MBB: St. Louis Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[hopefan]

Shortly after posting info on Mac's newcomers, I received an email from Coach Baribeau at Blackburn...  looking over his recruiting list, he may have even one upped Coach Creal's haul... that's great for the conference, and great for a BC program that has suffered through hard times for several years.  Coach Baribeau supplied a pretty straight forward list, so I'll simply copy and paste...the list has more names than I saw this summer, and size (height) is far greater than I expected.....

Fr. Eric Gustafson 6-1 (New Berlin, IL) - 3rd Tean All-state, 1st Team All-Springfield 24ppg
Fr. Jeff Taylor 6-3 (St. Anne, IL) - 2nd Team All-State 16ppg, 7.3 Rbs
Fr. Malcolm Scott 6-7 (Chicago, IL) - IBCA Special Mention. 22ppg,13 Rbs
Fr. Bo Fry 6-4 (Fairfield, IL) - IBCA Honorable Mention, ABV 2nd Team, avg. 19ppg
Fr. Reed Rusten 6-4 (North Greene, IL) - IBCA Honorable Mention 16ppg, 7 Rbs
Fr. Jake Lochhead 6-2 (Chester, IL) - ABV Special Mention 17.2ppg, 5.8 Rbs
Fr. Jordan McMillen 6-8 (Greenfield, IL)
Fr. Andre Strayhorn, 6-0 (Paducah, KY) Top 5 in KY in 3pt %
Jr. Chris Davis 6-4 (Springfield, IL) - All-MWAC Honorable Mention
Jr. Henry Hicks 6-4 (Chicago, IL)

This looks EXTREMELY impressive to me, but once again, I must claim ignorance to my knowledge of Illinois HS basketball and how these kids might compare to Mac's group, or the Missouri high schools that I'm more familiar with.   Anyway, add this group to returners Chris Davis (that's right, BC will have 2 individuals named Chris Davis on the team, and they both could start), Tommy Ulinski, and Jamie Moore, and that is a heck of a nucleus to build on.

CCIW readers.... any comments on either BC or Mac recruits?

[y_jack_lok]

So, ten new bodies for Blackburn, eight freshmen and two juniors, and some impressive height. If a few of them can make real contributions this season there could be some exciting games in the conference.

[Former Devil 40]

Talked with Coach Wilde on Friday at my wife's HoF Induction Ceremony about the upcoming season. Sounded like he had some good numbers on campus to play ball this year (20ish if I remember correctly).

They may also have a small JV schedule this year to get some of the guys deeper on the bench experience.  He only mentioned one name and it was one of the Lobdell brothers from last year (the guard).  When I saw him play and played against him I thought he had a real good motor and could put the ball in the hole when needed.  not sure why he fizzled out but hopefully he's with the squad all year.

Will be interesting to meet the new faces and see how they stack up at the alumni game.  I believe it will be sometime in early November so I will post back after the game as long as I am able to attend/play.

[hopefan]

Talked with Coach Wilde on Friday at my wife's HoF Induction Ceremony about the upcoming season. Sounded like he had some good numbers on campus to play ball this year (20ish if I remember correctly).

They may also have a small JV schedule this year to get some of the guys deeper on the bench experience.  He only mentioned one name and it was one of the Lobdell brothers from last year (the guard).  When I saw him play and played against him I thought he had a real good motor and could put the ball in the hole when needed.  not sure why he fizzled out but hopefully he's with the squad all year.

Will be interesting to meet the new faces and see how they stack up at the alumni game.  I believe it will be sometime in early November so I will post back after the game as long as I am able to attend/play.

I noticed Marious Lobdell was on the roster... thought it was a misprint as he and Marcus Lobdell were seemingly dismissed from the squad last year...  he has quite a history.. played at Illinois Central in 2008-09, at Judson 2009-10, disappeared in 2010-11 and 2011-12, played at Aurora in 2012-13, played at Eureka for 4 games in 2013-14....   Eligibility rules get complicated at times, but I wonder what applies in this case?  Would seem to be his 5th season in 7 school years....The Eureka roster does not yet include any new names, so I'm anxious to see how Coach Wilde's recruiting went... he needed some help after the dismal season last year....

