Empire 8

[bamm]

Good luck trying to make an argument for either league in the eternal battle for "Who's better, the E8 or SUNYAC?"

At this point this is what I gather:

SOLID
Potsdam
Fisher
Oswego

LOOKING GOOD
Utica
RIT
Cortland

MAYBE
Alfred
Naz
Buff State

And this early in the season this is subject to change rapidly.

[ricco1]

Bamm, I think you did a good job picking the better teams. I think Fisher may have the edge because of the return of Bennett and Auman. Two really good players.

[thebear]

This is a strange year because of real or imagined second half additions that will significantly change teams for the better:

Brockport
Rother
Harris?
WIlliams?

Alfred
Bryant

New Paltz
Foluke-Henderson?

Plattsburgh
Simmons?

Fisher
Bennett

This list of additions is significant as it stands, any other second half additions anyone knows about?

Some of these teams will experience enough 1st half L's that the conference tournament will be the only way they make the dance, but they also have to potential to spoil at large bids for good teams with gaudy records that didn't win the conference (e.g. Oswego last year, which was clearly a bubble team, and undoubtedly would have made a 59 team field)

All of the solid teams you mentioned have some first rate players:

Oswego:

Perioli, Mims, Burridge

Potsdam:

Barton, Ducena, Bisesi

Fisher

O'Brien, Bennett, Auman


I haven't seen anything yet that wouldn't put Cortland in that top group, and everyone seems to be forgetting Liberty League squads Union, which has a solid club with a solid coach, and Hamilton, which is arguably loaded with talent.

We'll see how it plays out.

[gobombers15]

I saw Hartwick scrimmage SUNY IT and as a local Utica guy who has seen alot of games over the past 20 years they really aren't too bad. I would be surprised if they didn't win atleast 5 or 6 league games this year.
Now I don't think they are going to be like that maniac RTH but I do think they will win some games. They essentially played SUNYIT to a standoff.

i would say your league is the weakest of the big 3 (LL, E8, SUNY).

First of all, calling the LL/E8/SUNYAC the "big 3" would be like a D1 fan calling the WAC, Mountain West and the West Coast Conference the "big 3." Sure, there may be a stud team or two in those conferences but come tourney time they'll get stepped on. Let's just get that settled up front.

Secondly, if Hartwick wins 6 conference games I'll never post again on Post Patterns. Book it. If they get that sixth conference win, I'll sign off forever. Pat Coleman can block me from the site. I don't care what it takes, I would never post again.

Fortunately, there's a better chance of Oneonta making the "50 best cities to live" than Hartwick taking six conference games, so there won't be too much sleep lost on that one.

Clearconceit, correct me if I'm wrong but you saw Ithaca on the road this year. Ithaca turns in stinkers about 75% of the time when they play away from South Hill. They're the prototypical average team...tough at home, lousy on the road.

In other news, Hartwick's first 9 conference games:

vs Alfred(return of Quentin Bryant)
vs Fisher (return of Nick Bennett...well, his 2nd game back)
vs Utica  (no chance, Hawks)
vs Ithaca (10 point win for the Bombers)
vs Elmira (Wick's first/last/only chance at a conference win)
at RIT    (GB15 has a better shot at bedding Hedi Klum than Hartwick does to win this game)
at Naz  (seeing as how they took Oswego to the brink...I say Naz by about 50)
at Fisher (bring out the bodybags)
at Alfred (Saxons too good at home...rout!)

At best, Hartwick goes 1-8 in that span. No way they win 6 conference games.

[ricco1]

I think thebear is right.The cortland team seems to be really  good.They beat some good teams. I would love to see another matchup between a suny school and E8 in the ncaa's.Think Fisher might take this one especially with their additions this year.

[gobombers15]

I think thebear is right.The cortland team seems to be really good.They beat some good teams. I would love to see another matchup between a suny school and E8 in the ncaa's.Think Fisher might take this one especially with their additions this year.

Yes, Fisher added Auman but lost Sidney. Sidney scored so many points going to the hoop or getting to the line by screaming real loud and embellishing fouls so well. He's a great player but he was the Manu Ginobili of this league. Auman seems to have more of a perimeter game and relies more on his shooting abilities than driving or getting to the line. However, we shouldn't forget that Auman took Sidney's starting spot during Sidney's junior year and was starting over Sidney last year until he got hurt.

I'm interested to see if Sidney's departure can be offset by the return of Auman.

[ballAU]

coming as an insider in the empire 8 league i can't believe somone would be bringing up hartwick as a tourney contender. Even with a good incoming class experience means alot and coming from 5 losing seasons your in the wrong seat to praise an unproven team, I think that Alfred will be a big contender in the empire 8 and will make the tourney.

