Empire 8

[Adam the Bull]

I'm interested to know who the Utica and Fisher fans would prefer seeing their team play against in the E8 Semis. I have a feeling that most Utica fans would prefer to see RIT while most Fisher fans will want to see Ithaca. Just wanna see if that's the case.

(This is assuming that Alfred doesn't make it)

Adam, you were there. What was the biggest difference between the first meeting and second meeting between IC/UC? Was Utica just way off? Was Ithaca just hitting everything? I'm interested to hear why you think this game went the other way when Utica had a 30+ pt lead on Ithaca at Ithaca earlier in the year.



Despite their loss to Ithaca I think the Pioneers would have no preference between the Bobmers and RIT. I believe when Utica is playing their best basketball which they have for many games this season, they cant be beat by any team in this league. When they struggle to score they are beatable. I think RIT and Ithaca are very even.

GoBombers...I did not attend the loss to Ithaca as I was sick (thankfully I am finally feeling better) I was getting constant updates....and from what I gather from talking to the players and some attendees...UC did a very poor job on Burton after totally shutting him down in the first meeting. Also, I think the Pioneers went into the game over confident and were starting to by into the hype about the undefeated conference season...that said, even in the win at Ithaca I could see they were a decent team and I feel the same way about RIT. I will say that as far as the center position goes....Bostic is much more dangerous to the Pioneers then Bacon. Not necessarily saying that Bostic is better...I just think UC match's up better with Bacon.

[superman57]

I think utica has shown that they are not a consistant team...they are a very very good team when they are on...but when they are not on I think they are very beatable

[gobombers15]

I think utica has shown that they are not a consistant team...they are a very very good team when they are on...but when they are not on I think they are very beatable

I assume you feel the same way about Fisher?

[superman57]

I don't think fisher's even on the same page as utica...and I also think it is very different...I think fisher is on the up rise while utica is going to be on the down because uticas stars are seniors....while fisher is playing a lot of freshman... I think fisher with give utica a fit in the e8 tourny followed by a strong run in the ecac's I think utica will be lucky to get back to the sweet 16

[bamm]

FisherDynasty,

The "it's tough to beat a team 3 times in a season" line of reasoning is crap.  All that matters is the game that is being played at the moment.  Fisher had no problem dispatching with RIT 8 times in two seasons, the "magical" third game wasn't any harder.  The same holds true for RIT's streak over Naz.

Fisher and RIT match up very well, and I think it's pretty dumb for you to suggest that because Fisher lost to RIT on Saturday they would be more likely to win the next game against the Tigers. 

If RIT could consistently make free throws the margin on Saturday would have been double digits, and they may have pulled out the win in the Chase.  I'd bet on them figuring this charity stripe problem out, too.  This is a good shooting team.

[fisheralum91]

Adam the bull,
you working for Clear Channel still?

[bamm]

Big conference games tonight.  Naz @ RIT and Alfred @ Fisher.  The Tigers need to get their first conference home win tonight.

[FisherDynasty]

Who woulda thought Alfred vs Fisher would be a big conference game, but your right bamm it is a big night in the E8. ill take RIT over Naz by 5 and Fisher over Alfred by 9-12.

[UCgrad45]

So the weekend really seems to have tossed the conference race up in the air.  At this point it seems to me that Fisher, Ithaca, Alfred and RIT are all in contention of being the odd man out of the E8 tournament at 6-3, 6-3, 5-4, 5-4 respectively.  I am too busy to amass each team's remaining schedule and try to figure out which teams have the inside track for the stretch run.  But I have a different question to pose for discussion.  Does the parity in the league help or hurt the E8's chances of getting a second team in the tournament? I can see it both ways.  On the one hand, you can see the entire league as being down on account of youth.  If you already thought that, you could see the parity as being further evidence of each team's general mediocrity.  Or, you could see the parity as proof that each of these teams are better than once expected giving an outside shot at a second NCAA participant.  Thoughts?

Probably a little bit of both. Two teams got into the NCAA tournament last year and they both fared very well. So, right off the bat, that's going to help the reputation of the league. And that may happen again if someone other than Utica wins the Empire 8 tournament. The large NCAA tournament field helps too. SUNYAC had two conference teams make the NCAAs last year too. They didn't do as well, Cortland losing in the 2nd round, Platty in the first, so that will hurt them. And since the league, aside from Brockport (good idea to transfer Jon Rother), is having a pretty poor season, expect only one bid for that league, and possibly the LL/UCAA.

On the downside, everyone's beating each other up and if that trend continues, no one's resume is going to stand out as really really good, aside from Utica. I haven't really followed much Empire 8 basketball since I've been busy covering the Big South, but non-conference wins for each team are key too. Whichever team has good non-conference wins will add to their resume.

I think the best bet though for two Empire 8 teams would be if someone not named Utica wins the conference tournament. Then that team and Utica more than likely get in. Jeez, when I first started working for D3hoops.com, I never thought I'd say Utica and playoffs for basketball in the same sentence. That program's come a long way in the last four-to-five years.

