MBB: St. Louis Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[BunchTime]

Obviously, panther, there is a direct correlation with playing a tough non-conference schedule and fairing well in SLIAC play.  Your numbers support that conclusion, where Webster has one of the lower non-conference winning percentages and the highest SLIAC winning percentage.  Finally some facts to support my strength of schedule argument.

Never did I say that playing difficult competition will yield a SLIAC title every year, however, it certainly makes the Gorloks competitive every single year, giving themselves the chance to win the title (now that their is a conference tourney).  Their winning percentage is significantly higher than any other team since the 2002-2003 season.

[pantherpride06]

Greenville doesn't have any either.  That's not the purpose of my argument.  It's that we continue to criticizes Fontbonne and Greenville and others for their scheduling tactics.  However, Webster continually seems to have the toughest schedule in the SLIAC (Transy, Hanover, Wash U, Platteville) , yet they only have one title to show for it.  Obviously Greenville has none.  That, again, is not the point I'm discussing.  It's this hard/tough schedule that is going to make Webster the best team in the SLIAC, yet they continually get beat come tournament time.  So, does the tough schedule really make them much better?  Are we out to have a 16-10 records when we are scheduling tough teams or are we out to have 16-10 records, a SLIAC Title, and a trip to the big dance? 

Note, I have no hard feeling or any beef with any team in the SLIAC.  I will always call the SLIAC home and I like Coach Bunch and all the Coaches in the SLIAC from Barber at GC to Matt Mitchell at Westminster.  I have no hatred towards anyone, just looking for why we continually harp on scheduling?  I've been dogging this topic for years.

[fcnews]

Ouch - couldn't resist...

Your right Hope you really can't........

But - that appears to be the only thing you were right on all day.

Miss read a boxscore this morning (tired eyes) and forgot FU's non conference woes these past couple of years (short term memory loss).

Let's do congratulate Pride for being undefeated at Christmas.

[y_jack_lok]

The point of my question "How many dooes Greenville have?" was that in sports there is this tendency to define the success of a specific team, a program, or a coach (and in the case of football, a quarterback) by whether or not they win even one championship. I think the view that "He was a great coach (or quarterback; or they have a great program), but they've never won whatever championship" is the least important question. It's like putting an asterisk next to a coach's, or team's record. There are countless schools and coaches in D3 hoops (and may other sports at many other levels) that have been successful by almost every measure except that one -- even at the conference level, much less at the national level.

[fcnews]

Coaching philosophies are very different and in most cases very successful. Each coach is different the same as players are different. A coaching staff's success is measured on a lot of different layers. Recruiting, Retention, Graduation, off the field contribution and on the field success. On the field is the toughest to scrutinize. It wasn't to lon ago that Big Eight schools football teams had one goal, win the Big Eight Title. Now it is about positioning for a BCS. So much is placed on NCAA National Tournament appearances in today's media.

Each coach prepares his troops to reach a goal. Coach Bunch and his assistants have made a statement when it comes to controling conference play and Titles. Blackburn, Maryville and Fontbonne have had their National Tournament teams. Greenville has been successful at the NCCAA tournament level. An awful lot of success going on.

In the early awards list: Webster and Mac's womens programs have already attained a measure of success. Look at the numbers and level of play.

[fcnews]

Bunchtime - I thought I would ask for your take on the Mitchell Report. Does it stand on it's own merit? Or, is it a wonderful oppurtunity for "billing hours"?
Either way I wasn't to impressed. It appears to be a list of the aging, injured and obscure. It appears, strictly from the news coming out, that most of these cases were players trying to prolong careers, revive a broken body or earn a guy a pay - day.

Most interesting: Cody McKay - Why? Kent Merker - Should ask for a refund. Mo Vaughn - Powerfull - But is that the body you associate with steroids?

[fcnews]

SLIAC games of interest before Christmas:
Tonite - EC @ Knox(2-4,2-0 MVC)
Tomorrow -  ILL. College(4-2 2-0 MVC) @ Westminster in Hawaii
12/16 - Coe (2-4,0-1 IIAC)  @ Maryville
12/18
Webster @ MSOE(4-2,1-1 NATHC)
Lakeland(3-4,1-2 NATHC) @ Mac
12/19 -
WC @ Walsh (OH) NAIA II 8-1 #3             in Hawaii
Blackburn @ RHIT(2-6,1-2 HCAC)
12/20
WC @ Fresno Pacific NAIA  7-2 (win over USC)       in Hawaii
Maryville @ MSOE
BC @ RMC-S (2-2 v. SLIAC)

[BunchTime]

FC, my take on the Mitchell report is that it confirmed what I already thought -- that the whole game of baseball is tainted.  Players who are third string catchers, and journeymen relief pitchers are not beyond suspicion.

