MBB: St. Louis Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[Mac Attack]

Terrific game in Jacksonville tonight. MacMurray took the lead about half way through the first half and never looked back. Led by double digits the entire second half and I think the lead was as many as 19 two or three times. Hard fought game at both ends of the floor. Fontbonne stayed in their zone most of the game, forcing the Highlanders to rely on Coleman and Whalem to knock down shots from the oustdie - and they did. Whalum finsihed with 22 (12-12 FT) and Coleman had 24 (5-9 3pt). When the Griffins went man-to-man, Robertson (21 pts)and Greene (10 pts) went to the basket. McCoy (21), Foggerty (20), and White (19) all played very well for Fontbonne. Two solid teams, both very well coached. Looked to me like MacMurray's team speed and athleticism played a big part in the outcome. And even though Fontbonne was much, much bigger, Mac fought them to a draw on the boards, 35-35.

Fans were into the game on both sides, probably a little too much for my taste.

I'm really confused about the tiebreakers, but Mac needs to focus on Wednesday night. I thoguht if two times tied, they would go to the highest ranked team and compare records, and down the line - i.e. if MacMurray and Webster tie, they would compare records against the third place team, which could be Fontbonne, Greenville, or Eureka. If the records were the same, they would go to the next highest ranked team, and so on. Thought I read this on our board a few days ago, but maybe not.

Looked like Robertson reinjured his hip and could barely walk after the game. He didn't play the last 10 minutes of the game, which makes MacMurray's win even more amazing. Congratulations to Coach Hettinga and the Highlanders on another impressive victory. It has truely been an amazing season for MacMurray. I will say I thoght something special was brewing back when Mac first played at Western Illinois and did so well in the second half. But little did I know this team would be where it is today.

Had a chance to meet fcnews. Real nice guy who appreciates good basketballand loves the Griffins as much as I love the Highlanders. Pleasure meeting you fcnews -now go get a win at Webster next Wednesday night. And always nice to have hopefan in the building. No one knows more about the SLIAC than hopefan - a true sportsman who enjoys the game and wishes the best for all of the players and coachs. And finally, I introduced myself to Coach McKinney after the game. A wonderful man and true gentleman. It was an honor to shake his hand and wish him good luck the rest of the way.

What a night. And what a week. Beating Eureka, Greenville, and Fontbonne all in the same week. Not many picked that to happen. On to the Beaver Dome.

[pantherpride06]

Well, I enjoyed getting a little steak peak for the second time in three weeks at Illinois College's men & women.  What is probably more impresive is Illinois College's facilities.  Wow!  Really impressed with what they are working with at IC.

Looking at IC's conference, it looks like they travel alot.  Why not get IC in the SLIAC to fill what will be a vacant spot the Lincoln Christian will leave us with.  How interesting would the IC/MC match-ups be?  How intersting would it be of IC/MC were playing in Jacksonville for a SLIAC title?  Just a thought.  Seems logical for IC??  i dunno. 

As for the SLIAC right now, my Panthers squeaked one out today.  By what I understand from my source, Greenville trailed the entire game by as many as 12.  Greenville shot 31% in the 1st half but hit shots down the stretch to win by 3.

So (info via Hopefan), with Eureka, Westminster (Mo), and Greenville all tied up for the 4th and final playoff spot, GREENVILLE holds the key to their future.  Greenville host both these two teams next Saturday (Eureka) and the Tuesday after (Westminster).  What a crutial two games.  No doubt I will have HJ long going on Saturday.  With a win, Greenville will be on fire Tuesday fightning the Jays for the final spot.  Have no doubt about that....

BUT, we have to take care of Eureka.  Panthers will play STL Pharmacy on Wednesday in prep for the showdown Saturday.  Interesting, Interesting Ball coming up for my Panthers.

As I told a parent on Friday Night, I really have to give Greenville some props.  Win or lose next week, Greenville will end with a minimum of 11 wins.  Excluding the 19-8 season of 2003-04, Greenville has won 9 or less games each season since the 2000-01 season.  Greenville has found a core group of guys that can get it done.  They are on the brink of accomplishing something big this year by getting in the SLIAC tourney (1st time since 98-99). 

