MBB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[John Gleich]

A repost of mine with some additional comments from the CCIW board...

Excited to see the Red Men in action for my first time this year tomorrow night against Wisconsin-Whitewater.  Hopefully some fans turnout and not all the students leave tomorrow for Thanksgiving break.  Carthage has off all of next week, but maybe some diehards will stick around and support Carthage against 2 solid WIAC teams over the weekend.

Despite what the preseason rankings say, there are a lot of questions in the WIAC this year.  Last year the conference was loaded with top-notch seniors, many of whom had played extensive minutes for 3-4 years (for example, in 07-08, there were only 5 seniors in the 20 man all-conference and honorable mention AC teams... last year 11/20 were seniors, which is the highest ratio in eight years).  Of the NCAA qualifying teams (Stevens Point, Whitewater, and Platteville), all three lost 3 starters and at least 4 letter winners (UWP lost 4, WW 5, and Point 6) and they have these following percentages of points/rebs/assists returning (these may be a little lower, I didn't recalculate once the rosters were finally posted): WW- 28%   29%   33%, Platteville - 55%   46%   38%, Point - Point       52%   50%   42%.  This needs to be contrasted with teams like River Falls (92%) and La Crosse (85%).

Now, the wells aren't completely dry... Point has 2 seniors and 5 juniors, Platteville has 5 seniors and 4 juniors, WW has 3 seniors and 7 juniors.  So those guys have been part of the programs and have been "waiting in the wings" but they don't have a ton of experience.  It is for guys like these that a JV program would be great, but JV programs in the WIAC are very limited (I know Platteville plays some JV games, but that's all I know of).  But I digress.

Those guys that don't have a lot of experience are going to have a game-speed learning curve.  They also will be playing with guys they haven't necessarily practiced with for the past few years and they'll likely be going against guys with more game experience.

All of that is to say that we're going to find out a lot about the perenial top dogs in the WIAC this weekend.  #10 Point (picked #1 in the WIAC and reining conference champ) plays against #16 Whitworth (picked first in the NWC, won the conf tourney last year) and #18 Puget Sound (picked second and reining conference champ) in Tacoma, and #17 Platteville (picked 4th in the WIAC) and #14 Whitewater (picked second in the WIAC) play against ORV Carthage.  #24 Oshkosh (who was picked 3rd in the league) has already lost this week to St. Norbert, who was picked first in the MWC.

I have to be honest... I still am surprized with Whitewater's ranking and slot in the WIAC.  I think it's a testament to Coach Miller, who can flat out coach, but it's a snub to La Crosse and River Falls who return so much.  Oshkosh is a huge head-scratcher too.  They return the conference co-POY and 50% of their scoring, rebounds and assists, but DJ Marsh accounted for almost exactly half of the returning points and rebounds and 1/3 of the returning assists.  He's good, but unless he's going to score 60 per game, he'll need help... and lots of it.  He scored 17 points the other night on something like 4/16 shooting and no one else scored in double figures.  I mean, this team, had 11 losses last year and lost two all-conference players.  Coach Van Dellen was pulling out his hair LAST year because they didn't have enough weapons and basically threw the guys who weren't his 3 stars under the bus to the media.  I can't imagine what will happen this year.

I think Point is going to be good again this year.  They looked like they played well against a good St. John's team last Sunday, but we'll see what happens against a couple of NWC teams that like to run and gun.  This Point team isn't as big as the National Championship teams that destroyed Puget Sound in back-to-back years in the Sweet 16 and are much more guard oriented with a greater reliance on the 3 pointer.  Scotty Hoelzl is back this year which will help to give them a bit of size on the inside and Jared Jenkins should help with the inside depth too (He should be with the team this weekend in Tacoma from reports I've heard).

But La Crosse has already beaten Winona State, who's ranked, yet again, in D-II, in an exhibition game.  They're already 2-0 with a couple of solid wins and Statton and Mane look like they're in mid-season form.  They've pretty much got everybody back.  And River Falls does too... and just destroyed Viterbo.  I'm just not quite sure the preseason poll is all that accurate this year!

[UWRF]

PS, Finally someone who makes some sense!!!

River Falls and La Crosse have gotten ZERO respect in the off-season. I think that the WIAC is up for grabs.

LAX win over Winona St. has seemed to basically go unnoticed. We are talking about a program that basically dominated Div II ball for three years.

I think LAX is on pace for a boom or bust season.

I will be surprised if Oshkosh finishes in the top-4. If that happens Marsh will have to be the NCAA POY.

I agree with you that Point might be the team to beat.  Im not very high on Platt or WW either.  Granted it seems every post from a Warhawk supporter is bragging up a new recruit. (No offense to anyone, im just saying). I mean obviously they are going to be talented and I havent seen them play yet. Im not arguing that point.