[ecreddevils]

Shortly after posting info on Mac's newcomers, I received an email from Coach Baribeau at Blackburn...  looking over his recruiting list, he may have even one upped Coach Creal's haul... that's great for the conference, and great for a BC program that has suffered through hard times for several years.  Coach Baribeau supplied a pretty straight forward list, so I'll simply copy and paste...the list has more names than I saw this summer, and size (height) is far greater than I expected.....

Fr. Eric Gustafson 6-1 (New Berlin, IL) - 3rd Tean All-state, 1st Team All-Springfield 24ppg
Fr. Jeff Taylor 6-3 (St. Anne, IL) - 2nd Team All-State 16ppg, 7.3 Rbs
Fr. Malcolm Scott 6-7 (Chicago, IL) - IBCA Special Mention. 22ppg,13 Rbs
Fr. Bo Fry 6-4 (Fairfield, IL) - IBCA Honorable Mention, ABV 2nd Team, avg. 19ppg
Fr. Reed Rusten 6-4 (North Greene, IL) - IBCA Honorable Mention 16ppg, 7 Rbs
Fr. Jake Lochhead 6-2 (Chester, IL) - ABV Special Mention 17.2ppg, 5.8 Rbs
Fr. Jordan McMillen 6-8 (Greenfield, IL)
Fr. Andre Strayhorn, 6-0 (Paducah, KY) Top 5 in KY in 3pt %
Jr. Chris Davis 6-4 (Springfield, IL) - All-MWAC Honorable Mention
Jr. Henry Hicks 6-4 (Chicago, IL)

This looks EXTREMELY impressive to me, but once again, I must claim ignorance to my knowledge of Illinois HS basketball

No knock on BC's recruits, they may be great, but sometimes IBCA HM can be misleading.  There are four teams of 20 ahead of HM, so you might have 100 players ahead of these guys in their particular class, not to mention that sometimes the 1A players, like a few of these look like they are, sometimes play at very small schools against not-so-great competition.  A line like Malcolm Scott at 6' 7" averaging 22/13 looks impressive, but google and find out that he played for Rickover Naval Academy, who's schedule is padded against traditionally poor prep schools and some of the lower-level teams from the public league.  Again, who knows how they'll pan out, but be careful of the accolades and numbers.

http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/document/0054/9793/20141A2ABoysAllState.pdf

[hopefan]

Good comments ECred... and that is why I added a comment in my post about not being familiar with Illinois HS basketball and the level these kids are playing at.... Wanted to convey enthusiasm but temper it with my lack of specific knowledge ... I'll also point out that Coach Baribeau sent me only the list and numbers I posted, while Coach Creal made some comments about each of his recruits, some of which I relayed in my  post on Mac...

Hey, while I'm talking to you here, can you supply us with any info on new faces at EC, or the reappearance of one of the Lobdells... Can't seem to find any responses out of anyone associated with the EC basketball office or their SID...

[WUPHF]

More concern over the long term viability of Iowa Wesleyan: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2014/10/08/iowas-largest-public-university-scrambles-students-private-colleges-worry-they-will

Not to mention the IIAC schools.

[WUPHF]

...it was a historically low freshmen class. I heard 125.

Talk about long term viability.  Fontbonne cannot sustain itself with those numbers even when including the non-traditionals and OPTIONS students.

[hopefan]

More concern over the long term viability of Iowa Wesleyan: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2014/10/08/iowas-largest-public-university-scrambles-students-private-colleges-worry-they-will

Not to mention the IIAC schools.

Interesting to note that 16 of 21 players listed on Iowa Wesleyan's men's hoops roster and 9 of 12 on the women's roster are from out of state... 43 of 52 on the football roster are from out of state!   Thinking how small IWC's student body is, that's 15% of their numbers right there!!    I wouldn't think that their entire student body would be divided like that, but it's obvious they have pull (likely church related too) outside of Iowa.

