Empire 8

[col]

tigerfan, do you want to go to the game tonight in Oswego?

[tigerfan2]

Probably not going to make that trip Col, gotta get ready for the big trip to Chapel Hill coming up.

[fisheralum91]

Guys,
I know that this isn't the right board- but why no love for Fisher Women's Hoop?
Not even ranked!

[superman57]

fisher sucks

So does your mom, OOOOOO,

I think that we have the case of Fisher haters, don't hate the player, hate the game

[gobombers15]

Or maybe his name is just Roy Williams. Why all the anger toward either Roy GB15? Did you make the mistake of drafting Roy in your fantasy football league? Are you a Kansas fan and just bitter?

Luckily, I only drafted Roy Williams in one of my leagues. He had two very good games, 3 average ones, and either didn't play or played awfully in the other 11. I'm not a fan of him.

No, I'm not a Kansas fan. I'm a Syracuse fan. I truly think if Kansas had almost any coach BESIDES Roy Williams, they would have beat Syracuse in the National Championship. Williams allowing Langford to stay on the floor with 11 minutes remaining and 4 fouls to guard, of all people, Carmelo Anthony, should go down as one of the worst coaching moves in big games in the history of the Final Four.

Look at some of the teams he had at Kansas that couldn't win a National Championship. Paul Pierce. Raef LaFrentz. Nick Collison. Kirk Hinrich. The list goes on of very good college players he had at his disposal and could never get it done. He had a team that was 37-1 for god sakes that lost to Rhode Island in the 2nd round. Rhode Island!

I won't go too much into what happened in last year's tournament. However, I will say if any of the following happened, UNC would not have won the national championship:

-That ref in the Villanova game had the balls to call the "and-1" that he was going to call when he blew the whistle (watch the replay and see how he starts to raise his hand and watches the ball go into the hoop only to then change course and call travelling) that would have put 'Nova up late in the game. Don't even get me started about this call. Unlike any of the Super Bowl calls and similar to the pass interference calls in the Broncos/Pats game, this call DID determine the outcome of the game. If I were a 'Nova fan I would have broke everything in the room at the time. I can't believe the utter terribleness of that call hasn't gotten more pub. This furthers my theory that people only pay attention to bad calls in huge games. If this happened in the National Championship game, people would have talked about it for two months after the game.

-Curtis Sumpter plays in that game.

-James Augustine doesn't exist. I'm certain we will find out in 10 years that he was the center of one of the biggest game-fixing scandals in the history of major intercollegiate sports. I am certain of it.

That said, congrats to UNC fans and I hope they enjoyed their national title. Yes, I do think Roy Williams is an overrated coach. Great recruiter and all, but I don't know how much it helps that he's coached at two of the most storied college basketball programs in the country. His teams always have the fatal flaw that they play little-to-no defense. Don't tell me how well he's doing this year with a young UNC team in a watered-down ACC conference that may be lucky to have two Sweet 16 teams.

I love to go on rants.

[tigerfan2]

To respond:

- Travel or no, if Felton isn't given two cheap fouls earlier in the game, they never have to go to Scott and Thomas at the point down the stretch, so bad calls effected both sides.

- Sumpter didn't play. Injuries happen. SU wouldn't have a championship if Wayne Simien played for KU in the finals, end of story. And if KU could hit FT's they would have one, but thats another story I guess.

- Yes Roy Williams had some great teams that didn't win. So did Boeheim in the 80's (Derrick Coleman, Sherman Douglas, Rony Seikaly, etc.) and he didn't get it done.

- James Augestine wouldn't have mattered, there wasn't a player in the country that could have stopped Sean May last year at the end of the season.

- Apparently Roy Williams team's play enough defense so he has the highest winning percentage among all active coaches.

[dewcrew88]

Last I checked, this was d3hoops.com

[gobombers15]

- Sumpter didn't play. Injuries happen. SU wouldn't have a championship if Wayne Simien played for KU in the finals, end of story. And if KU could hit FT's they would have one, but thats another story I guess.

- Yes Roy Williams had some great teams that didn't win. So did Boeheim in the 80's (Derrick Coleman, Sherman Douglas, Rony Seikaly, etc.) and he didn't get it done.

- Apparently Roy Williams team's play enough defense so he has the highest winning percentage among all active coaches.

Every person uses that Simien excuse and here's why I disagree. Go back to the box score of that game. Simien's replacement, Graves,  had a monster game. I don't have the numbers near me but I think he had something like 19 and 12. If Simien's playing, he (Graves) doesn't see the court. Could Simien have got those numbers? Maybe. But, remember, we're talking about a sophomore Wayne Simien when he wasn't as good as he became in his junior and senior years. Kansas lost that game because Williams was too stupid to sub out Langford right when he got that 4th foul and because Kansas missed some big FT's in the 2nd half (as did Syracuse), not because Wayne Simien didn't play. You could also say SU won because they had the best college basketball player of the last ten years and G-Mac hit eight 3-pointers as a freshman.

Second, I never said Boeheim was a great coach. I think he's very good. Even as a SU fan, I'll readily admit he's not as good as his record indicates. I'm glad to see he's finally playing some tougher pre-Big East games (9th most difficult schedule this year) but he's definitely built up his resume on cupcakes. That said, he took a program that was next to nowhere when he inherited it and turned it into a perennial power. Nobody can argue with that.

Those SU teams were full of headcases. Derrick Coleman? I don't need to say much about him. He's parallel to Rashad McCants who UNC won IN SPITE OF not because of. Rony Seikaly? Yeah, that guy cared a lot, he retired at 29 so he could go chill on an island with his wife. 63 teams have to lose, I don't always hold it against the coach.