Ill go out on a limp and name my top eight teams... Im leaving out RF for obvious bias reasons.    I dont think I can objectively place them.

1. Point
2. La Crosse
3. Platteville
4. Whitewater
5. Oshkosh
6. Superior
7. Eau Claire
8. Stout

[John Gleich]

Did Manor end up enrolling at RF?  And if so, is he playing/when is he eligible?

[UWRF]

Shane Manor will be eligible for the 2010-2011 season. 

[Just Bill]

Is it just my computer or is the "Today's Games" section on the front page of D3Hoops.com not there?  I always counted on that to find live stats and audio/video links.  I know Pat is busy with football, but I hope he brings it back.

[John Gleich]

Shane Manor will be eligible for the 2010-2011 season. 

Does that mean he's able to be on the team and practice, just can't play in games?  And what year will he be in terms of eligibility?

Is it just my computer or is the "Today's Games" section on the front page of D3Hoops.com not there?  I always counted on that to find live stats and audio/video links.  I know Pat is busy with football, but I hope he brings it back.

I had trouble accessing the scoreboard a little while ago, though I can access it now.  They might be linked somehow.  I dunno, I'd PM Pat.

[Pioneer Hoops Fan]

Shane Manor will be eligible for the 2010-2011 season. 

Does that mean he's able to be on the team and practice, just can't play in games?  And what year will he be in terms of eligibility?

I would have to imagine that he can practice and still have his remaining eligibility.  It is a conference rule he has to sit, but NCAA still says you can have 10 semesters to complete 8 sememsters of competition.  It is a little different than the Gray Shirting issue.  Of course, this is all IMHO and at no point do I mean this to be an official posting of the rules.

[John Gleich]

In regards to my post a few weeks ago about the number of seniors on each of the respective teams and what that might mean for their eventual outcome...

Here's the number of seniors on each team (listed by place in preseason poll).  The second number is juniors plus seniors)

Point - 2 (7)
WW - 3 (10)
Osh - 4 (6)
Plt - 5 (9)
LaX - 5 (8 )
RF - 3 (8 )
Sup - (7)
EC - 5 (7)
UWSt - 4 (9)

Maybe I spoke too soon on WW.  They've got the most upperclassmen in the league, even if it isn't in just seniors.  I dunno... but a number of those juniors are transfer guys, so that can be hit and miss.

You do have to remember, of course, that there are just 5 guys on the court at once, so having 15 seniors can only help in practice and for those guys coming off the bench.  And it's all relative, of course... underclassmen can certainly be better than seniors.  But it's one barometer on how mature (read as "good") a team might be.


(edit to get rid of Mr. Cool)

[Greek Tragedy]

I wouldnt sell whitewater short.  They lose a lot of talent but after reading the write-ups posted earlier, they have a ton of new talent.  Miller seems to get those guys who jump around, but they sound very talented.  May take them a little bit to mesh.

[Greek Tragedy]

I wouldnt be surprised if they lose tomorrow to Carthage bec7se it may take a week or two to jell.  But they sound pretty good.  No idea how Oshkosh got so much love.  La Crosse is a sleeper.  Mane & Stratton are money.

[Gregory Sager]

Shane Manor will be eligible for the 2010-2011 season. 

Does that mean he's able to be on the team and practice, just can't play in games?

You can't do that if you're ineligible, because practicing with the team uses up eligibility.

I wouldnt be surprised if they lose tomorrow to Carthage bec7se it may take a week or two to jell.

Keep in mind, though, that Carthage starts freshmen at the PF and C spots, and it appears that Bosko Djurickovic's choice to be the sixth man is a freshman as well. Those three guys only have one game under their belts as college basketball players.

[John Gleich]

Shane Manor will be eligible for the 2010-2011 season. 

Does that mean he's able to be on the team and practice, just can't play in games?

You can't do that if you're ineligible, because practicing with the team uses up eligibility.

Therein lies the real question.  Manor was a Sophomore last year.  If he intends to play one more year at UWRF, then he might as well practice with the team and use up that year of eligibility.  If he's planning on coming back as a Junior, then he'd want to sit out... in theory, he could have redshirted in the past and thus still been able to practice with the team and not play in the games.  I'm sure that Mr. Manor and the RF program have it all under control... but it lends itself to some interesting conversation.  He was one of the bright spots on Superior's team last year (at times... he faded a bit towards the end I think).  This year's RF team has 3 seniors... but only two of them played in the last game, and none of them start.  Next year may be the real year for RF!

[magicman]

Oshkosh on top of Lawrence 32-25 at the half.

[Greek Tragedy]

I wonder who is beating who...DJ Marsh or Dekker.  They seem to be the main, if not only, scoring threats for their respective teams! lol :-/

[magicman]

UW-Oshkosh moves to 1-1 on the year with a 66-55 win over Lawrence.