MBB: St. Louis Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[pantherpride06]

Final from Greenville, Ill. (Habitat for Humanity Classic)
Harris-Stowe d. North Central
Robert Morris d. Greenville

Not much here.  Robert Morris was tough and physical with our guys.  Lot's of fast break points for RMC.  Excitement for Greenville as Hensold drained a shot just over the lenth of 1/2 court at the halftime horn to cut the lead to 5.  Greenville battled, but it wasn't enough.

Only a couple notes tonight because I need to head to bed.

Hensold 21 pts, Conquest 16, Simmons 12.  Panther shoot 43%

RMC shot 54.8% for the game. Five of their six scoreres in double figures with Price leading the way with 30 and about 3 priceless dunks.  Enough to knock one RMC player to the floor.

1pm - North Central v. Robert Morris
3pm - Greenville v. Harris Stowe

Stowe pretty much coasted to a 73-64 win.  NC made a late game surge after being down 20, but it wasnt enough.

[sully309]

Eureka @ Fontbonne...I really have no idea what to expect from EC Saturday. Not that I'm doubting them, but finals started Friday. I'm sure some players will be taking finals earlier in the day Saturday before they leave (nice scheduling, I know). Hopefully the Red Devils prove my worries all for naught. One thing that might make things a tad more challenging for Eureka this season on the road is the fact that many of us have never seen the gyms at Fontbonne, LCC, Mac and Maryville. Luckily, Coach Bruer was able to schedule away games at Webster, Westminster, Prin, Blackburn and Greenville last season. Of course, EC will have the same advantage with teams playing at Eureka for the first time, so may it evens out.

I just hope the guys notice they have 3 weeks until their next game. That's a long time to have to sit on a loss. This could be a very good game. I'm planning on making the trip, so I'll try to spot you, Hopefan.

Beaver SID...I've already commented on Blackburn, but I just don't see them being a very consistent team without a post threat. BC is capable of beating any team in the conference, but Zeb needs to play better than he did against Eureka. Maybe EC got a break catching BC early in the season with a 1st year coach.

[pantherpride06]

Speaking of Eureka and being new to the conference schools....

It will be tough for Greenville to beat Eureka.  Here's some history between the squads...

These two teams first played in 1951-52.  The teams split that series.  Overall, Eureka has the huge edge, 46-23 over Greenville in 69 played contest.

Eureka has won 30 of the last 35 v. Greenville dating back to the 1980-81 season where Greenville won 3 of the 4 meetings between the two schools.  I believe Eureka & Greenville were in the same NAIA Conference (The Prarie Central Conference).

Why does this matter?   It doesnt, just thinking about Eureka_SID's post about playing the SLIAC schools.

[hopefan]

Nothing like going to see eureka @ Fontbonne for a 3:00 game and finding out that they are playing @ 6:00..... so much for seeing that one....  wish someone would have said something, but I shouldn't have assumed...

Well fortunately, I had plenty of time to decide whether to go over and see Webster @ Mac, or LCC @ Maryville   -   I chose the LCC @ MU game thinking it would be a closer game  -  WRONG

Maryville breaks open a close game with about 10 minutes left and beats LCC by 25.

Then A very disgusted y jak lok phones me to let me know that Webster had a horrid game and lost at home by 5 to Mac  -  the Mac Attack can celebrate tonite!!!

No time to write at length about Maryville  -  they finally hit a bevy of 3's in the last 5 minutes to blow the game open - Frosh guard Jarred McCoy recorded 17 assists! -  Guards Teddy McGrath and Tyler Saxton shot well, and Casey Holland, when he wasn't missing dunk attempts, played aggressively around the basket and had to have a double double. Frosh big man Matt Stemike continues to work hard and had 12 points and a reasonable number of boards. 

Yes, it was against light weight LCC, but it was a real upper for this young team.

[y_jack_lok]

I'm pretty sure I didn't use the word "horrid" in describing Webster's game. They went to halftime down 9. Slowly chipped away in the second half and had a two point lead 2 or 3 times, but couldn't stretch it any further.