[y_jack_lok]

More concern over the long term viability of Iowa Wesleyan: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2014/10/08/iowas-largest-public-university-scrambles-students-private-colleges-worry-they-will

Not to mention the IIAC schools.

Interesting to note that 16 of 21 players listed on Iowa Wesleyan's men's hoops roster and 9 of 12 on the women's roster are from out of state... 43 of 52 on the football roster are from out of state!   Thinking how small IWC's student body is, that's 15% of their numbers right there!!    I wouldn't think that their entire student body would be divided like that, but it's obvious they have pull (likely church related too) outside of Iowa.

See the text I bolded above. The schools with Wesleyan in their name were founded by Methodists (at least I'd be surprised to learn of one that wasn't) but most have long since lost any meaningful connection to the Methodist church. My alma mater (Randolph-Macon) and my wife's alma mater (Southwestern University in Georgetown, TX) were both founded by Methodists but have only the slimmest of ties to the denomination now. I suspect the desire to play a particular sport at a particular institution is much more of a deciding factor for a student athlete than a school's very limited relationship with the Methodist church. I won't say that necessarily holds true for schools related to other denominations, however.

[hopefan]

More concern over the long term viability of Iowa Wesleyan: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2014/10/08/iowas-largest-public-university-scrambles-students-private-colleges-worry-they-will

Not to mention the IIAC schools.

Interesting to note that 16 of 21 players listed on Iowa Wesleyan's men's hoops roster and 9 of 12 on the women's roster are from out of state... 43 of 52 on the football roster are from out of state!   Thinking how small IWC's student body is, that's 15% of their numbers right there!!    I wouldn't think that their entire student body would be divided like that, but it's obvious they have pull (likely church related too) outside of Iowa.

See the text I bolded above. The schools with Wesleyan in their name were founded by Methodists (at least I'd be surprised to learn of one that wasn't) but most have long since lost any meaningful connection to the Methodist church. My alma mater (Randolph-Macon) and my wife's alma mater (Southwestern University in Georgetown, TX) were both founded by Methodists but have only the slimmest of ties to the denomination now. I suspect the desire to play a particular sport at a particular institution is much more of a deciding factor for a student athlete than a school's very limited relationship with the Methodist church. I won't say that necessarily holds true for schools related to other denominations, however.

I know in the Methodist Church we used to attend, there would be College posters of various 'Wesleyans' hung in the teen area...at least enough to make kids aware of schools like Iowa Wesleyan.. though I will admit that was a large number of years ago

[y_jack_lok]

More concern over the long term viability of Iowa Wesleyan: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2014/10/08/iowas-largest-public-university-scrambles-students-private-colleges-worry-they-will

Not to mention the IIAC schools.

Interesting to note that 16 of 21 players listed on Iowa Wesleyan's men's hoops roster and 9 of 12 on the women's roster are from out of state... 43 of 52 on the football roster are from out of state!   Thinking how small IWC's student body is, that's 15% of their numbers right there!!    I wouldn't think that their entire student body would be divided like that, but it's obvious they have pull (likely church related too) outside of Iowa.

See the text I bolded above. The schools with Wesleyan in their name were founded by Methodists (at least I'd be surprised to learn of one that wasn't) but most have long since lost any meaningful connection to the Methodist church. My alma mater (Randolph-Macon) and my wife's alma mater (Southwestern University in Georgetown, TX) were both founded by Methodists but have only the slimmest of ties to the denomination now. I suspect the desire to play a particular sport at a particular institution is much more of a deciding factor for a student athlete than a school's very limited relationship with the Methodist church. I won't say that necessarily holds true for schools related to other denominations, however.

