Empire 8

[gobombers15]

UR will finish with a solid record in the UAA. Two of the three conference games they lost were on the trip to the Midwest (Chicago, Wash U) who are 7-0 and 6-1, respectively, in the conference. That trip has historically been their nemesis and they still end up doing well. Their other loss was to NYU in OT. They will be fine.

[UCgrad45]

lets also remember that fisher owns a split with uofr....Dr.  Utica is having a good season while the rest of the e8 is in a down year...I mean Fisher is in a rebuilding year and you need double ot to beat them at your house... Trust me if you play like that at fisher there won't even be ot fisher will win...

I just don't buy into this way of thinking.

Play like what? The D that only allowed fisher to score something like 8 points over the last 14 minutes? Change of venue will not suddenly make Utica forget that they are the better team.

When fisher was the most dominant team and Utica was mediocre, Utica beat them once, then the next year lost by 3 at fisher in the championship game. Fisher actually did BETTER on the road against Utica that year.

Another thing to remember, is that this is not the same fisher team you are used to seeing. They are very talented, but the attitude that came with guys like O'Brien has not even been close to being matched this year. The only one that held his head up and looked like a real man after the loss was the freshman, I think his name is Newman. He is going to be a leader on that team in the future.

Utica did lose some great scoring from last years team. But they may be a better overall team this year. The reason why Utica matched up so poorly against fisher last year was the height difference. Utica was a 4 guard team to start, and when Lighthall got hurt they were a 5 gaurd team. The match up against fisher was terrible. Utica went out and got 4 Freshmen at 6'5 or taller, and Lighthall is playing the best he has played in his career.

Point is, fisher is a very good team, but Utica is better. Assuming that it was just a down game for fisher at Utica and that Utica barely won and played their best and that fisher playing at home will make a huge difference is a lot of assumptions to base your hope on.

Of the three, the one that holds the most water is the home court thing. Let me tell you, after punking WPI on their home court last season when Utica was supposed to lose by 20 in front of an absolutely massive crowd in the tournament, and being so close at fisher in the past when the rosters talent levels were reversed, it isn't as big as an advantage as it was in the past.

Anyone can beat anybody on any given day. But to assume it will happen just because of the history of the programs is silly. Utica had never won at rit under Coach Goodemote. It happened this year. Utica had never gone the first time around the league without a league blemish. It happened this year. Utica had never made the tournament going into last year.... things happen, programs change, they have runs, and norms don't always hold true.

Utica is the team to beat this year, and until it happens, there is no reason to doubt them. Just a few games into the season they had become as cohesive of a unit as last years team was at the height of the season. They are unselfish, play great team ball, shut down the best player on the other team more often than not, play tough defense, find ways to win and get up and down the court faster than anyone they have played. Their confidence and attitude is at an all time high, and they are gracious and humble nearly all of the time. I have been around Utica Basketball and the empire 8 since 1999, and I can honestly say this is one of the best teams the conference has seen since that time.

That being said, I think there is more talent in the conference than it is being given credit for. There are some very good young players scattered about the conference, and in the next few years there are going to be some tough battles in the league. Fisher and Utica will be at the top for a long time. Their coaches play a huge role in how successful they will be. Good to see that the league has a bright future.

[UCgrad45]

go bombers, you totally missed the point I said look what he has done against FISHER and UTICA, the two teams that most people have a tough time scoring on because they actually play defense.  you obviously also missed the point about him making his teamates better.  I hope you got to sleep alright.

See Clear's post about how they had three guys guarding him. Kinda hard to score with all those guys on you, especially when your teammates aren't hitting shots. You can get the ball to your teammates but if they're misfiring there's not a lot he can do. You're right, Fisher/Utica play defense on him...with several guys. It just so happens that those couple defenders are usually better than Naz or RIT's two defenders that guard him.

Another solid win for Utica last night. They have now won ten in a row and are steamrolling their way through the E8. When Bryant and Herring both go for over twenty you can pretty much strike up the band for the victory song. With a sweep this weekend the mighty Pioneers should crack the top 25. The rest of the E8 should have a round -robin tournament to see who will make the ECAC's this year. -THE DOCTOR

Are you Utica version of MadHawk? I understand you're trying to stir the pot here with the Fisher majority by making a comment about how the other teams should have a round-robin for the ECAC's, but try to be somewhat realistic so that people don't immediately shrug off what you say (like we do to Madha...Postup). Steamrolling, huh? Not sure if I'd describe the Naz or Fisher victories that way.

Whatever drug it is that some of you posters are on that makes you so delusional, can you tell me what it is? I'm tired of reality and I need you goes to help me out. Doctor? Madhawk? Any help?

If I was an ithaca fan I would be sick of reality as well. 

[superman57]

I think I said that it is a young league...and this year is just a down year because teams are very young... and have you ever been in varsity gym...when the students are there in force it is a diffrent enviorment than any gym in the league...  Fisher this year has been better at home look at the UofR game for instance..