I'm just a simple fan who has watched a lot of basketball but has never played or coached and never had a kid who played, so my observations should be understood as coming for that background. Here are those observations. Webster didn't play tough enough perimeter defense in the first half, allowing too many 3 point shots. The box score says Mac hit 6 of 12. I was guessing at halftime that they had hit 7 or 8. Webster missed free throws at crucial moments in the 2nd half. If they hit the front end of a couple 1 & 1s, then they might make the 2nd shot and get two points instead of none. Aslo, Mac deserves credit for playing a very good game. Mac Attack's faith in his troops is confirmed in my opinion.

On another note, I then went over to Fontbonne to see them play Eureka. I missed the first 9 minutes. (Hunger  had set in and I went home for some supper.) It was an exciting game which Fontbonne should have won. They  had the ball and a 1 point lead with 13 seconds to go. Got the ball across mid court and it somehow it found it's way to frosh guard Cartez Parker under the basket who, instead of running away and dribbling out the last 5 or 6 seconds, or allowing himself to get fouled (he had just made 2 free throws to give Fontbonne the lead), puts up a shot that hits the corner of the rim where it meets the backboard. Eureka gets the rebound. The Eureka coach calls time out with 2.3 seconds left. Eureka throws a length of the court pass which is caught by AJ Richard who turns and swishes a fade away jumper. Final: Eureka 75 Fontbonne 74.

I was sitting in an area populated by a number of Eureka fans. It was interesting to be a non-partisan observer in that environment. I complain about officiating with the best of them -- or so I thought. I have more than met my match with the Eureka fans.

[Mac Attack]

MacMurray 71   Webster 66

Wow. Just a few randon thoughts. Been a long day. This is a guess but only a guess, but I think MacMurray led for about 38 of the 40 minutes played. Jumped out early to a 16-8 lead and led by nine at the break. Mac led by 10 several times in both halves. Webster tied it at the 8:00 minute mark in the second half and grabbed the lead once or twice with about six minutes left - but MacMurray made some critical plays at both ends of the floor down the stretch and got it done.

The first thing I always do when going to a game is watch the oppostion warm up. Do they have a hop in their step? Are their shots fluid? Do the players show any emotion or are they just going through the motions? From my seat, it sure looked like Webster thought all they had to do was show up. MacMurray played with much more intensity from the opening tip to the last second. It made a difference. A big difference.

y_jack_lok is absolutely correct on Webster's inability to guard the perimeter in the first half. Whalum and Colman filled it up early and often, allowing the Highlanders to grab an early lead and establish the confidence they would need down the stretch.

The Gorlocks were much bigger and stronger - but I'll bet MacMurray won the battle of the boards. MacMurray did a much better job of blocking out, scrambling for loose balls, and following their shots.

I said earlier that MacMurray would need to keep their turnovers under 15 and avoid any prolonged scoring droughts to have a chance. Without seeing the stats, I'm guessing Mac didn't have more that 15 turnovers and while their scoring slowed some in the second half, they never hit the wall. One reason was because MacMurray was able to spread the floor and Whalum and Coleman were able to slash through the defense for high percentage shot and/or free throws.

I really liked Spinner and Turk for Webster. Quality players and quality young men. Hoggatt spent about 1/3 of his time on the bench, 1/3 of his time complaining to the officials, and 1/3 of his time doing what he wanted to do on offense. But his inability to run the floor and defend the smaller and quicker Mac players proved to be a real problem for him and his coach. MacMurray's inside players - Compton, Robertson, and Greene - scored just enough to carry their weight and combined to play extremely tight defense for about the entire game. Webster had the taller and stronger players - but MacMurray's inside players "played bigger."

Why did Webster go to a 2-3 zone with three minutes to play and down by five? This allowed MacMurray to melt the clock on 3-4 possessions, and still come away with points. Would be interested to know why Webster's coaching staff made this decision...

This was a big, big win for Coach Hettinga and the MacMurray basketball program. There is a long, long way to go in the 2006-2007 and we all know that one game does not a season make. But MacMurray really needed this one, just like Greenville needed its win the other night. But a win like this will give the coach a lot of "currency," in terms of selling his philosophy to his players - not that Coach Hettinga needed to do that. But any coach with any experience will tell you that when you're picked to finish seventh in the pre-season conference poll, then lose your first three games (all at home), being able to go into the conference favorite's own gym and earn a hard fought win like MacMurray did today, it really makes a difference in the players attitude and enthusiasm.

We're off until December 29, when the Highlanders play Huntingdon College in the LaGrange (Ga) Classic. Well done, Highlanders. Well done. You have a right to be proud.