I'm pulling for my boys!  Let's go!

[fcnews]

MacAttack - It was very nice meeting you also. This was basically a reversal of the game played at FU.

Like Coach McKinney said after the game,"When you are a run and gun team and the shots don't fall, it's always going to be tough to win."

Big props to one Mac father (I beleive it was Mr. Greene) his son was #51. He was involved in a hard foul play with FU's Fogerty towards the end of the game. He tracked down Coach McKinney after the game and wanted to appologize for his son's foul. Coach said" Thank you but that's not neccessary it part of the game." He was a class parent.

I was a little down after today's contest. It wasn't a lack of effort by the young Griffin's. The shots just would not fall. And, Mac just beat us. 

[Pat Coleman]

But the last two weekends, i've seen behavior from some parents of SLIAC players that goes way beyond the limits that are set forth -  I zipped my lips today, but when My enjoyment of a game is infringed on by someone who simply isn't seeing what's really happening on the floor, screaming at the officials EVERY play, it's at the ridiculous stage.  For crying out loud, at least try to support the kids whether they're winning or losing.  I'm lucky, at this stage in my life, I can go to the SLIAC games and root for good play and close games and appreciate the competition no matter who wins.  Believe me people, I haven't seen an official intentionally blow a call yet.....   To paraphrase the immortal Billy Tubbs, try to act like a human being NO Matter how bad the officials are!!!

That's a great point -- it's amazing how parents behave sometimes. I've been lucky enough to be at some crowded games of late where a parent doesn't stand out, but many, many times I've been less fortunate. Even at the Final Four last year, where I was broadcasting but Wittenberg people were so loud and obnoxious behind me that I had to turn around and glare at them.

Not every referee is part of a conspiracy (in fact, I would say none are). Nobody is out to get your son. You don't have many games left watching your son play competitive basketball in your lifetime. Try to enjoy them.

And for goodness sakes, learn the rules. By the time they get to college you should know the over and back rule. Or, in women's basketball, that there is no 10-second backcourt violation. (Yeah, seriously, I've heard it.)

[y_jack_lok]

I couldn't agree more with hopefan and Pat Coleman. I am a partisan spectator, but I decided a number of weeks ago that I needed to quit being highly vocal when I get upset with officiating calls (or non-calls), although I will admit to still making comments out loud (though not screaming). The result is that I enjoy the games much more and leave the gym much more relaxed and much less upset if my team loses. The people I sit with are also happier to be around me. I'm not the parent of a player, so that makes it easier for me to stay calm. If I had a kid out there it might be a different story. I really admire the parents who watch the games calmly and refrain from badgering the officials.

[Mac Attack]

Many, many post-season possibilities still exist. According to the SLIAC website, here's the tie-breaker rules:

For all two way ties, other than for fourth, the procedures are, in order: 1) Head-to-Head competition between the tied teams. 2) Record of the tied teams against other teams starting with highest. 3) Total point differential in the games between the tied teams. 4) Coin flip conducted by the Commissioner.

For multiple team ties, including for fourth, the procedures are, in order: 1) Head-to-Head competition between the tied teams. 2) Total point differential in games between the tied teams. 3) Coin flip conducted by the Commissioner.

For two way ties for fourth the procedures are, in order: 1) Head-to-Head competition between the tied teams. 2) A playoff, on a neutral court selected by the Commissioner, on the Wednesday or Thursday prior to the Tournament.

[Mac Attack]

Week #12 Pick 'em results:

PantherPride 12-14
Mac Attack  11-14
Godfather  11-14
BeaverSID   No entry

Totals thru 12 weeks:

PantherPride 95
Mac Attack 93
Godfather  75
BeaverSID  70

Week #13 Pick 'em

Wednesday, February 14   
Westminster @ Maryville  6:00 PM
Greenville @ St. Louis Pharmacy 7:00 PM
Fontbonne @ Webster  6:00 PM
Principia @ Lincoln Christian  6:00 PM
MacMurray @ Blackburn  6:00 PM
   
Friday, February 16   
Emmaus Bible College @ Lincoln Christian 7:00 PM
   
Saturday, February 17   
Maryville @ MacMurray  3:00 PM
Eureka @ Greenville  3:00 PM
Webster @ Principia  3:00 PM
Blackburn @ Westminster  3:00 PM
Lincoln Christian @ Fontbonne  3:00 PM
   
Tuesday, February 20   
Fontbonne @ Maryville  6:00 PM
Westminster @ Greenville  6:00 PM
Principia @ Eureka  6:00 PM
Lincoln Christian @ Blackburn  6:00 PM

Need your entries by gametime, Wednesday. Good luck!

