MBB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[badgerwarhawk]

Hoops fan, I was wondering if you knew the reason Skemp was ejected from the building.  That seems awfully drastic and it's very rare that an official will make an issue of something a spectator is doing unless it is way, way over the top.  I've watched WIAC basketball games since 1968 and I have never seen a spectator ejected.  I have seen game management speak to a few spectators and I've seen spectators that I'd like to eject myself but I've never seen it actually done so my curiousity level is up there on this one. 

[Pioneer Hoops Fan]

Hoops fan, I was wondering if you knew the reason Skemp was ejected from the building.  That seems awfully drastic and it's very rare that an official will make an issue of something a spectator is doing unless it is way, way over the top.  I've watched WIAC basketball games since 1968 and I have never seen a spectator ejected.  I have seen game management speak to a few spectators and I've seen spectators that I'd like to eject myself but I've never seen it actually done so my curiousity level is up there on this one. 

Sent you a message explaining it.  There are fans that should get the boot but never do.  Its thankless, and having thick skin is required to be an official but I thought it was very drastic.  In reality, Jeff was probably on the much lighter end of what was happening with crowd and the officials, just think he got picked since he's 6'10" sitting in front row and the official thought he was a little bit bigger than Jeff.

[Greek Tragedy]

I called Jake Wolter a punk once.    At least I think it was "punk."

I later had to re-explain that it was a compliment. 

Updated standings making things interesting.

Whitewater 9-2 
Stevens Point 9-3 
Platteville 6-5 
La Crosse 6-6 
Stout 6-6 
Eau Claire 5-6 
Superior 5-6 
Oshkosh 4-8 
River Falls 2-10

I'll concede the conference championship to Whitewater.  I think that the Pointers are still a safe bet to get the #2 seed, though we still have trips to La Crosse and Platteville to come.  Eau Claire and River Falls come to Quandt.

Stout has a big game against Oshkosh this weekend.  They have to keep the momentum going.

River Falls still has my head scratching.  They have a good "Big Three" in Koonkaew, Jake Voeltz and Wade Guerin, but is everyone else that bad?  I don't think so!

[bulk19]

The dust has settled for but one day... but we'll see a few more tornados roll through the standings as soon as this Saturday. Ha.

With the way things are going, and have gone in the past, I won't concede the conference championship to Whitewater, but...

the big question is: Who wants to finish 3rd? 

[wcbsas]

The dust has settled for but one day... but we'll see a few more tornados roll through the standings as soon as this Saturday. Ha.

With the way things are going, and have gone in the past, I won't concede the conference championship to Whitewater, but...

the big question is: Who wants to finish 3rd? 

I think the real question is who wants to finish 6th.  It appears to me you've got 7 teams vying for 6 playoff positions.  UWO is probably on the outside looking in with 4 games left including a season-ender against UWW. 

Unfortunately I think UWS is the team on the outside looking in ... with 3 of 5 on the road

[badgerwarhawk]

I wouldn't concede anything at this point in time.  We've got our work cut out for us if we're going to finish on top.  Regardless the positive thing is that we control our own destiny.  So whatever happens will be of our own doing. 

[John Gleich]

I wouldn't concede anything at this point in time.  We've got our work cut out for us if we're going to finish on top.  Regardless the positive thing is that we control our own destiny.  So whatever happens will be of our own doing. 

I haven't conceded yet and I know Point hasn't either.  There are 5 games left in the regular season for Whitewater and there are too many good teams to just give it up.  EC and Stout have pulled upsets.  Oshkosh and Superior have come close.  Point has an uphill battle... their last 2 are on the road, but the fact if the matteer is that WW has to play an extra game.  that's one more opportunity for them to slip up and, while 4/5 are in WW, that's an extra game where things could bounce against WW.

Point needs to pull their own weight... this program isn't used to losing games in late January or February (or at all, for that matter) and they need to bounce back.  the weekend off should make them hungry again and allow them to refocus.  Something needs to be done about the start of the second half... two games with extended dry spells like that just haven't happened, and it isn't like they're getting bad shots... but it's more than that.  I think it starts on the defensive end.  both WW and Stout shot tons better in the second half than the first, especially from deep.  And I know in the Stout game, they got second chance opportunities and capitalized on them.

