FB: New Jersey Athletic Conference

[skunks_sidekick]

I think a top 20 d3 team should have some 40 point wins.  W. Conn and Morrisville are two of the worst teams in the country and I believe the top 10 teams in the country would have beaten those teams by 60 points.

Yeah, but I mean, what's the difference between 36 and 42 points?

For example, Hardin Baylor just had their first win by more than 40 points. They kicked a FG with under 8 minutes to go to win by 42. So are you saying they were undeserving of their #6 ranking before this week?

Hardin Baylor's a good example actually. Prior to this week, the had wins by 5, 4, and 6 points, but nothing more than 21. They had to come back in the 2nd half on UW-LaCrosse, McMurray, and Louisiana College. They were still sitting in 6th.

Is Hardin-Baylor less worthy because they only beat 3-5 East Texas Baptist by six? UW-Lacrosse is going to go 3-7, and Hardin Baylor beat them by five. Should we hold that against them? Point differentials aren't always the best thing to go by when determining strength, especially on a game by game basis.

In my opinion....YES...IF they lose.  People are giving them the "benefit of the doubt" due to being in a traditionally tough conference, beating Hardin-Simmons handily, and that they have been there the last six/seven years.  If they were to lose a game, I think voters would look at their overall work and drop them lower than would originally be thought.

[Jonny Utah]

I think a top 20 d3 team should have some 40 point wins.  W. Conn and Morrisville are two of the worst teams in the country and I believe the top 10 teams in the country would have beaten those teams by 60 points.

Yeah, but I mean, what's the difference between 36 and 42 points?

For example, Hardin Baylor just had their first win by more than 40 points. They kicked a FG with under 8 minutes to go to win by 42. So are you saying they were undeserving of their #6 ranking before this week?

Hardin Baylor's a good example actually. Prior to this week, the had wins by 5, 4, and 6 points, but nothing more than 21. They had to come back in the 2nd half on UW-LaCrosse, McMurray, and Louisiana College. They were still sitting in 6th.

Is Hardin-Baylor less worthy because they only beat 3-5 East Texas Baptist by six? UW-Lacrosse is going to go 3-7, and Hardin Baylor beat them by five. Should we hold that against them? Point differentials aren't always the best thing to go by when determining strength, especially on a game by game basis.

I'm not saying it is the only thing.  Look at what Del Val is doing this year score wise.  Of course there are going to be some close games with teams you should beat by 4 touchdowns if you are a great team, but you should still have some 4-5 TD wins under your belt.

[Jonny Utah]

At what point in time did the entire NJAC conference begin to be characterized as "crap"? Missed the memo.
This is what the expansion has done for the NJAC. Before the expansion TCNJ, Rowan and Montclair couldn't buy a non-conference game. The NJAC goes out and takes care of that situation and Buffalo St., Morrisville, WestConn and Brockport haven't been able to be very competitive. But now, according to our "posting elite" the NJAC's best teams can't hope to win against a top ten team? There needs to be some 40 point blowouts on the schedule? C'mon.

Good lord, the year Rowan beat MUC they lost the game and the NJAC championship to TCNJ. Thank goodness they weren't kicked out of the top 100, forced to turn in their uni's and banned from the NCAA playoffs.

Phil what has the NJAC done nationally since 2001?  You can add whomever you want, that doesn't make your teams better.

[Bombers798891]

but you should still have some 4-5 TD wins under your belt.

Well, is it that or 40 points? Because Montclair has won three games by 4-5 TD's, but none by 40...

I'm just yanking your chain...I know you're just talking about winning impressively, but I think Montclair has done that a few times this season

[phil]

At what point in time did the entire NJAC conference begin to be characterized as "crap"? Missed the memo.
This is what the expansion has done for the NJAC. Before the expansion TCNJ, Rowan and Montclair couldn't buy a non-conference game. The NJAC goes out and takes care of that situation and Buffalo St., Morrisville, WestConn and Brockport haven't been able to be very competitive. But now, according to our "posting elite" the NJAC's best teams can't hope to win against a top ten team? There needs to be some 40 point blowouts on the schedule? C'mon.

Good lord, the year Rowan beat MUC they lost the game and the NJAC championship to TCNJ. Thank goodness they weren't kicked out of the top 100, forced to turn in their uni's and banned from the NCAA playoffs.

