MBB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[Pioneer Hoops Fan]

On the transfer discussion, I'm a bit on the fence, but certainly leaning more towards one side when it comes down to it.  Either way, it is up to the coaching staff to recognize if that particular student athlete is going to be a good fit in their system coming in.  I say I'm on the fence because each sided definitely has it's pros and cons, but in all honesty I would rather have High School Seniors coming in rather than a JUCO transfer.  I say this, because during my playing days we had transfers come in, and really not pan out at all.  It was always the kids that were recruited out of high school that got the playing time.  There are a few exceptions, ala Mike Burkholder who played in every game off the bench, and Clay Dean who got minutes after transfering from Superior.  I love those guys, but neither of them were difference makers in sense of stats, but certainly were on the scout team.

Both of those guys transfered from within the conference though, so they really were not recruited at all by our staff(s).  I really think it works for certain coaches and programs, Platteville just happens to be one where it doesn't.  Superior used to be conference King when it came to getting JUCO players, mainly because that is where there previous coach came from, that is what he knew and liked.  Whitewater has the Milwaukee connection, so they recruit there, when those kids take their D1 or D2 scholarships and then realize it isn't for them, come back to Whitewater.  So far, since I've been in Platteville playing and living, it just hasn't worked.  It worked a few times for Bo Ryan, Blake Knutson is a perfect example.  Recruited by Bo, went D2, then came back to Bo.  He even talks about that approach in his book.

It has be a culture shock for the transfer student.  My senior season I felt like a transfer.  We had a coaching staff change to Coach Combs.  I had played in the swing system from a freshman in high school through the first four years of college.  Coach Combs came in and changed what I had known up to that point as basketball.  It took some time for us to grasp it.  Luckily most of the guys playing either were upperclassmen who could make system adjustment because we had been playing together for 2-3 years, or Freshmen who really didn't know better.  It was crazy that season, but we made it through alright I'd say.  Finished fourth that year and lost to Point in the conference tourney championship game, and the next season they followed up by getting a regular season conference championship.

With that said, I'm really looking forward to tonights matchup of UWP and UWEC.  Last team to beat UWP.  Guys used the final newspaper articles from that game in the offseason as motivation coming into the season.

[Pioneer Hoops Fan]

Also forgot to mention that I didn't make it to the game, but watched the last two minutes of it online.  There was a really nice crowd at the Superior/Platteville game on Saturday.  As soon as I brought up the stream, I said to my wife "Wow, nice crowd"

Listed attendance was 1203.  Hopefully that will keep up for them up there.

[phoenix_rising]

I think my point was that you can't count on recruiting junior college players to be the answer to a sagging team. There are many factors that play into it, not the least of which is the attitude the team has for incoming juco players. Imagine thinking you're working your way into the starting lineup as a junior and having some hotshot junior transfer in ahead of you. Having said that, the burden is on the coach to find the right players to fit the team he or she has and to make the transition as smooth as possible.

[John Gleich]

I think my point was that you can't count on recruiting junior college players to be the answer to a sagging team. There are many factors that play into it, not the least of which is the attitude the team has for incoming juco players. Imagine thinking you're working your way into the starting lineup as a junior and having some hotshot junior transfer in ahead of you. Having said that, the burden is on the coach to find the right players to fit the team he or she has and to make the transition as smooth as possible.

... But to be true, you cannot count on high school kids to be the answer either.  They have the possibility to flop just the same as a transfer... though having four years to mold a player gives a higher likelihood of creating the player that the program needs.

Certainly, the number of kids entering a program as freshmen and the number who last through to their senior years is not equal. 

I think that this last statement is the key... the coach needs to make sure that the player is right.  It really doesn't matter if it is a freshman or a transfer, though certainly, a freshman is more moldable, if you will.

[Just Bill]

The extreme JUCO team is Sacarmento State. They have 16 players on their roster and exactly ZERO of them came directly from high school. They have 15 Junior College transfers and 1 player who attended a Prep School following high school.

http://www.hornetsports.com/sports/mbball/rosters/index.asp

[Isaiah51]

JUCO Transfers:

Historically if you look at the Great teams in the WIAC, (Point & Platteville) they didn't have any JUCO transfers that I can remember.  Many of those players played 4 years together (Or 5 years, when Redshirts were allowed).  Example: Kalsow, Maus, Releford.   It seems hard to build a good program when the roster changes almost every year. 