In addition to the defense, there were way too many turnovers.  Some of them were just Stout being Stout and several were fantom travels (three straight times down the floor) but others were just sloppy basketball.  It seemed like they didn't really know what to do, though I can understand thay if the shots aren't falling to some extent.  It is hard to maintain a lead like that, especialy if the other team is play like they have nothing to lose and things start going their way, but there's  gotta be a stoploss point.  Point was up 15 against WW and went down 12.  at some point the team needs to just come together and acknowledge that their 15 point lead is gone and they need to strap it on for a battle the rest of the way out.  They did that in both games... a 15-2 run against WW and another big run to get a chance to tie against Stout when they had gone down 13 I think, with about 6 minutes.  The difference in the two was that they shut WW down and took a lead.  Stout almost killed themselves with unforced TO's... but they were unforced, by and large, not caused by great defense.

The other thing is the FT shooting.  It was pretty bad in both games (though curiously, there were ZERO FTs in the second half of the Stout game that was pretty physical.

more later...

[cubs]

Curt or anyone else for that matter isn't even close to being on the same Jerk level Vince Thomas was.

I'd put former Blugold Jason Larson right up there with him.....

[John Gleich]

Back to FT shooting...

It's always said that FT shooting is mental, not physical, and it's true too... why else would crowds try to distract the shooter if it was just physical?

Point has been the best FT shooting team in the country in the not too distant past and they have some tremendous FT shooters.  The guy that's struggled the most this year is Scottie Hoelzel... and he's gotten to the line a fair amount due to his relentlessness around the basket.  Unfortunately , it's  become a bit of a liability  especially late  in games .  I know  Sem would love to be able to play Scott  at the end of games, especially for his defense and rebounding .  But I think Scott thinks he's goiung to miss when he gets up there.  I don't  think it's  a conscious  thing... actually, I think he'd  tell you he does feel he'll make it... but subconsciously, he thinks he'll miss.  

I can comiserate with him... I used to be the same way, but I turned myself from a bad FT shooter with no confidence  into a decent one with a bit more confidence.  I think anyone (who is playing at this level can do it... but I don't think enough emphasis is put on visualizing yourself doing the action correctly.  That will teach your mind to see the ball going through the hoop and not missing.

I think there's a real disconnect from watching a professional or a good D-I player with great form do something and doing it yourself.  so often teams watch film of the things that went wrong and that becomes the train of thought.  This needs to be replaced with focused thoughts or viewing of you doing it correctly.

That may seem a little weird, but I turned myself from a 40% FT shooter into a 75% shooter.  

[Pioneer Hoops Fan]

Curt or anyone else for that matter isn't even close to being on the same Jerk level Vince Thomas was.

I'd put former Blugold Jason Larson right up there with him.....

Agreed.  I never wanted to say anything to him though.  Strong, built kinda like a bowling ball.  I'd get set up, and he'd roll right over me.

[bulk19]

Curt or anyone else for that matter isn't even close to being on the same Jerk level Vince Thomas was.

I'd put former Blugold Jason Larson right up there with him.....

He did a lot of talking, but I was never close enough to hear if it was trash. I did see him in WIAC off-the-courts performance, playing in Gus Maker hoops tournaments; his team has been quite successful, winning several titles in a row....
One hasn't seen trash talking unless you've witnessed one of these tourneys. Ha.

It's hilarious to see Larson keep his mouth shut there (GM), as other players who were trash talkers, and younger, less talented and skilled, would shoot their mouths off and try to bait him.. He'd generally kept his mouth shut, get the eye of the tiger, step up his game and let that speak for itself. He's usually taken home the trophy, getting the last word, so to speak....

[badgerwarhawk]

Back to FT shooting...

It's always said that FT shooting is mental, not physical, and it's true too... why else would crowds try to distract the shooter if it was just physical?

Point has been the best FT shooting team in the country in the not too distant past and they have some tremendous FT shooters.  The guy that's struggled the most this year is Scottie Hoelzel... and he's gotten to the line a fair amount due to his relentlessness around the basket.  Unfortunately , it's  become a bit of a liability  especially late  in games .  I know  Sem would love to be able to play Scott  at the end of games, especially for his defense and rebounding .  But I think Scott thinks he's goiung to miss when he gets up there.  I don't  think it's  a conscious  thing... actually, I think he'd  tell you he does feel he'll make it... but subconsciously, he thinks he'll miss.  Perhaps the mental aspect is more important but you can't discount the physical aspect of it as well.

I can comiserate with him... I used to be the same way, but I turned myself from a bad FT shooter with no confidence  into a decent one with a bit more confidence.  I think anyone (who is playing at this level can do it... but I don't think enough emphasis is put on visualizing yourself doing the action correctly.  That will teach your mind to see the ball going through the hoop and not missing.