Phil what has the NJAC done nationally since 2001?  You can add whomever you want, that doesn't make your teams better.

I didn't infer that the NJAC's best teams got better by addition. My point is that the NJAC is being associated with the lack of success of the teams they've added. I believe the NJAC's core teams are strong (with the exception that none have taken up the mantle held by Rowan in the 90's), it's doormats (Kean and WPU), are much improved ... and there's been little opportunity for the conference to prove themselves either way over the last several years because of the conference expansion and the lack of out of conference games. Then come the playoffs, and a second round game against MUC to talk about.

[clandfan]

I think the main point you guys are missing is that there are so many teams with 1 or 2 losses, a 13 spot drop in the rankings isn't that unusual, especially when you were raked at the bottom of the undefeated teams in the first place.

Oklahoma was #1 in the country in week 8.  They lose and drop 8 spots to #9 in week 9.  Where do you think TCU would be ranked if they lost?

Missouri loses and drops 7 spots.

Michigan State drops 9 spots (11 spots in the coaches poll)

If TCU loses to Utah 10-9, they drop to 15 or 16.  If they lose to San Diego St. 10-9, they drop out of the poll.

If Montclair lost to Western CT 10-9, it makes more sense to drop out of the poll.  But to Cortland....I think 22-23 would have been a little more realistic.

True, but TCU is ranked #5 while Montclair was ranked #14.  That tells me pollsters were not that high on Montclair in the first place.  I also think if SJF played Montclair, SJF would win.  There were simply too many teams that had to move up from #20-#30 last week that Montclair kind of got the shaft.

Montclair has not been impressive with their wins this year.  If you want to be ranked in the top 20, you should be able to blow out some teams, especially in the bottom of the NJAC.  Montclair has not done that.

I have not caught up on the entire thread so forgive me Johnny and others if the point has been made.  Montclair, prior to the Cortland game had scored 219 pts to opponents 57.  They beat Morrisville 42-6 and WConn 31-3.  Me thinks Johnny should do his homework before making such statements.

[phil]

Perhaps if they beat Westconn & Morrisville by 50 each and outscored their opponents 319 to 57 they might be able to compete for a quarter against a top 10 team...

....please note dripping sarcasm.

[clandfan]

Perhaps if they beat Westconn & Morrisville by 50 each and outscored their opponents 319 to 57 they might be able to compete for a quarter against a top 10 team...

....please note dripping sarcasm.

umbrella in hand

[JT]

At what point in time did the entire NJAC conference begin to be characterized as "crap"? Missed the memo.
This is what the expansion has done for the NJAC. Before the expansion TCNJ, Rowan and Montclair couldn't buy a non-conference game. The NJAC goes out and takes care of that situation and Buffalo St., Morrisville, WestConn and Brockport haven't been able to be very competitive. But now, according to our "posting elite" the NJAC's best teams can't hope to win against a top ten team? There needs to be some 40 point blowouts on the schedule? C'mon.

Good lord, the year Rowan beat MUC they lost the game and the NJAC championship to TCNJ. Thank goodness they weren't kicked out of the top 100, forced to turn in their uni's and banned from the NCAA playoffs.

Phil what has the NJAC done nationally since 2001?  You can add whomever you want, that doesn't make your teams better.

2005, 19-7 loss to Mount Union in the semis without a QB who went down with a season ending injury at Cortland.

[Knightstalker]

At what point in time did the entire NJAC conference begin to be characterized as "crap"? Missed the memo.
This is what the expansion has done for the NJAC. Before the expansion TCNJ, Rowan and Montclair couldn't buy a non-conference game. The NJAC goes out and takes care of that situation and Buffalo St., Morrisville, WestConn and Brockport haven't been able to be very competitive. But now, according to our "posting elite" the NJAC's best teams can't hope to win against a top ten team? There needs to be some 40 point blowouts on the schedule? C'mon.

Good lord, the year Rowan beat MUC they lost the game and the NJAC championship to TCNJ. Thank goodness they weren't kicked out of the top 100, forced to turn in their uni's and banned from the NCAA playoffs.

Phil what has the NJAC done nationally since 2001?  You can add whomever you want, that doesn't make your teams better.

2005, 19-7 loss to Mount Union in the semis without a QB who went down with a season ending injury at Cortland.

