MBB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[voice]

BadgerWarhawk,

River Falls was one of those teams that just "matched up" with WW better than some other conference teams did.They did the same at RF where Whitewater was taken into overtime before winning.   I know Coach Miller talked about it on both his pre and post-game radio interviews.  It was a heck of an effort by RF only to lose.

[voice]

I thought Oshkosh did look tired, especially in the second half, in their loss earlier in the week at Whitewater.

And OS, don't say head-to-head about Goodwin in the wake of him taking a vicious hit diving for a ball going out of bounds against Oshkosh on Wednesday.  Goodwin and King did their best to fuse their heads together as they were both diving for the loose ball.  OUCH!

[mab]

OS - I agree 100% on everything you said about Marsh.  Defenses are definitely keying on him more now than they did early in the season, and TVD does seem to be focusing more on posting up DSA.  You'll notice in last night's box score that both those guys had four assists, many of which were to each other cutting in from the weak side when extra defenders went to the strong side.  That's something I would like to see them look for again on Monday, although TVD encourages his players to shoot when they get the ball in the lane.  Here are two other possible reasons for Marsh taking less shots lately.  First, his three point shooting has cooled off as the season has gone on.  When he makes threes, along with his ability to go to the hoop and score, he is much tougher to defend.  Second, I heard TVD say Marsh hurt his back in practice the day before the La Crosse game, I think it was.  It doesn't look like there is anything wrong with him, but that might be a factor.

I also agree that Matt Goodwin should be the player of the year the way he lead Whitewater down the stretch to a hard fought conference title.  A lot of times D1 transfers don't adjust well their first year in D3.  I thought he hurt his team in their game at UWO early in the year by chucking up some ill advised shots, just because of an itchy trigger finger.  It looks like he quickly got over that to do what is best for the team.  Give him and his coaches credit.  I would also vote for Pat Miller for coach of the year.  Dave Buchanan will get a lot of deserved support.  He definitely has something special started at Superior.  Smith and Hill are potential All-Americans with Manor and Culy fine players as well.  If they get a few more players like that Buchanan will get a coach of the year, along with a conference title, in the next few years.

[OshDude]

I did have a fairly long post regarding the DJ Marsh posts, but somehow it got lost.  Anyway, my point was that maybe it's not TVD holding him back, but the defenses that play against him that are holding him to 8 shots a game or so over the last four or five games.  I would probably also give credit to Marsh himself.  Maybe he's recognizing mismatches and going with that, throwing it into DSA or JJ and they are converting, using Marsh as more of a decoy.  All because he isn't putting up 12-15 shots doesn't mean he isn't doing his job! 

Oshkosh has lost their last two, does that mean they are getting tired?  I don't think so.  Strictly going by stats, Marsh isn't showing that he's the best player in the league the last 4-6 games.  That would probably go to Goodwin or Skemp and if you take the last head to head matchup, Goodwin has the advantage.

You can argue that DJ isn't the WIAC's best right now, and I would definitely agree with that. No way he is the 2008 POY, if that's the debate. DSA may have passed him up for that honor on his own team. But in my Oshkosh-tinted thinking, I do think he is the best player in the league, results notwithstanding.

What I will argue is that DJ needs more than eight shots for Oshkosh to beat good teams. When he creates – even if he misses and doesn't draw a foul – UWO is much tougher to defend and tougher to beat. Six or eight shots from DJ is enough to beat River Falls or Stout. But eight attempts from the field and none from the line, like last game, is not DJ and is not UWO this year.

We've probably all seen DJ take over a game, and the results were usually good for UWO. If he has a balky back, I credit him for toughing it out. If DJ's OK physically and he gets eight from the floor and zero from the line, Whitewater will crush UWO. WW may beat UWO even if DJ goes off, but I think he will decide how close UWO comes.

I know some people may disagree. I'd be very happy to be wrong and eat these words.

EDIT #1: I guess TVD and I are on the same page. From today's local newspaper:
"Offensively, I don't know what (Marsh's) deal is," Van Dellen said. "He has not done well in the last two or three ball games. I don't know if he is not getting enough touches or what the situation is, but he needs to find ways to get himself the ball and assert himself."

EDIT #2: And a response to DSA being the intended focus of "the new Titans":
"We had to go to Dane, he was the only guy who was doing anything," Van Dellen said. "He had his share in the loss by going to the free throw line and missing. Everybody took their turn in the (loss). There wasn't anybody I thought who played exceptionally well on either end of the court tonight."

[OshDude]

Ever wonder how TVD feels about the WIAC tournament and the NCAA selection process?

http://www.thenorthwestern.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080224/OSH07/802240583/1148

[badgerwarhawk]

When the coaches select the All Conference team the top three vote getters are candidates for the POY.  Then they vote a second time and top vote getter is the POY.   They will be the first three players listed when the All Conference team is announced. 

Here's my guess:  Skemp, Goodwin, Beyer (no specific order).   All of them are excellent players and it's possible Beyer's status as a senior could push him over the top. 

Not that I wouldn't mind seeing DJ Marsh at WW.  He's pretty good too.      

[BDshotblocker]

The Oshkosh game was a tail of two halves:

First half Oshkosh controlled the game.  Good shots, great offensive rebounding with easy putbacks, and it looked defensively they understood Superior's offense and took away easy shots.  

But in the second half, Superior came out firing on all cylinders. You could see the their comfort and execution on offense.  Hill was very good, they rebounded and shot the ball with confidence.