Roy Williams is a good coach when it doesn't matter. I've always thought that. My buddy, a UNC fan, calls him the Peyton Manning of coaching. If you watched him in last year's 'Nova game, last year's Illinois game, and the year before's Texas game, he looks like he's gonna croak in tight games that matter. I'd love to have him as my coach if it was January and I was playing Georgia Tech but I wouldn't want him if I was playing UConn in March.

I could go on for hours about Roy Williams. I've had these feelings about him since junior high when I picked Kansas to win the title in three separate years and they never made it beyond the Sweet 16.

I hate Huckleberry Hound, though I will root for him when they play Duke.

Thanks for the reminder, Budcrew. Last I checked this was a chat room and there were no stringent standards for what is talked about in here. It's Wednesday, we'll talk tourney when it gets closer. That said, my predictions for the ECAC's tonight.

OSWEGO 72  Rit 66

UNION 78 Ithaca 59 (Ithaca will be down double-digits in the first 8 minutes...they're gonna come out flat. Thanks for nothing, Mullins.)

Brockport 88 SUNYIT 85

POTSDAM 72 Keuka 59.

[dewcrew88]

Thanks for the reminder, Budcrew. Last I checked this was a chat room and there were no stringent standards for what is talked about in here. It's Wednesday, we'll talk tourney when it gets closer.

Ouch. Touche.

[tigerfan2]

He still coached well enough to win.  I'd take him over just about every coach in the country, with the exception of Calhoun and maybe Izzo. I would say Coach K, but I may hate him more than anyone on the face of the earth not named Dick Vitale.

I'd like to say RIT will upset Oswego tonight, but I don't see it happening, I think they'll probably be let down from barely losing to Fisher.

I can't see Keuka winning vs. Potsdam.

I haven't seen SUNYIT or Brockport so I have nothing to add there and I've also never seen Union. But I have seen Ithaca, and based on that I say Union wins.

I'm sure Whetstone will manage to get 3 fouls in the first half and Mullins will put some horrible lineups on the floor so IC will manage to get killed on the boards like every game I've seen.

[gobombers15]

I haven't seen SUNYIT or Brockport so I have nothing to add there and I've also never seen Union. But I have seen Ithaca, and based on that I say Union wins.

I'm sure Whetstone will manage to get 3 fouls in the first half and Mullins will put some horrible lineups on the floor so IC will manage to get killed on the boards like every game I've seen.

That is what every Ithaca fan complains about. He puts really bad groups of players on the floor at important times. They aren't necessarily bad players but when combined with the other guys on the court, it just makes for a deficient combination. That's usually why Ithaca will be down like 18-17 in the first half then he throws out a lineup like Bellis, Whetstone, Bostic, Scanlon, and Kern. Besides Bellis, nobody in that group will score for you. The next thing you know, the team will have gone on a 10-2 run and the Bombers will be down double digits at half.

That, and he will ALWAYS play the other team's style. This year's team should have been a defensively-oriented team that liked to play games in the high-50's or low-60's and capitalized on Bellis' offensive abilities, as well as potent outside shooters like Burton and Joe. Instead, they play no defense, take quick ill-advised shots or rag the shot clock down to 8 seconds and Whetstone creates something...usually a turnover. And he doesn't adapt to the talent of his team. And he's a terrible in-game coach. Other than that, he's fine.

[rjcarter8]

I know Ithaca has some seniors on their squad, but I think Union will have too much for them. They have at least four starters who are seniors and all have now been involved in postseason play all four years, including a second round exit from the NCAA tournament last year when they actually had a worse overall record.

I think Union will get IC tonight, however, the final score depends on how well Union is shooting. Of course, if Ithaca shoots like Hamilton did in the Liberty League title game it won't matter.

As for the other games I think the top seeds will win: Oswego over RIT, Potsdam over Keuka and SUNYIT over Brockport.

[cuse2003champs]

Comin from a Fisher fans persepctive who would you want to win the elms/norwhich game, both teams don';t look voerally impressive to me on paper, but who do you think would be an easier mathcup for fisher, also does anyone see utica beating wpi if it coems to it. a 4th rematach would be a barn burner, also im rootin for tufts to get to the elite 8 and hopefully play fisher cuz my kid brother goes to tufts and id be an all out war, any input on ncaas i would lvoe to ehar take care everyone

[rjcarter8]

Ithaca upsets Union tonight, 86-83.

A bit of a surprise, though the Bombers shot very well tonight. They also outrebounded Union by about a 2-1 margin.

Ithaca shot 61 percent from the field, Union 55 percent.

For the Bombers, five players in double figures.
Bellis 17 points, Bostic 15, Scanlon 15, Burton 12 and Andruskiewicz with 10 points.

For Union, Scordato had 28 points and 11 assists, and Caginello had 24 points and finished his career with 2,006 points.

Congrats to IC on the win, now they move on to the ECAC semifinals, and will face Brockport, which upset SUNYIT 91-88 tonight. In other results, Potsdam beat Keuka 81-69 and Oswego edged RIT 84-81.

[gobombers15]

Very surprised by the Bombers win tonight. It looks like there was some ballgames in the ECAC's this evening. It's a good win for the E8 and RIT made a nice showing at Oswego, just coming up short.

Five guys in double figures for the Bombers. Where was this all year, guys? This is the one thing the Bombers have on Utica: they beat Union at Union and Utica didn't. I'm obviously playing, guys, calm down.