I know in the Methodist Church we used to attend, there would be College posters of various 'Wesleyans' hung in the teen area...at least enough to make kids aware of schools like Iowa Wesleyan.. though I will admit that was a large number of years ago

It wouldn't surprise me if what you describe is still done by Methodist related schools -- posters in youth group rooms and literature disseminated through the churches to the high school students. But I think other denominations have a stronger pull on students to their colleges. And of course the Catholic colleges have Catholic high schools to recruit from.

[Gregory Sager]

The proliferation of schools with the name "Wesleyan" in them can be confusing. Here's the facts:

First of all, they're not all of a piece in terms of their identity. Unlike the schools named Concordia, which are all affiliated with the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod, the schools that are named Wesleyan, or that have that word as part of their name, are not all from the same denomination. One thing to remember is that there's no such thing as "the Methodist Church." Like Lutheranism, Presbyterianism, Baptism, etc., Methodism is a movement within Protestantism in general, not a specific denomination. (Methodism is actually a subgroup of a larger Protestant grouping of denominations known as the Holiness movement, but that's a tale for another day.) The largest Methodist denomination, by far, is the United Methodist Church. It's often mistakenly called "the Methodist Church," but that's not its name -- and it's not fair to the smaller Methodist denominations to call it that.

Most of the colleges and universities in the United States that have the word "Wesleyan" in them are affiliated to one degree or another with the United Methodist Church. That includes such D3 examples as Iowa Wesleyan, Ohio Wesleyan, Illilnois Wesleyan, Virginia Wesleyan, Nebraska Wesleyan, and Wesleyan (GA). In some cases, the affiliation is extremely tenuous; the UMC has little or no role in either campus life or in administering the school. This is true of Illinois Wesleyan University, to use the most familiar example to the readers of this room. Other "Wesleyan" schools affiliated with the UMC, such as Kentucky Wesleyan, have closer ties to the parent denomination and are more conspicuously Christian in their mission statements and/or campus culture. I don't know where Iowa Wesleyan falls into that spectrum.

But ... there are also other schools with the word "Wesleyan" as part of their name that are affiliated with other denominations. Given that these denominations are all more theologically conservative than the UMC, these schools are likewise more conservative in terms of their mission statements, policies, and campus culture than are the UMC-affiliated Wesleyans. They include Oklahoma Wesleyan University and Indiana Wesleyan University, which are both affiliated with the Methodist denomination known as the Wesleyan Church (which also claims D3 provisional member Houghton College as an affiliate); and Roberts Wesleyan College, which is affiliated with the Free Methodist Church (with which SLIAC member Greenville College is also affiliated).

Then there's Wesleyan University, the NESCAC member in Connecticut and the oldest school in the U.S. with the word "Wesleyan" in it. That school disassociated itself from Methodism and completely secularized itself way back during the Depression.

Hope this helps.

[y_jack_lok]

Very interesting, Sager. My wife is a chaplain and was in the United Methodist system (though never got ordained) for about ten years, so she is much more knowledgeable about this stuff than I am. As I understand it, Methodism sprang up from the work of John Wesley who became known for his "method", whatever it was. And I do know that the UMC is not the only "brand" of Methodists. I think there may also be about as many brands of Presbyterian as there are Methodist -- PC(USA), PC in America, Cumberland Presbyterian, Evangelical Presbyterian, perhaps one or two more.

But back to colleges for a second, I certainly am limited in my knowledge of which institutions with Wesleyan in their name are affiliated with which brand of Methodism, so thank your for clarifying that. I was speaking about the ones I assumed to be associated with the UMC.

It's always fascinating where a conversation on these boards might lead and you can learn about a lot of things other than sports sometimes. But eventually we have to get back to the more important topic of basketball.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Back when I was there (late 60s), IWU was still very much affiliated with the United Methodist Church (which was still the Methodist Church in those days) - the bishop had a building on campus, there was compulsory chapel, the religion department got the behaviorists in the psychology department fired, etc.  It is now probably the most thoroughly secular school in the CCIW.  I suspect that all the the conference schools except Wheaton (and NPU?) are now more secular than they were back then.