MBB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[Mr. Downtown]

Some posters over on the MIAC board are saying that Nate Robertson from UWRF may transfer to Bethel next season

I'm sorry to say this, but its not a big deal if Robertson decides to stay at RF or not. His impact will be the same if he continues his play from this season.

No one underachieved as much as Robertson did this season. Lot of potential, but never really showed it on the court this season.

Funny, how it seems that all of the WIAC team's will be better next season, except River Falls...and they didn't even make it to the conference tourney this season.

[Gregory Sager]

"Each player is only allowed to be put in the scorebook 25 times per regular season, so if you want to dress a JV player for the varsity game afterwards, he'll end up using two of his 25 eligible games in one night."

Actually, players can be entered in the scorebook for as many games as the coach wants. They can only participate in 25 total games, and those can be any combination of varsity or JV games (or as Coach Ryan called them, "futures" games.) Only seeing court time counts as participation.

Yes, by "be put in the scorebook" I meant committing a foul, scoring points, etc., not just having one's name written in the book. And I should've said that he could end up using two of his 25 eligible games in one night, rather than he will do so. Sorry if I was unclear about that.

A couple of things here.  In my estimation, greyshirting didn't become an issue until redshirting was banned.

I really don't think that grayshirting is an issue at all. I've never encountered anyone complaining about it.

Also, in regards to JV teams.  It sounds like (and I know I've asked this before but forgot the answer) that playing on a JV team would be considered using a year of eligibility...thus it would defeat the purpose of playing JV when players from cheaper public schools can just "greyshirt".  Playing JV gives you the advantage of having "game time" experience, but you end up using a year.  If a player knows he's out in four years and isn't good enough to play varsity, sure, suit him up for JV.

Participating in junior varsity games does mean that your eligibility clock is running. That's why I made the point yesterday about how a player can participate in only 25 regular-season games per year, varsity and/or junior varsity.

Playing JV is sometimes all about not being good enough for varsity, as you said. But it also serves as a developmental squad for players who have varsity potential but are not yet good enough to play varsity, or for players who have varsity potential but are not yet physically strong enough for the rigors of varsity, or who have better upperclassmen standing in their way on the depth chart, etc. Lots of good players start their careers on JV teams. Several CCIW Most Outstanding Players began their college careers as JV players, including three-time CCIW MOP (and future Portland Trailblazers forward) Michael Harper of North Park.

If you're grayshirting rather than using up a year of eligibility by playing JV, then you're not getting any better as a basketball player. In fact, you're probably regressing. Most coaches figure that it's worth it to have a player use up a year of eligibility now on the JV team if it'll make him varsity-ready the next year.

In other words, a JV team doesn't automatically carry the stigma of being the consolation prize for players who lack the talent to play varsity.

[Hoops Junkie]

To say RF will not be better is probably short sighted.  You do not think that with the return of Koonkaew they immediately get better.  I was told he is back playing some.  They may get better by subtraction with headaches in Robertson, Wright and Davis gone.  They will be better

I have heard some rumors about a solid recruiting class as well

[Pioneer Hoops Fan]

Pioneers annouced to HS Seniors that have committed to play at UWP

Tanner Carlson

Alex Bondar

I saw the Bondar kid play in the sectional finals against Monroe.  Only scored 6 points, but was basically guarded by two Cheesmakers at all times.  Has a nice touch around the basket.

Nice start for commitments thus far for the Pioneers.

[Mr. Downtown]

They for sure need Koonkaew. However with a injury that he had this season, you wonder how much of that explosiveness he has lost.

If he does come back, it will be the feel good story of the year, in my opinion. He would have climbed a tall mountain just to get back to the court.

[Greek Tragedy]

A couple of things here.  In my estimation, greyshirting didn't become an issue until redshirting was banned.

I really don't think that greyshirting is an issue at all. I've never encountered anyone complaining about it.

Using the word "issue" was probably not the right word.  I only meant it as "greyshirting" as a topic or being brought up as a subject at all.  Was greyshirting even a word before redshirting was banned?  If redshirting was legal, why even bother greyshirting, there isn't any advantage to that, at least from what I can see.

Playing JV is sometimes all about not being good enough for varsity, as you said. But it also serves as a developmental squad for players who have varsity potential but are not yet good enough to play varsity, or for players who have varsity potential but are not yet physically strong enough for the rigors of varsity, or who have better upperclassmen standing in their way on the depth chart, etc. Lots of good players start their careers on JV teams. Several CCIW Most Outstanding Players began their college careers as JV players, including three-time CCIW MOP (and future Portland Trailblazers forward) Michael Harper of North Park.