[Mac Attack]

Justed checked the stats on Websters website.

MacMurray only had 14 turnovers. That was big.

Mac's Jerel Robertson had 17 points and 16 rebounds. I'm nominating him right now for the SLIAC Player of the Week.

Mac outrebounded Webster 45-39. Enough said.

Hoggat only played 21 minutes, but had 17 points and 10 rebounds. Robertson played 37 minutes.

MacMurray missed 11 free throws, with is usually fatal in a game like this. But Webster missed nine...

Early foul trouble by Greene in both the first and second half limited his contributions. He's a good young player. Both him and Robertson are only sophomores.

MacMurray's guards - Whalum and Coleman - were a combined 10-21 from the field (6-9 3pt), had seven assists, three steals, and scored 33 points. They were the difference, along with the solid team rebounding and the interior defense played by Greene, Compton, and Robertson.

[Mac Attack]

Westminster 72   Principia 48
Harris-Stowe 80   Greenville 78

Week #4 Pick 'em Results

Mac Attack 12
Beaver SID 11
PantherPride 11
FCNews 10

Through Week #4 Season Totals
FCNews 42
PantherPride 39
Beaver SID 39
Mac Attack 37

[y_jack_lok]

Mac Attack, I was going to give you the link to the box score, but you already found it.

I try not to read too much into what I see in warm-ups, but perhaps you are right in this instance. I remember the '01-'02 Webster team (my first year in the area) that entered conference play 2-9. In one of the first 2 or 3 conference games they pulled out a close win at the end of the game and played fired up from then on, winning the confernce with an 11-3 record. Much of what sustained them was the emotional energy and exhortation of Ryan Jacquot. If someone on this year's team would step up and do the same thing it could make a big difference.

[sully309]

The Eureka @ Fontbonne story is on the EC web site, if anyone wants to check it out. I don't have a version to put on the web, so I'll throw some stats on here:

EUREKA
Tarpley 11-13 FG, 3-3 FT, 27 pts, 5 reb
Peffer 6-16 FG, 4-12 3PT, 16 pts, 3 ast
Richard 6-9 FG, 12 pts, 4 reb, 2 blk
McComb 4-6 FG, 9 pts, 7 ast
Wildenradt 2-2 FG, 2-2 3PT, 6 pts, 3 reb

Team: 53% FG, 10-24 3PT, 3-4 FT

FONTBONNE
Branch 8-13 FG, 4-8 3PT, 22 pts, 4 reb
Parker 7-16 FG, 2-4 3PT, 4-5 FT, 20 pts, 6 reb, 6 ast, 4 stl
Fogerty 5-12 FG, 13 pts, 5 reb
McCoy 2-6 FG, 1-4 3PT, 3-4 FT, 8 pts, 3 stl
Storandt 2-5 FG, 5 pts, 2 reb

Team: 44% FG, 8-21 3PT, 12-14 FT

Observations: Nice facility and place to watch a game. The Red Devils got away with playing Fontbonne's style and pace. Both teams gave up gobs of open looks in the first half, but buckled down a little better in the second. Nice job by Fontbonne on the boards in the 2nd half, getting a 22-14 reb. advantage. Quiet nights by White and McCoy, or this could have been a different story. Fontbonne had obvious trouble defending the post, but did force 19 turnovers with their zone press. The biggest turnover came with 20 seconds left. It's easy to say this now, but why pull the ball out when you have a free path to the basket? Fontbonne ended up not even getting to the line and giving Eureka another chance. Then, no person guarding the in bounds pass with 3.5 seconds left? Again, there is not a clear-cut right or wrong answer in these cases, but it could have been the difference between a win and a loss. After seeing the scores today, it's safe to say this will not be the last game Eureka plays that goes down to the last shot.

y_jack_lok: sorry you had a bad experience with the EC fans (there looked to be plenty of open seats on the opposite side, you know...just kidding) If it means anything, they seemed more vocal toward the refs than usual tonight. We usually have a pretty loyal crew that goes to road games, so it won't be the last time you see some of them. Don't worry...they'll wear on you.

Hopefan: sorry I missed you. I guess I assumed everyone checked the web site for the game time. In the NIIC last year, different schools played Saturday games at different times. I wasn't aware that 3 pm was a traditional starting time or I might have said something. Oh well...at least you didn't miss an exciting game or anything.