I think there's a real disconnect from watching a professional or a good D-I player with great form do something and doing it yourself.  so often teams watch film of the things that went wrong and that becomes the train of thought.  This needs to be replaced with focused thoughts or viewing of you doing it correctly.

That may seem a little weird, but I turned myself from a 40% FT shooter into a 75% shooter.  

I wouldn't argue that there isn't a mental aspect to free throw shooting and confidence is important.  But there is also a significant physical aspect to it as well.  If none of it was physical why do teams generally tend to practice free throws at the end of a practice after they've been running and their legs are tired?  A lot of free throws are missed because a player's legs aren't there.  And why do players improve with repetition?  Successful free throw shooting is a combination of mental concentration and confidence as well as physical fitness and the ability to overcome fatigue.  

[John Gleich]

Back to FT shooting...

It's always said that FT shooting is mental, not physical, and it's true too... why else would crowds try to distract the shooter if it was just physical?

Point has been the best FT shooting team in the country in the not too distant past and they have some tremendous FT shooters.  The guy that's struggled the most this year is Scottie Hoelzel... and he's gotten to the line a fair amount due to his relentlessness around the basket.  Unfortunately , it's  become a bit of a liability  especially late  in games .  I know  Sem would love to be able to play Scott  at the end of games, especially for his defense and rebounding .  But I think Scott thinks he's goiung to miss when he gets up there.  I don't  think it's  a conscious  thing... actually, I think he'd  tell you he does feel he'll make it... but subconsciously, he thinks he'll miss.  Perhaps the mental aspect is more important but you can't discount the physical aspect of it as well.

I can comiserate with him... I used to be the same way, but I turned myself from a bad FT shooter with no confidence  into a decent one with a bit more confidence.  I think anyone (who is playing at this level can do it... but I don't think enough emphasis is put on visualizing yourself doing the action correctly.  That will teach your mind to see the ball going through the hoop and not missing.

I think there's a real disconnect from watching a professional or a good D-I player with great form do something and doing it yourself.  so often teams watch film of the things that went wrong and that becomes the train of thought.  This needs to be replaced with focused thoughts or viewing of you doing it correctly.

That may seem a little weird, but I turned myself from a 40% FT shooter into a 75% shooter.  

I wouldn't argue that there isn't a mental aspect to free throw shooting and confidence is important.  But there is also a significant physical aspect to it as well.  If none of it was physical why do teams generally tend to practice free throws at the end of a practice after they've been running and their legs are tired?  A lot of free throws are missed because a player's legs aren't there.  And why do players improve with repetition?  Successful free throw shooting is a combination of mental concentration and confidence as well as physical fitness and the ability to overcome fatigue.  

There is a physical aspect... but there is as much mental fatigue as physical fatigue at the end of practice.  Don't believe me?  Try to go run a 5k and then take a math test or something like that (or whatever the equivalent would be for guys like us who aren't in college... that was the only thing that came in my head!).  You're going to have trouble with it because of your mental fatigue.  If you've got the mental wherewithal to compose yourself and think about giving yourself enough legs, then you'll likely make the free throw instead of missing it, regardless of if they were tired or not.  And if they were that fatigued, then how would they have the legs for the 3 point game winner?

[bgbacker]

I agree that there is a fine line between "punk" and "warrior." It reminds me of how much I hated Pete Rose until he came to my Phillies and helped them win their first World Series.

I think Jason Larson falls in that same category. I'm sure other teams viewed him as a punk, but I know I would love to go into the "WIAC Wars" (or the Gus Macker Wars) with five Jason Larsons any day.

As a side note, it's interesting to see how much he enjoys helping younger players these days ... and what a great job he's doing with them.

[bulk19]

A little bit off the punk/warrior/jerk/trash talking subject, but somewhat related:

I'm reading a new bio of Dr. J, who is elegantly described as "as a showman, but never a showboat."

To bring this discussion full circle in a way - with TV highlights running 24 hours and You Tube, etc., today's attention-hungry professional players celebrate way too much for this old schooler. It's sickening to see players = especially NFLers, who gesticulate after every play = with their choreographed poses and posing... 

Sure, sometimes it's a natural reaction, spontaneous and fires people and teammates up. But on every play? Puleeze.

Maybe if the youngsters who are out there practicing their highlight dunks worked on their free throw shooting more often instead...