Didn't Rowan end up playing with a RB or WR at QB that season?

[MSU Pride]

How many of your people played as opposed to actually being a fan and I ask this for one reason...Who are you to say a team should be able to blow out a team without trying, G does not run up scores, period!!!! I am not saying that Montclair are the angles of D3 football, but I can't sit here and not respond to your statement which holds no water whatsoever.

While at MSU we had the opportunity to blow the doors off of several teams but Giancola refuses to do so, respect is a very big thing with him and as far as he is concerned a win is a win. You will never see a Montclair team win by 50 especially an NJAC opponent. He would never do that to another program or coach.  When MSU gets a lead, MSU will sit the same formation probably mustang and will run some sort of stretch/zone play, take time off the clock and play field position.

"Keep Pounding"

Sam Mills

[Jonny Utah]

I think the main point you guys are missing is that there are so many teams with 1 or 2 losses, a 13 spot drop in the rankings isn't that unusual, especially when you were raked at the bottom of the undefeated teams in the first place.

Oklahoma was #1 in the country in week 8.  They lose and drop 8 spots to #9 in week 9.  Where do you think TCU would be ranked if they lost?

Missouri loses and drops 7 spots.

Michigan State drops 9 spots (11 spots in the coaches poll)

If TCU loses to Utah 10-9, they drop to 15 or 16.  If they lose to San Diego St. 10-9, they drop out of the poll.

If Montclair lost to Western CT 10-9, it makes more sense to drop out of the poll.  But to Cortland....I think 22-23 would have been a little more realistic.

True, but TCU is ranked #5 while Montclair was ranked #14.  That tells me pollsters were not that high on Montclair in the first place.  I also think if SJF played Montclair, SJF would win.  There were simply too many teams that had to move up from #20-#30 last week that Montclair kind of got the shaft.

Montclair has not been impressive with their wins this year.  If you want to be ranked in the top 20, you should be able to blow out some teams, especially in the bottom of the NJAC.  Montclair has not done that.

I have not caught up on the entire thread so forgive me Johnny and others if the point has been made.  Montclair, prior to the Cortland game had scored 219 pts to opponents 57.  They beat Morrisville 42-6 and WConn 31-3.  Me thinks Johnny should do his homework before making such statements.

No, I'm still not impressed with Montclairs season.  A top 10 team would beat the bottom four of the NJAC by a combined score of 200-14.  

They can prove me wrong by not losing by 42 points to MUC which I think they would.  Then I will buy everyone here a beer.  

[Jonny Utah]

How many of your people played as opposed to actually being a fan and I ask this for one reason...Who are you to say a team should be able to blow out a team without trying, G does not run up scores, period!!!! I am not saying that Montclair are the angles of D3 football, but I can't sit here and not respond to your statement which holds no water whatsoever.

While at MSU we had the opportunity to blow the doors off of several teams but Giancola refuses to do so, respect is a very big thing with him and as far as he is concerned a win is a win. You will never see a Montclair team win by 50 especially an NJAC opponent. He would never do that to another program or coach.  When MSU gets a lead, MSU will sit the same formation probably mustang and will run some sort of stretch/zone play, take time off the clock and play field position.

"Keep Pounding"

Sam Mills

I actually played against Montclair State twice (1-1).  I actually found them to be dirty and mouthy and we had some battles (it may have been dirty on both sides though as sometimes these things get out of hand on both sides).  Those were the old days though.  I'm not sure that comes from the coach or not.  It could have been some bad blood between the coaches there too, as there always seemed to be some sort of rivalry tone when we played them.  Maybe that was just our coaches trying to fire us up.

[MSU Pride]

Actually I think when I was a frosh we put it on Kean pretty bad, that would be the exception and only because the third strings were in still scoring at will...that was 2001...

I look at this completely different though; the fact that there are really no more blowouts in the NJAC anymore, as far as I am concerned is a testament to the elevated level of competition and the quality athletes being dispersed amongst the entire league, not just Rowan and or MSU. TCNJ, Cortland, MSU, Rowan and Kean have all played for a conference championship within the last few years. What other conference had that many different teams play for a Automatic bid to the playoffs, instead of one dominate team and a black horse ...

"Keep Pounding"

Sam Mills

[MSU Pride]

Johnny what team did you play for??