[pantherpride06]

Week #13 Pick 'em

Wednesday, February 14   
Westminster
Greenville
Webster (Sorry fc, I hate to go back to Jacksonville for tourney.  Nothing against you MacAttach)
Lincoln Christian
MacMurray
   
Friday, February 16   
Lincoln Christian (Please don't lose and get embarrassed)
   
Saturday, February 17   
MacMurray
Greenville
Webster
Westminster
Fontbonne
   
Tuesday, February 20   
Fontbonne
Greenville
Eureka
Blackburn

Therefore Making my final four in order: 1. Webster, 2. MacMurray, 3. Fontbonne, 4. Greenville

[Mac Attack]

Did I miss the announcement that Lincoln Christian was leaving the SLIAC? They just joined...

What in the world has happened to Eureka? They looked like a title team just a couple of weeks ago - but now are looking at a must win at Greenville just to get in the post-season.

Interesting possibilities for post-season play, but:

If Mac wins out and Fontbonne wins out, Mac will be the regular season champion.
If Mac wins out and Webster wins out, it looks like the tiebreaker could go all the way down to games against Blackburn - in which case Mac would the be the champ.
If Greenville wins out and Fontbonne loses at Webster, it would appear that the Panthers would finish third.
If Mac splits their last two and Fontbonne wins out, looks like a three-way tie for first with a lot depending on the Webster/Fontbonne score. Looks like it would be  Webster first, Mac second, and Fontbonne third - unless Fontbonne really thumped Webster.

I may have some of this/all of this wrong - other SLIAC posters should doublecheck my work and correct me if I messed up on any of this. One thing is certain - still come crucial games left, and yes, now we're looking at "must wins" for some teams. I think all eyes next Wednesday will be on the Fontbonne at Webster game, with MacMurray at Blackburn critical for Mac's title hopes.

[Mac Attack]

I'm wrong about Mac being the champ if they and Webster wins out. Webster would win the tiebreaker based on the sweep of Fontbonne...

[Mac Attack]

My picks for Week #13 (and Week #14):

2/14
Westminster
Greenville
Webster
LCC
MacMurray

2/16
LCC

2/17
MacMurray
Greenville
Webster
Westminster
Fontbonne

2/20
Fontbonne
Greenville
Eureka
Blackburn

That would mean:

1. Webster (14-4)
1. MacMurray (14-4)
3. Greenville (12-6)
4. Fontbonne (12-6)

Webster, based on sweep of Fontbonne, would host. Greenville, based on win over Webster, would be seeded third.

[fcnews]

Pat Coleman - I respect you as a journalist and a pioneer. But, you are 100% wrong in your previous statement regarding referee's. You can take a stand to be journalistically "Politically Correct". You and I both know that referee's do have agendas. I have seen as many games as most of the posters on here. It happens frequently at all levels.  IF your statement was true then why would coaches have the right to blackball. In small conferences in areas with schools from several levels, these referee's have been calling games for these coaches for years and years. Agendas do exist.

If the previous posts concerning adult fan behavior was directed towards FU parents, then you need to know that one part of that crew has called the games involving 3 losses. You have one of FU's stars get two fouls in the first four minutes in a zone defense. Agenda. The same player battles in the paint for his points and very rarely gets a call. Agenda. This may have accounted for some vocal displeasure for some of the calls. I'm not agreeing with it, but I'm sure my voice was heard on several occassions. When half your crowd moans when the ref's walk out, you need to move.

This in no way changed the out come of yesterdays game. It did contribute to the game getting very rough down the stretch. I don't think anyone saw a player intentionally being flagrant. But, there was alot of frustration amongst both teams.