He won't take credit for it, but the success is coming from having Coach Goodemote. Even when he first started out taking over a long struggling program I could see that he is easily the best coach I have ever had the honor of being around and knowing. He cares about the guys in his program and people in general.

[gobombers15]

It'll be interesting to see if Goodemote can keep Utica as one of the top two teams in the league. I think the coming years will see a lot of parity in the league after Utica loses Bryant. In fact, aside from Utica, there seems to be a logjam between the next five teams. I even include Naz on that list because it's obvious they have great talent but they can't seem to win a close game to save their lives and have blown more 2nd half leads than we can even get into right now. There is a lot of young talent in this league right now and it'll be interesting to see whose rises to the top.

In no way am I saying that Utica won't be able to be one of the elite teams. Herring has a couple years left and Goodman/McClendon seem like they're both going to grow into quality bigs in this league. Goodemote also seems like he can go out and pick up other players to come in and help the program like Troy and Bryant. I'm just saying that with so many teams that will have seemingly equivalent talent levels, it's going to be an interesting couple of years. I don't necessarily think that it will be a guarantee that the league will always come down to Fisher and Utica.

[tigerfan2]

It'll be interesting to see if Goodemote can keep Utica as one of the top two teams in the league. I think the coming years will see a lot of parity in the league after Utica loses Bryant. In fact, aside from Utica, there seems to be a logjam between the next five teams. I even include Naz on that list because it's obvious they have great talent but they can't seem to win a close game to save their lives and have blown more 2nd half leads than we can even get into right now. There is a lot of young talent in this league right now and it'll be interesting to see whose rises to the top.

In no way am I saying that Utica won't be able to be one of the elite teams. Herring has a couple years left and Goodman/McClendon seem like they're both going to grow into quality bigs in this league. Goodemote also seems like he can go out and pick up other players to come in and help the program like Troy and Bryant. I'm just saying that with so many teams that will have seemingly equivalent talent levels, it's going to be an interesting couple of years. I don't necessarily think that it will be a guarantee that the league will always come down to Fisher and Utica.

Another thing that could prove interesting in the next couple years is if Goodemote stays at Utica. I haven't heard anything to indicate that he might leave but given the work he's already done he definately seems like he would be a good candidate for a bigger name program looking for a new coach.

Just for an example, and we can even keep it in the league, what if Naz got rid of Daley and brought in Goodemote. Nothing agaist UC but I would think that Naz is a more attractive job for a coach given the location (Pittsford vs. Utica) as well as a recruiting base and the compensation he would be likely to receive.
It's also scary to think how good Naz could be with all that talent they have and with a good coach leading them.
Again, just an example.

[Adam the Bull]

It'll be interesting to see if Goodemote can keep Utica as one of the top two teams in the league. I think the coming years will see a lot of parity in the league after Utica loses Bryant. In fact, aside from Utica, there seems to be a logjam between the next five teams. I even include Naz on that list because it's obvious they have great talent but they can't seem to win a close game to save their lives and have blown more 2nd half leads than we can even get into right now. There is a lot of young talent in this league right now and it'll be interesting to see whose rises to the top.

In no way am I saying that Utica won't be able to be one of the elite teams. Herring has a couple years left and Goodman/McClendon seem like they're both going to grow into quality bigs in this league. Goodemote also seems like he can go out and pick up other players to come in and help the program like Troy and Bryant. I'm just saying that with so many teams that will have seemingly equivalent talent levels, it's going to be an interesting couple of years. I don't necessarily think that it will be a guarantee that the league will always come down to Fisher and Utica.

Another thing that could prove interesting in the next couple years is if Goodemote stays at Utica. I haven't heard anything to indicate that he might leave but given the work he's already done he definately seems like he would be a good candidate for a bigger name program looking for a new coach.

Just for an example, and we can even keep it in the league, what if Naz got rid of Daley and brought in Goodemote. Nothing agaist UC but I would think that Naz is a more attractive job for a coach given the location (Pittsford vs. Utica) as well as a recruiting base and the compensation he would be likely to receive.
It's also scary to think how good Naz could be with all that talent they have and with a good coach leading them.
Again, just an example.

Tiger Fan...I would have to say that there is no chance Coach Goodemote would take the Naz job...I dont think he would move west of Utica anytime soon. He lives east of Utica....and is not likely to move....not to mention he has built something good at UC and I dont think he would leave the gig for a lateral move.

[Adam the Bull]

Adam the bull,
you working for Clear Channel still?

Yes I do.

[superman57]

I could see goodemonte getting offered an assitant gig...I could also see kornaker being offered jobs too...whether or not kornaker would ever leave would solely depend on the job...Right now I think kornaker is doing very very well

[fisheralum91]

Good to hear.
I know your GM very well.
The Doc mad mention of you the other day too.
Welcome to the board!