Another point is that JUCO transfers usually dont have any affiliation to the program after their playing days are over.  It's the Kids that go to a school for 4 years and play in a program for 4 years that usually end up being Loyal Alumni.

[Pioneer Hoops Fan]

Another point is that JUCO transfers usually dont have any affiliation to the program after their playing days are over.  It's the Kids that go to a school for 4 years and play in a program for 4 years that usually end up being Loyal Alumni.

I agree for the most part.  But there certainly are exceptions to the rule

There were only three guys that transfered here that were actual JUCO guys, and two of them quit within the season.  The other one finished here.  He and I were the only seniors in 03-04.  We had plenty of other guys that transfered in from other schools, and a couple from within the conference in the guys that I mentioned before.  Really only two out of all of them I can remember coming in, seems to me anyway, still has sense of pride and loyalty to Pioneer Basketball.  They both come back for Alumni Day festivities.

For those UWP alumni out there, that is Jan. 31st this season.  Platteville will be taking on River Falls shortly after the alumni game concludes. 

[badgerwarhawk]

The extreme JUCO team is Sacarmento State. They have 16 players on their roster and exactly ZERO of them came directly from high school. They have 15 Junior College transfers and 1 player who attended a Prep School following high school.

http://www.hornetsports.com/sports/mbball/rosters/index.asp

The Idaho State team that played WISCONSIN is another program loaded with JuCo transfers.  Seven of the fifteen players listed on their roster are JuCo transfers.  Their coach, Joe O'Brien,  won three JuCo national championships in 13 years of coaching two different JuCo programs.   

[Assassin14]

Idaho State, I believe thats where one of stouts players from last year went to (1 of his 3 or 4 schools).  Very good player, hard to believe he couldn't find a true home! 

RF hasn't had great success with JUCO guys in the last few years, best one I can think of is Courtney Davis from 06-08, but then again RF hasn't really relied on these players either. 

Very competitive game tonight between RF and Stout.  RF was very resilient and played a pretty good 2nd half en route to their 2nd conference victory.  Hopefully RF keeps it up, Plattevile on sat will be a true test for this falcon team.

[uww4ever]

Which Idaho State kid went to Stout? I watched that whole game (and wished I had beer in the house watching it, it was that exciting)....

[fredfalcon]

Could not attend Falcon/BD game, but a quick perusal of the stats, especially the turnovers (Stout w/25, RF w/10) leads me to think that Stout played one of their poorest games. They certainly have not had higher than 25 turnovers in previous games. And only 10 for RF suggests that if Stout is still employing the full court press as much as in previous years, those numbers demonstrate pretty good ball control on the part of RF.

Stout came into the game leading the league in steals (all five starters in the top 15), but only able to get 3 steals vs. RF. What's up with that, stoutguy?

[Assassin14]

I believe it was Miles Webb, he may have went to Idaho and not Idaho State, but Im bout positive Idaho State was one of his stops along with Minnesota, MCTC, and Stout.  He was an excellent guard for the devils!!

[Stout survivor]

I think he went to Minnesota, North Dakota School of Science (or something like that) a JUCO, Idaho then Stout. He had a lot of connections to stout which is what lead him there for his last season.  There are players who are recruited by WIAC schools but take a scholorship instead only to transfer after a year or two.

[UWRF]

Could not attend Falcon/BD game, but a quick perusal of the stats, especially the turnovers (Stout w/25, RF w/10) leads me to think that Stout played one of their poorest games. They certainly have not had higher than 25 turnovers in previous games. And only 10 for RF suggests that if Stout is still employing the full court press as much as in previous years, those numbers demonstrate pretty good ball control on the part of RF.

Stout came into the game leading the league in steals (all five starters in the top 15), but only able to get 3 steals vs. RF. What's up with that, stoutguy?

If RF wouldn't have shot the ball so poorly in the first half they would have won by about 25.

Stout got called for a few too many travels. 

Stout was shooting it anytime they got their hands on it.

Game story: http://www.uwrf.edu/sports/bbmen.story.php

[chmarx]

To continue beating the transfer dead horse....

It can be a way to get a player who is marginal between D3 and a higher division.  A guy who goes to a bigger school and finds he doesn't fit in on campus, or isn't good enough to play for them.