[bamm]

Fisher fans -- this is the thing about your team:  Last year, every doubter said they didn't get tough competition in the E8, that they were a finesse team, and that when faced with a big, strong squad they would fall.  When the Cards came out and laid an egg against Potsdam the doubters all got to say "I told you so." 

They have done nothing yet to change anyone's opinion.  They missed a chance to do so against Baldwin-Wallace.  They have another chance next weekend at the Randolph-Macon tourney (if they beat Lake Erie, they'll play either RM or Lincoln). 

I suspect if they lose in the RM tourney you'll see them drop out of the D3hoops Top 25, and they probably will have to put up a lot of wins before they return. 

One more thing -- RIT has big games coming up against SUNY schools.  If they win on Friday they'll probably see Oswego on Saturday night, followed by Cortland on Tuesday.  Both at home.

[Jukebox Hero]

You know what I just noticed? Someone bring Not In The Bulb back......I miss him. Unless he's the same guy as GB15? Then I apologize.

[gobombers15]

Jukebox Hero--He is I and I am Him.

[clearconceit]

You have way too much hostility pal.  I refer to these 3 leagues as the big 3 in NY State not the USA.  In the grand scheme all of our teams are feeble, none can compare to the Midwest boys.
Now I never said anything about Hartwick being great I am jsut saying having watched their scrimmage versus SUNYIT they are significantly improved from the team I saw Utica kill last season.  They have a couple of big boys.  Can they win 6 league games?  i don't know, but if IT was in the league I think they would win 6 games.  That's all I meant. 

Look don't attack everybody just becasue RTH gets under your skin.  Everyone have opinions.  I think Utica is going to win the league.  That is my opinion.  You have yours etc.  As for Hartwick, who cares.  As long as my boys win that is all  I care about.  But as a fanatical poster you may want to be careful about vowing to never post again.

My league predictions

UTICA
SJF
NAZ
HARTWICK
ALFRED
RIT
ITHACA
ELMIRA


GO U T I C A!!!!!!!!

[fisheralum91]

Clear C,
It's no problem to  root for UC!
I read about them daily in the OD!
Really though-win the e8 outright.
That is a little stretch dontcha think?
Maybe my rose colored glasses make me feel that Fisher will dominate,
but what is this years difference in UC?

[lileyes]

clearconciet,

I am a UC fan too.  I think it should be interesting to see UC and Fisher battle for the E8 title. 

[gobombers15]

You have way too much hostility pal. I refer to these 3 leagues as the big 3 in NY State not the USA. In the grand scheme all of our teams are feeble, none can compare to the Midwest boys.
Now I never said anything about Hartwick being great I am jsut saying having watched their scrimmage versus SUNYIT they are significantly improved from the team I saw Utica kill last season. They have a couple of big boys. Can they win 6 league games? i don't know, but if IT was in the league I think they would win 6 games. That's all I meant.

Look don't attack everybody just becasue RTH gets under your skin. Everyone have opinions. I think Utica is going to win the league. That is my opinion. You have yours etc. As for Hartwick, who cares. As long as my boys win that is all I care about. But as a fanatical poster you may want to be careful about vowing to never post again.

My league predictions

UTICA
SJF
NAZ
HARTWICK
ALFRED
RIT
ITHACA
ELMIRA


GO U T I C A!!!!!!!!

I'm not attacking you at all, "pal." Hostility? I harbor none except for the occasional ignorant poster or two, of which you are not one.  Like you said, everyone has their opinions so if mine differ from yours, don't take it as a personal attack. I take nothing personal that goes on in these post rooms. It's a shame that some do.

If you want to base your opinion on a scrimmage between two teams that were a combined 3-27 in their respective conferences last year, then that's ok, too. Just don't be too surprised if people disagree with you. Scrimmages are a time to work out some kinks, play different rotations to see what works, etc. I trust your opinion that Hartwick may be better this season. If people go back to my pre-season predictions on page 2 or 3, I even said "Hartwick should have improved enough to finally get out of the division cellar." That said, I still don't think they have the experience or talent to deal with the better(Utica, Fisher, RIT, Naz) or more experienced(Ithaca, Alfred) teams.

I agree with you that our league is quite inferior to the midwestern teams. I've long wondered why that's the case. People have any opinions?

[Caz Bombers]

Good question GB15, I've often wondered that myself.  My guesses would be, in no particular order:

*40 or so D3 hoops programs within the borders of New York, far more than any other state.

*More local support for D3 in the farm towns and other villages/cities out there makes the local kids actually dream about playing for Wooster or Illinois Wesleyan or UW-Take Your Pick.

*Roster turnover...seems to plague the SUNYAC and CUNYAC teams quite a bit.  Those conferences also have major budgetary issues.

Gurus of D3Hoops.com that are floating around these boards, your takes? Why is the East the Least?