If you're grayshirting rather than using up a year of eligibility by playing JV, then you're not getting any better as a basketball player. In fact, you're probably regressing. Most coaches figure that it's worth it to have a player use up a year of eligibility now on the JV team if it'll make him varsity-ready the next year.

In other words, a JV team doesn't automatically carry the stigma of being the consolation prize for players who lack the talent to play varsity.

There definitely is an advantage of playing JV, I don't argue that point at all.  The only disadvantage is that you use up a year of eligibility.  Sure, if you greyshirt, you may not improve at all, and as you said, may actually regress.  But, if you are planning on going to school for 5 years and think you can be a part of the team your "redshirt"/"greyshirt" freshman year, then you don't want to use up a year of eligibility on JV.  If there is any chance that your "greyshirt" freshman year is on par with your "real" sophomore year, then I'd greyshirt because that gives you an extra year to play.

To say RF will not be better is probably short sighted.  You do not think that with the return of Koonkaew they immediately get better.  I was told he is back playing some.  They may get better by subtraction with headaches in Robertson, Wright and Davis gone.  They will be better

I have heard some rumors about a solid recruiting class as well

Was Robertson a "headache"?  I kind of guessed taht Davis was one since he was in and out of the lineup all year, and I don't think it was because of matchups.  Not sure what Wright's attitude was.  River Falls was disappointing and losing Koonkaew didn't help.  I don't think River Falls was going to be real good anyway, but Koonkaew's loss and Robertson's disappointing 2nd year attributed to the Falcons being a lot worse than some of us might have thought.    If Robertson returns to River Falls, I don't see how he can be as bad as he was this year.  It was a tough year for him.  I guess I look at it like Billy Hall.  Two years a go we was great, last year he was horrible and you hope this year he's somewhere in-between.

[Just Bill]

Grayshirting is an unofficial term and does not appear in any NCAA manual.

It was a term borrowed from D-I football.  In D-I football lingo a grayshirt is a new freshman who may or may not practice in preseason, but is "cut" during camp with the understanding that they can come back during the spring practice season.

I've also heard it applied to HS seniors who graduate at winter break and enroll in college during the spring semester so that they can participate in spring football practice.

[uww4ever]

Saw Rob Perry working out today in the weight room.  Really feel for the kid, what might have been if he was on the team during the playoffs.

Now with the off-season, when oh when will WW announce any recruits?  Usually doesn't happen.  But nice to hear about other schools and who they can get.  Hopefully during the off season some of the hawks will get stronger and thus get better to make another run.  We have a lot coming back, if none of them pull a "Donlow" or a "Price"  

GO HAWKS

[Greek Tragedy]

We have a lot coming back, if none of them pull a "Donlow" or a "Price"  

GO HAWKS

I remember talking about losing Price at the beginning of the year and a lot of Warhawk fans said that Price would not be missed (offensively, at least)...they were right.

[Cody-1-Kastern]

  We have a lot coming back, if none of them pull a "Donlow" or a "Price"  

GO HAWKS

UWW4ever,

What did happen to London Donlow?  Did he transfer or just call it quits? 

[Greek Tragedy]

BW,

You going to Holland?

[Just Bill]

BW,

You going to Holland?

If you are, watch out.  That Red Light District can really mess you up. 

[buf]

Just watched the D1 selection show.

Can someone explain to me how Texas got the #2 seed over the Badgers? 

I'm sure Texas played a "tougher" schedule, but Wisconsin won at Texas without one of its starters (Hughes) earlier this season, had a better record, and won its conference tournament today (Texas lost).

[badgerwarhawk]

BW,

You going to Holland?

Yes, I have my hotel reservations made and I'll be driving to Holland Friday.  You want to ride along? 

[badgerwarhawk]

Just watched the D1 selection show.

Can someone explain to me how Texas got the #2 seed over the Badgers? 

I'm sure Texas played a "tougher" schedule, but Wisconsin won at Texas without one of its starters (Hughes) earlier this season, had a better record, and won its conference tournament today (Texas lost).

The NCAA looks at strength of the whole body of work rather than the outcome of a single aspect of it.  I was disappointed as well but the difference between the 2 and the 3 is relatively insignificant. 

One "official" explanation that I have heard is that the strength of Texas's nonconference schedule was much better than ours and that was a consideration.