Pat I hate to have to call you out like that. I do think I know where you were headed. It is a part of this game.

On to "The Battle of Big Bend".

[Pat Coleman]

Nobody is out to get your son, I said.

If someone is out to get your coach ... well, that's possible. But that's your conference's problem to deal with. But I'll be honest, I've watched a lot of basketball -- a lot of officiating and a lot of coaches' complaints, and they do not always match up with an impartial observation.

Parents and coaches are the epitome of biased observers. If you complain about every call, your complaints are meaningless. Save the complaints for something truly worthy. Don't cry wolf on every little bit of contact or non-contact.

That's what I'm trying to get across.

[Pat Coleman]

I also said referees are not part of a conspiracy. If you have proof of a conspiracy, I'd like to hear it. (One person is not a conspiracy.)

I feel like my statement was reasonable and I'm not sure your statement disproves it.

[hopefan]

ok Mac and anyone else  -  let's assume that any of the 6 contenders wins remaining games against the 4 non contenders - that leaves only 3 games left  between contenders, or 8 different combos of winners - Games left are Font @ Webster, Eureka @ Greenville, Westmin @ Greenville

1)  Webster over Font, EC over GC, GC over Westmin
standings are Webster and Mac @ 14-4, Font and EC @ 12-6
Webster and Mac split, but vs 3-4 Font and EC, Webster swept both Font and EC while Mac split with Font, So Webster Hosts, Mac 2 , EC 3 having swept Font, Font 4

2)  Font over Webster, EC over GC, GC over Westmin
standings are
Mac @ 14-4, Webster and Font @ 13-5, EC @ 12-6
Mac Hosts, Webster and font are 2-3, EC is 4

3)  Webster over Font, GC over EC, GC over Westmin
standings are Webster and Mac @ 14-4, Font and GC @ 12-6
Webster no 1 having swept Font while Mac split with them  , 3 and 4 Font and Greenville split , but Greenville split with Webster and Mac while Font  was swept by Webster, so Greenville 3, font 4

4)  Font over Webster, GC over EC, GC over Westmin
standings are
Mac @ 14-4, Webster and Font @ 13-5, GC @ 12-6
Mac Hosts, Webster and font are 2-3, GC is 4

5)  Webster over Font, EC over GC, Westmin over GC
standings are Webster and Mac @ 14-4, Font Westmin & EC @ 12-6
Webster no 1 having swept both Font and EC , record between the 3-4-5  teams is Font 2-2, EC 2-2, EC 2-2, so it goes to point diff.  Font is +27 for third, EC is (9) for 4th, Westmin is (18) for 5th and out.

6)  Font over Webster, EC over GC, Westmin over GC
standings are
Mac @ 14-4, Webster and Font @ 13-5, EC and Westmin @12-6
Mac Hosts, Webster and font are 2-3, Westmin gets tiebreaker over Eureka having swept Eureka.

7)  Webster over Font, GC over EC, Westmin over GC
standings are Webster and Mac @ 14-4, Font and Westmin @ 12-6
Webster no 1 having swept Font  , Font no 3 having swept Westmin, Westmin 4

8  )  Font over Webster, GC over EC, Westmin over GC
standings are
Mac @ 14-4, Webster and Font @ 13-5, Westmin @ 12-6
Mac Hosts, Webster and font are 2-3, Westmin is 4


Things to notice  -  there are certain situations above where interpretations may vary  -  my interpretation may differ from the SLIAC office

The whole scenario above changes - obviously - if any of the contenders loses to a noncontender

note, only one scenario, scenario 6 generates a playoff game for 4th- scenario 6 between Westmin and Greenville - and it would probably be Wednesday as the Greenville ladies would be in the conf tourney on Thursday.

note only one scenario comes down to point differential, Scenario 5, where Font is rewarded and Westmin punished for two big pointspreads of Font over Westmin

For fans planning to attend, it's obvious the big game is Webster Font - if Webster wins that game, they'll host, if Fontbonne wins, Mac will host.

other games to watch will be Westmin @ Maryville, Mac @ BC, BC @ westmin, Maryville @ Mac, and Font @ Maryville   -  BC and Maryville have been competitive throughout the conference season - they could change everything around.