat any team in the country at home.

I don't see Montclair State having a chance to win a game against the top 10 teams.

Also, Michigan State, Missouri and Oklahoma have all beaten numerous top 25 teams throughout the season.

Hmmmm, so the NJAC became the WAC of D3 somewhere along the way.
Worst thing the NJAC has done was to include Morrisville, WestConn and Buffalo St. The inclusion of Brockport hasn't benefitted the NJAC either – but who could have predicted their mediocrity. At least in the past teams like TCNJ, Rowan, Montclair and Cortland had extra games to prove themselves outside the conference (as tough as scheduling was with the lack of teams willing to schedule them). Still, your comment that Rowan, Montclair or Cortland wouldn't have a chance to beat a top 10 team seems a little strong...

These are all good teams.  Let one (hopefully two) get in.  I hope its the two teams with the better QB's (Cortland and Rowan), but I have no control over that.  You may see one end in the final top 10.

The NJAC is a far better conference than when Rowan ruled in the 90's and early 00's.  The difference... the majority of the teams are better in the trenches.  Used to be that the bottom of the NJAC had really bad o and d lines.  Teams today can hang in longer and keep it closer.  Where they don't match up is the playmakers with the ball, resulting in Montclair, Cortland, Kean, and Rowan pulling away.

Teams like Willy P are getting more decent players to stay in NJ.  They've also gotten some guys who would rather play then wait on JV at Rowan.  It happens with better coaching.

[Jonny Utah]

Also, Michigan State, Missouri and Oklahoma have all beaten numerous top 25 teams throughout the season.

Victories over current Top 25 teams in BCS Standings

Michigan State: 1 (Wisconsin)
Oklahoma: 1 (Florida State)
Missouri: 1 (Oklahoma)

They're kind of one-and-done in that regard. So numerous may not be the right word

Yea the key word is current.  Cortland hasn't beaten any top 25 teams either.

[Bombers798891]

That's, in a sense, what makes polls an inexact science. If a team you beat is undefeated and therefore ranked highly, people will give you a lot of credit. If that team winds up being mediocre, it's a guessing game as to how much (if at all) that should negatively affect you in the polls.

How much credit does Boise get for their win over Va Tech? First, the Hokies were #10, so it looked like a huge win. Then, they were unranked, so people essentially wrote it off. But now, they're climbing back up the rankings and could wind up 11-2. So what's the appropriate way to assign a value to that win?

As an Ithaca fan, I can tell you no-one considered giving IC as much credit for beating St. Lawrence as they got for beating Union. But now, the win over the Saints looks better.

[Jonny Utah]

Also, Michigan State, Missouri and Oklahoma have all beaten numerous top 25 teams throughout the season.

Victories over current Top 25 teams in BCS Standings

Michigan State: 1 (Wisconsin)
Oklahoma: 1 (Florida State)
Missouri: 1 (Oklahoma)

They're kind of one-and-done in that regard. So numerous may not be the right word

I think what he was saying is they beat those team while they were ranked in the top 25 (Mich St beat Mich while Mich was in the top 10)

Yeah, but does that really give us an accurate representation of a team? Does anyone really think MSU deserves more credit that Ohio State will get for beating a Michigan team that's going to wind up with at least 5 losses? Should Alabama get more credit than MSU for beating Penn State because it happened before we realized the Nittany Lions weren't that good?

Wouldn't you say a Ohio State win over Michigan is more impressive than a Cortland win over Brockport?

That is a difference between d3 and d1 though as well.  Teams like Michigan with 5 losses will have a chance against the top teams, but teams with 5 losses in d3 usually won't have a chance against the top teams. 

[phil]

No, the WAC has Boise State, and I think they could beat a top 10 team.  If it makes you feel any better I don't think any E8, LL or NEFC could beat a top 10 either (or MAC team besides Del Val.)

I should have amended my comment to say the NJAC is the WAC circa 2004.

JT, too bad Hamilton had to have his 200th win at WestConn. How sweet it would have been against the Profs.

[JT]

BTW, as a TCNJ fan, I wish I had something to argue about... or a tiebreaker rule that would affect me...

All it takes is for Hamilton to pull another spolier against Rowan, and you will.  Nothing is settled yet.  Still two games left.

I know the TCNJ players are drooling.

I won't be holding my breath after TCNJ lost by 39 points to Rowan each of the last two years. Seems like the days of the Lions having close games against Rowan – no matter the records – are over.

I am still not putting this one in the bank.  TCNJ seniors playing their last game and Hamilton coaching...  It will be heated, the trash talking will be flying.

[JT]

No, the WAC has Boise State, and I think they could beat a top 10 team.  If it makes you feel any better I don't think any E8, LL or NEFC could beat a top 10 either (or MAC team besides Del Val.)

I should have amended my comment to say the NJAC is the WAC circa 2004.

JT, too bad Hamilton had to have his 200th win at WestConn. How sweet it would have been against the Profs.

All those drunk, blue painted, TCNJ frat boys would go nuts.  They'll still go nuts.

[phil]

JT, what seniors? If I'm not mistaken, the Lions will return in the neighborhood of 18 starters next year. Many Sophs starting this season.