[Mac Attack]

Pick 'em games for Week #5:

Monday, December 11   
Fontbonne @ Rose-Hulman 7:30 PM
   
Wednesday, December 13   
Maryville @ Washington U 8:00 PM
   
Saturday, December 16   
Maryville @ UMSL 7:00 PM
Fontbonne @ Washington U 3:00 PM
Blackburn @ Millikin  7:30 PM
   
Sunday, December 17   
Westminster @ Illinois College 3:00 PM

Please have picks in by Monday afternoon, before game time. Good luck!

[Mac Attack]

My picks:

Dec. 11
Rose-Hulman

Dec. 13
Washington U.

Dec. 16
UMSL
Washington U
Millikin

Dec. 17
Illinois College

Hard to believe I'm not picking one SLIAC win for this week. I sure hope I'm wrong. Would like to us win all of them!

[y_jack_lok]

eureka_sid, I didn't mean to imply that I had a bad experience with Eureka fans. I said it was "interesting" to be among them. I know "interesting" is a word that is often used as cop out to avoid saying what you really mean, but in this instance I wasn't doing that. Since I had no personal interest in the outcome I was able to watch the game without the reacting to the officiating. Certainly the officials made some calls (or no calls) that went against Eureka which merited criticism. It happens to every team in every game. But these folks complained about even the most obvious Eureka fouls, and consistenelty throughout the game kept yelling at the refs to "watch the hands" whenever Fontbonne was on defense and their defender had a foot or two of seperation on a Eureka player (with or without the ball) but grazed them ever so slightly with their hands. There was no holding going on, nothing that affected play, and they were not identifying a particular player who might have been routinely getting away with something that should have been called. I found it strange that that would be the sort of thing they would get loud about.

[hopefan]

ouch  -  tough week for SLIAC teams going into the Christmas break  -  as I look at the handful of games scheduled, I have to believe a SLIAC win will be tough to come by unless Westminster can win on the road at Illinois College -

one point of interest - Maryville plays at Wash U at 8:00 Wednesday - the prelim to that game will be the Maryville Ladies vs Wash U ladies - you might remember that last year, the Maryville ladies claimed the biggest win in their history when they upset Wash U over at Maryville  -  this could be another good game, with the Bears looking to reclaim their D3 St Louis championship.  Both teams lost key players to graduation but have resumed their winning ways this season.

[pantherpride06]

I'd like to comment on  y_jack_lok  comment on fans.  Note: I'm not trying to cause an uproar, just simple conversation here.

Couple things.  When Fontbonne was at Greenville, the Fontbonne fans & coaches was out of control when it comes to riding the officials.  I sat at the scorers table on the side right by the bench.  Coach Quigley (Women's Coach) and his assistant did more crying and whining to the officials than any coaching staff that I have seen.  Well, until Friday/Saturday when North Park's Men's Coach did the same.

Another issue came last night at the Blackburn/Greenville women's game.  The Blackburn crazies were not there cheering, but it was a pretty solid crowd.  Definately not cheering.  But, Greenville has about 10 students there and about 5 or 6 parents there.  Greenville won by about 35 but we had a couple heckers out there for Greenville.  I had a woman sitting beside me start bashing on him and then bashing on Greenville as a school/community.  I went off and she and I had it out for about 5 minutes duing the last minute of the game and following the conclusion of the game with everyone in attendance watching.  Here were a few of her comments:

"College Kids shouldn't act like that," "You shouldn't do stuff like that at games," "You should be acting your age," and "You are an almuni of the school and making your self out to be an idiot."

In arguing with her, she tells me she is a high school teacher and has never been to a men's game at Blackburn, which in my mind completely dis-credits her.

So, few things sponded from this.  1) Are we as fans held responsible to act different for a guys game and a girls game? 2) Why complain about the fans unless they are verbally bashing someone?  Greenville has had a great crowd the last 3 home games.  Ask FCNews.  Amazing crowd.  I'm sure there are people saying that we were out of control.  But I don't understand why.  They were jumping, cheering, yelling, celebrating...

I guess basically I am struggling with the whole fan thing and why some people get in a uproar over it or upset. 

I'm looking for some answers from folk that have been around the game forever.