Empire 8

[FROMAFAR]

Magic, actually I had that in my head BUT when Bomber 79...said an Ithaca win clinches a first round game against Naz, I was thrown off... If Naz loses to Fisher and Stevens wins 2 of the last 3 ( giving Bomber his win against Stevens.... be careful Bomber) Stevens should get the tie breaker over NAZ thus Naz will finish 4........So  a Bomber win over Stevens does not mean a Bomber NAZ match up...................Unless Naz can beat Fischer. Well like I said barely breathing, and we did it to ourselves no excuses. Although I hate leaving the e-8, it will be interesting on the basketball side of the ledger, to see how we fair in our new digs next year.....

I think the e=8 tourney is going to be exciting... Close games and anyone can win..........BUT

[Bombers798891]

Magic, actually I had that in my head BUT when Bomber 79...said an Ithaca win clinches a first round game against Naz, I was thrown off... If Naz loses to Fisher and Stevens wins 2 of the last 3 ( giving Bomber his win against Stevens.... be careful Bomber) Stevens should get the tie breaker over NAZ thus Naz will finish 4........So  a Bomber win over Stevens does not mean a Bomber NAZ match up...................Unless Naz can beat Fischer. Well like I said barely breathing, and we did it to ourselves no excuses. Although I hate leaving the e-8, it will be interesting on the basketball side of the ledger, to see how we fair in our new digs next year.....

I think the e=8 tourney is going to be exciting... Close games and anyone can win..........BUT

Yes, Naz can finish 4th. I should have clarafied, that if the Bombers beat Stevens, they would finish third, which, right now, would give them Naz, but regardless, allows them to avoid Fisher in the 1st round.

BTW, bigger shocker this season: Utica over IC, Wick over Stevens or Elmira getting to OT against Fisher?

[FROMAFAR]

Gottcha Bomber...

I say the Elmira Fisher game.Why........./

IC plays with fire, and the are young, they can get burned, at basically anytime..  Stevens had the Senior night syndrome... usually let the seniors have their way.. key players in foul trouble, and no one in foul trouble from home team.... at least looks that way in the box score... I know good teams can sometimes overcome that, but they also had that looking ahead theory, which I strongly believe in....so upset yes, but I could see it happening.   Elmira that close to fisher after what they have shown this year...... That would be my choice.....

While on the subject let me offer this OPINION.

Fisher did what they were supposed to.
Stevens a much improved team... much smarter on the court, and multiple threats.
Naz, I think a little better than expected, not much after McAdams, but they seem to be in most games.
IC, better than expected, young but talented.  Will make young mistakes, but can also beat anyone on any given night.
RIT, HUGE dissapointment. Maybe because I expected more. But One man Carson, cannot make that big a difference... I guess it did. We had experience, but couldn't always be counted on. We need that point guard...
Hartwick, about where I expected. Not an easy out But certainly not a threat day in and day out.
Alfred, dissapointment, ball not spread around enough, did not play as a team.
Utica, about where I expected. Players seem to still have that chip on their shoulder, and are surprised when they lose, yet they keep losing. They are seem to be too chatty on the court with opposing players as well. That's not good.

Elmira, wow, I thought a few more wins, but they really are reeling. Nice effort against Fisher, but that was a freak.. I'll give them another year to straighten out.

That's FROMAFARS take ( Sorry PEP, using your third person gig). BUT

















Stoppera shot too much, and didn't let the supporting cast help. Coach has to fix that.

[bomber3]

So lets see if I get this straight:

IC beats Stevens Friday and they avoid Fisher.  They win and can play Nazareth if Nazareth can win one of their remaining 2 games (Fisher, Alfred).  If IC wins and Naz loses both then IC gets the 2 seed and plays Stevens (I'm assuming Stevens can beat Elmria to clinch a berth, sorry FROMAFAR).  Or if IC loses and Naz loses two then IC would get the 3 seed over Naz due to Naz (potentially) losing to Alfred.  I know that last scenario is unlikely but throwing it out there...

Most likely scenario:

1 - Fisher
2 - Nazareth
3/4 - Stevens/IC is a pick 'em this Friday --  Stevens might have a slight edge due to home court advantage but IC did beat them earlier in the season.  Should be a good game with a playoff atmosphere since both teams would prefer to avoid Fisher on their home court in round one.  I'll be in attendance and Ithaca typically brings alot of alumni from the NYC area so they should be well represented.


And I would definitely say Elmira hanging with Fisher is a much bigger surprise.  Fisher is a top 25 team and Elmira is 377th out of 407 in D3 based upon win percentage. Elmira had them beat too - up 3 with under 30 seconds to play. 

[magicman]

According to Massey's rankings if Elmira had hung on and beat Fisher it would have been the biggest upset in all of college basketball for the entire season.

[FROMAFAR]

Bomber, what if IC beats Stevens, and Stevens beats RIT and Elmira.... Naz loses to Fisher and beats Alfred.  I think in that case Naz is 4 and Stevens and IC play in 2-3 game........ Naz will then face Fisher in opener. 1-4. IF IC loses to Stevens the have 6 losses.... If NAZ splits last two, (good possibiliy) then IC is 4th. ...Stevens splits with Elmira and RIT, That would give Stevens 5 losses, IC 6 losses, and NAZ would have 5 loses.
So realistically, IC needs to beat Stevens to have a chance to avoid Fisher,.... Two Stevens wins and one Naz loss, clinches 2-3 spot for Stevens and NAZ loss puts them 4 unless Stevens beats IC.  I think that's it. If Stevens loses out and RIT wins out we are in.........      I will almost definitely be at the RIT game Sunday. Friday is tough for me. I'll see what I can do...    