Marsh picked up two fouls with about 1:30 to go.   I understand that Oshkosh had to foul but why keep Marsh in if he's your best player and you still have a chance to win??  Odd coaching decision in my mind

[cubs]

Oldschool, I don't know what's going on with Oshkosh. Their is no rhyme or reason to lose to Superior, when they were up by 8 at half.

Something is wrong with this team. I don't know what it is, nor do I know where to begin.

I know it's almost improbable to beat teams twice in a season, especially in twice in three day span, but I would not put it passed Superior to come back to Oshkosh and pull off another major upset.

It's hard to have confidence in a team that just simply cannot beat a team with a winning record, nor hold an eight point lead at half against a team that is mainly freshmen and sophomores.

So Superior doesn't get any credit for shooting 64% from the field, including 86% (6-7) from the three point line?  Sure, some of it has to do with poor defense from UWO, however Superior still has to hit open shots, and they did that well. 

I will say this.....  If Superior shoots over 50% from the 3-point line again on Monday, they will likely beat UWO again.  My guess is however, Superior will not shoot that well again.

[Mr. Downtown]

So if Superior is 1 for 2 on monday from the 3 point line, they are going to beat Oshkosh?

[Mr. Downtown]

 Oshkosh started the year 7-0. They are now 10-8 in the last 18 games.

[OshDude]

So if Superior is 1 for 2 on monday from the 3 point line, they are going to beat Oshkosh?

Have you and Cubs been married for 20 years and kept that info from us?

[cubs]

So if Superior is 1 for 2 on monday from the 3 point line, they are going to beat Oshkosh?

Nope....  For the math challenged, that would be 50% and if you re-read my post you will note I said "over 50%."

Anyway, Superior hasn't attempted less than 10 three point attempts in any WIAC game this season, and average nearly 18 three point attempts per WIAC contest.

[fredfalcon]

BW--By the looks of it, Wright did have a career game. Congrats to him. He's been averaging ten per game. He also leads the team in turnovers, which makes me question the assessment of his ball handling.

I'm puzzled about the "matchup" argument. There must be something to it, though, because we played WW MUCH tougher than we played Point. It's hard to judge a team on one or two looks, but when I saw Point vs. RF at RF I thought we looked like we should not even be in the same league. And it was worse at Point. Based on that one game, I did not think one of our starters could have started for Point. But that's probably not an accurate judgement.

On the other hand, I was very unimpressed with Platteville--based on one look at RF--but look how they handled Point. So, again, one or two looks is  not enough.

Generally, RF played at the level they ended up. The Stout/RF game at RF really looked like a game between tailenders.

Willie W. has been inconsistent, as have many of our players. Kelly, a starter, got blanked at WW, but maybe he was sick. Against Stout Wright was pretty much a non-factor. And so it goes, in WIAC basketball.

[badgerwarhawk]

Kelly had foul problems that limited his minutes though if he was sick that could have played into it as well.  He only took three shots.  Wright had 4 assists without a turnover. 

Like you say Fred it's tough when you only see a player once or twice but he was quick, strong and he was able to penetrate and dish.  For a while he was dominating play.  If that's what he can do on a good day he'll be a great player if he does it consistantly. 

As I was just looking at the boxscore I noticed Kevin Koski had 8 assists and only a single turnover.   I think it's safe to say that his season has taken some fans, myself included, by surprise.  Fortunately it's a pleasant one.   His efforts often go unnoticed because he doesn't score but they're every bit as significant as any others to the success of the regular season.   

[janesvillebb]

Kelly had foul problems that limited his minutes though if he was sick that could have played into it as well.  He only took three shots.  Wright had 4 assists without a turnover. 

Like you say Fred it's tough when you only see a player once or twice but he was quick, strong and he was able to penetrate and dish.  For a while he was dominating play.  If that's what he can do on a good day he'll be a great player if he does it consistantly. 

As I was just looking at the boxscore I noticed Kevin Koski had 8 assists and only a single turnover.   I think it's safe to say that his season has taken some fans, myself included, by surprise.  Fortunately it's a pleasant one.   His efforts often go unnoticed because he doesn't score but they're every bit as significant as any others to the success of the regular season.   

I agree, Wright was dominate. I felt better when he was not on the floor.
Regarding Koski you are absolutely correct. His conference assists stats below:

ASSISTS
## Player-Team               Cl  G Assists  Avg/G
-------------------------------------------------
1.Koski, Kevin-WW.......... SO 16      75   4.69
2.Hill, Dwight-SUP......... SO 16      71   4.44
3.Lohoff, Charlie-PLT...... JR 16      56   3.50
4.Beamish, Bryan-STP....... JR 16      54   3.38
5.Shea, Ryan-EC............ FR 16      53   3.31



ASSIST/TURNOVER RATIO (Min. 3.0 assists/game)
## Player-Team               Cl  G Asst   Avg Turn   Avg  Ratio
---------------------------------------------------------------
1.Koski, Kevin-WW.......... SO 16   75   4.7   27   1.7   2.78
2.Beamish, Bryan-STP....... JR 16   54   3.4   30   1.9   1.80
3.Lohoff, Charlie-PLT...... JR 16   56   3.5   34   2.1   1.65
4.Hill, Dwight-SUP......... SO 16   71   4.4   48   3.0   1.48
5.Shea, Ryan-EC............ FR 16   53   3.3   41   2.6   1.29