But back to basketball, anyone know what kind of team MSOE is?  I suspect that is Webster weakest non-conference foe; however, my assumption could be off base.

[fcnews]

MSOE is usually a pretty solid club. FU played them twice the past 4 or 5 years. Uasually very smart and well coached.

[y_jack_lok]

As you probably know, BunchTime, Webster lost to MSOE by 3 last year partly due to lack of production by the Webster bench. That won't happen this year. This one could probably go either way.

[fcnews]

Interesting out come for EC last nite. Knox had loss to RMC-S by 19 earlier in the year.

[sully309]

Eureka fell to 2-7 last night with a 74-64 loss at Knox. I had a bad feeling before this game even began. Zasada again was out and 3 or 4 other Red Devils were ill. I know Coach Wilde doesn't want to hear the excuses, but these are the facts that I think should be reported.

Knox deserved to win this game, if for no other reason than EC couldn't rebound missed free throws. Knox score 6 points off missed FT's in the 2nd half alone! Perhaps Knox was a tad underestimated. They did beat Ripon earlier this season and Ripon has played LaCrosse to a 1 point game and Stevens Point to a 4 point game today.

One thing is for certain, this 2nd half swoon stuff is going to have to stop soon. Eureka has either led or been within 2 points of the lead at halftime of 7 games played this year and is 2-5 in those games. Luckily, the 2 wins came in conference, but this needs to stop. I would be more willing to snuff off this last one due to fatigue if it hadn't already happened so much already.

Props go out to Darnall and Wildenradt for nice games. McComb seems to be finding it shot some. Hopefully he can recover during the break. Cody Myers and Craig Black showed some aggressiveness off the bench also. Now comes a 22 day lull between games...

[sully309]

My take on the scheduling discussion:

Isn't it possible that Webster has such a good SLIAC record because they have better players? I really don't think their non-conference schedule has much to do with it. I mean, Webster normally finishes highly in most SLIAC sports right? So why should basketball be any different? I'm not trying to take anything away from Coach Bunch & Co. Their success is impressive, but it's mostly due to having more and better players.

The 1st 5 non-conference opponents for our women's team here have a combined record of 28-10 right now. Does that automatically make them better? Hardly. They've lost 4 of them by 19+ and the other by 8. It's killing me to watch these demoralizing games. For the best college experience, they deserve to play competitive games and be able to feel good about themselves once in a while.

Y_jak hits on a good point (as usual)...there's much more to amateur sports than winning championships. Let's not forget that folks.

[hopefan]

Maryville loses to Coe close  -  were up by a point at 51-50 with about 8 minutes left - still in the game with 2 minutes left, then 3 poor possessions in a row with turnovers or poor shot selection sealed their fate.

MU still uses the pressure defense - gave up some easy hoops, and could not defend Coe's post man  he ended up with near 30.  But wow - MU plays hard- I like that - Jarred McKoy could be the best guard named McKoy in the conference-  if he doesn't get too uptight with Coach Roger's constant....coaching (no I won't use a more harsh word).

Coach Rogers plays a cast of thousands like last year- all but one Saint had already had playing time in the first half -most saw court time in the 2nd half too.  I'm sorry, I don't like it - too many guys in and out - make a mistake, you're out, miss a shot , you're out.  Guys get in a rhythm, do one thing wrong, they're still out.  Some guys aren't in long enough to find a rhythm.  Some guys I like, get 10 minutes, less time than others who seem to do less.  I just can't figure out the playing time, and I don't know if the kids can either. Example - Jake Bechle gets 4 minutes in the first half, looks GOOD, virtually nothing in the 2nd but is in to take a 3 pointer that could have tied the game with 2 minutes left - a lot to ask of someone who had hardly played - 8,9,10 men, I like, 13,14 can't keep your best on the court.

On the other hand - like I said, the pace that Coach demands is fun to watch, and can be disruptive for the opposition.

This team should be a favorite to be the fourth team in the conference tourney - (all 4 of the Missouri schools?)

Must try to listen to the novice broadcasting team of Bash and Elwell on the Maryville internet.   Two of my favorite players from Maryville's championship teams of 2 to 4 years ago.  Not sure which of these guys would be the straight man though!!!



p

[fcnews]

The Post Season Tourney MVP is Patrick McCoy. That's the McCoy that just had 12 and 10 with 1 turnover.

But, Jarred probably already is the best McKoy in the SLIAC.