[Bombers798891]

What's weird with this tournament is that there's no difference between the #2 seed and #3 seed anyway. To a degree, it's just about avoiding a match-up as long as possible--or at all.

[bomber3]

Bomber, what if IC beats Stevens, and Stevens beats RIT and Elmira.... Naz loses to Fisher and beats Alfred.  I think in that case Naz is 4 and Stevens and IC play in 2-3 game........ Naz will then face Fisher in opener. 1-4. IF IC loses to Stevens the have 6 losses.... If NAZ splits last two, (good possibiliy) then IC is 4th. ...Stevens splits with Elmira and RIT, That would give Stevens 5 losses, IC 6 losses, and NAZ would have 5 loses.
So realistically, IC needs to beat Stevens to have a chance to avoid Fisher,.... Two Stevens wins and one Naz loss, clinches 2-3 spot for Stevens and NAZ loss puts them 4 unless Stevens beats IC.  I think that's it. If Stevens loses out and RIT wins out we are in.........      I will almost definitely be at the RIT game Sunday. Friday is tough for me. I'll see what I can do...    

In that case everyone is 11-5.  Anyone care to explain how a 3-way tiebreaker works cause I dont know. How would Naz get the short end of the stick? They split with IC and Stevens.  Is it because IC would have a better combined record against Naz/Stevens (3-1), which would give them second place.  So then it would be between Naz/Stevens and since Stevens beat Fisher they would get 3rd?

[sjfcards]

That would make the most sense, but we have seen in the past the rediculous tie breaker in the E8 of your record vs the worst team in the conference up to the best. So, I believe, if Naz, IC, and Stevens all end up with the same record, Ithaca's loss to Utica would make them the 4 seed.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but that is what I think.

[sjfcards]

Fisher looks all out of sorts, and can not get out of their own way on offense. Naz is shooting well and has a 9 point lead with 3:47 left in the first half. Argh...

[sjfcards]

Fisher opened the second half on a tear and was up as much as 11 early in the half. With about 8 to go, Fisher is up 6. Still not completely fluid on offense, but much better.

[sjfcards]

Fisher didn't play the cleanest game tonight, especially in the first half, but they had enough to pull out a win at Naz by 6.

I have to say that I think the E8 is a much better league than I (and others) have given them credit for this year. I don't think any of the teams are flawless obviously, but Fisher is a solid team. IC can beat anyone on any given night, Naz is a better team than their record indicates from what I have seen (and they have probably the best player in the state), and Stevens is a very solid team. I don't know how many leagues can claim that much talent in the top 4 spots in the league.

I am not saying the E8 is the best league in the country. Far from it, but I don't think it is a down year after all. I was impressed with Naz again tonight. The conference tournament next weekend should be a lot of fun.

[FROMAFAR]

SJFCARDS.... here's how I see tie breaker when all three are tied at 5 losses..

1st tie breaker is head to head.

IC would be 3-1 vs. Ducks and NAZ
NAZ would be 2-2 vs. Ducks and IC
Stevens would be 1-3 vs. NAZ and IC......

This is assuming they all have 5 losses.

Thus
IC = 2
NAZ = 3
Stevens = 4

The following is assuming Stevens beats Elmira ( not a given)
and NAZ beats Alfred ( never know)

If Stevens beats IC... IC is 4....Stevens is 2.. NAZ is 3

If Stevens losses to IC and beats RIT, Stevens is 3, and NAZ is 4.

Stevens needs to split with IC and RIT to avoid 4 slot..... Although maybe 4 is not that ominous... except AT FISHER IS TOUGH...


Back to the league.... I agree, the league really isn't down.  look at my Tigers. I still say we have talent, less Carson, BUT the rest of the top teams have certainly inproved. I think we are just victims of the strength of the top 4. Fisher and Stevens are much better than they were last year. Naz has certainly played more consistent than last year and can knock off any of the top 3. IC may not be as good as last year but certainly better than expected. Hartwick is dangerous..... The bottom teams Alfred, Utica and Elmira have not done well, and that might speak to the strength of the top. I think this league is certainly as good as any in the East, and the top 4 can play with anyone. I would love to see two make the NCAA's. I really feel they will make a statement........ I would love to see a Fisher vs. Williams or Stevens vs. Medaille down the road.....

I can be wrong about seedings, if I am let me know...  

[bomber3]

FROMAFAR -- That sounds about right with the seedings.  Basically each team still controls their own fate in regards to whether or not they will get the 4 seed and play Fisher in round one -- which is all they should be worried about.  Take care of business and then everything should take care of itself.  I would say IC wants to play Nazareth since they beat them by 30+ earleir in the season.  Stevens handed Fisher its only loss but I would guess they would want IC -- they had them down 12 with 5 to go @ IC.  Nazareth probably wants Stevens since they played them tight both times.  Fisher is most likely hoping for IC -- they handled them pretty easily both games whereas Naz game them two tough games and Stevens beat them.  Any thoughts?

[FROMAFAR]

Actually NAZ's only control is beat Alfred. If Stevens loses to IC and beats RIT, NAZ is 4.  So they need some help to avoid 4..... But again with these 4 teams who knows what is the best spot........ I truly believe each one can beat the other or lose to the other... There are no secrets about what to expect. I will say this, Stevens should travel the day before. Driving up the same day takes a bit of a toll, especially if they get to play 2 games.... Bomber your analysis as to each possible preference.... BUT we all know it all comes down to who's hot and who's not........who makes their shots, who doesn't, who stays out of foul trouble and who stays healthy... and hopefully the ref's come up big and treat the tourney games as a neutral site. I wish all the teams good luck, and stay healthy.