The league has some great young players...but they are young...


P.S. Utica still hasn't won at Fisher and it is still the toughest place to play in the E8

[UCgrad45]

I think I said that it is a young league...and this year is just a down year because teams are very young... and have you ever been in varsity gym...when the students are there in force it is a diffrent enviorment than any gym in the league...  Fisher this year has been better at home look at the UofR game for instance..

The league has some great young players...but they are young...


P.S. Utica still hasn't won at Fisher and it is still the toughest place to play in the E8

I've been there many times over. WPI was crazier than I have ever seen it there. So was Amherst.

[FisherDynasty]

UCGrad, I agree with many of your points and don't disagree since Utica went throught round 1 unbeaten, so they have earned the credit to be considered the team to beat in the conference.  That being said it is a very slight edge over Fisher as shown in the first game and their overall records.  I think fisher will take care of Utica at home (Fisher the favorite in this game). Then have to travel to Utica (which really sucks haha but hey change is good) then the championship will be a very close one with Utica being the favorite.  Repeating an earlier note, both teams will get in the tourny unless there are some upsets in round 2 which I do not forsee.

[UCgrad45]

UCGrad, I agree with many of your points and don't disagree since Utica went throught round 1 unbeaten, so they have earned the credit to be considered the team to beat in the conference.  That being said it is a very slight edge over Fisher as shown in the first game and their overall records.  I think fisher will take care of Utica at home (Fisher the favorite in this game). Then have to travel to Utica (which really sucks haha but hey change is good) then the championship will be a very close one with Utica being the favorite.  Repeating an earlier note, both teams will get in the tourny unless there are some upsets in round 2 which I do not forsee.

I agree that both teams will likely get in.

[superman57]

UC I never said the WPI or amherst were less crazy...I said that fisher is the toughest place to play in the E8 and I don't think that we can argue that...

The fact is I've stated that because of the Amherst student section that all games from sweet 16 and beyond should be held on neutral sites

[gobombers15]

go bombers, you totally missed the point I said look what he has done against FISHER and UTICA, the two teams that most people have a tough time scoring on because they actually play defense.  you obviously also missed the point about him making his teamates better.  I hope you got to sleep alright.

See Clear's post about how they had three guys guarding him. Kinda hard to score with all those guys on you, especially when your teammates aren't hitting shots. You can get the ball to your teammates but if they're misfiring there's not a lot he can do. You're right, Fisher/Utica play defense on him...with several guys. It just so happens that those couple defenders are usually better than Naz or RIT's two defenders that guard him.

Another solid win for Utica last night. They have now won ten in a row and are steamrolling their way through the E8. When Bryant and Herring both go for over twenty you can pretty much strike up the band for the victory song. With a sweep this weekend the mighty Pioneers should crack the top 25. The rest of the E8 should have a round -robin tournament to see who will make the ECAC's this year. -THE DOCTOR

Are you Utica version of MadHawk? I understand you're trying to stir the pot here with the Fisher majority by making a comment about how the other teams should have a round-robin for the ECAC's, but try to be somewhat realistic so that people don't immediately shrug off what you say (like we do to Madha...Postup). Steamrolling, huh? Not sure if I'd describe the Naz or Fisher victories that way.

Whatever drug it is that some of you posters are on that makes you so delusional, can you tell me what it is? I'm tired of reality and I need you goes to help me out. Doctor? Madhawk? Any help?

If I was an ithaca fan I would be sick of reality as well. 

Seriously. I hate being an alum of the most consistently successful athletic department in the conference. That sucks.

[gobombers15]

Honestly, and I hate to be the one to say it, had Utica not lucked into two guys in their mid-20's (Troy, Bryant), Utica would be in the same boat of the RIT's and Ithaca's of the conference; scraping out 8-6 conference seasons and hoping to get lucky in the E8 tournament. I really don't think this very arguable. You take those two guys away, Utica has AT LEAST two or three less conference wins over the last few seasons.

[fisheralum91]

Watching a Fisher home game is certainly one of the wildest venues in the conference.
Those seats on the floor are just toooooooooooo close!

[Caz Bombers]

GB15, thanks for post #1060.  If you didn't say it I would have.  This why the era of Mullinocrity is so irritating to me, said it before and I'll say it again.  IC should own men's hoops in the E8 like they own everything else.  (SJF fans, I know, I know, but do it a couple more times and then you'll have achieved "program" status).

[superman57]

honestly caz I think basketball is the one sport at fisher that has acheived the "program" status... I mean look at some of the coaches the mens program has had (Bobby Wanzer) and the womens program is the all time winningest program in DIII and the mens team has had a tremndous amount of success the past 4 or 5 years

[UCgrad45]

Honestly, and I hate to be the one to say it, had Utica not lucked into two guys in their mid-20's (Troy, Bryant), Utica would be in the same boat of the RIT's and Ithaca's of the conference; scraping out 8-6 conference seasons and hoping to get lucky in the E8 tournament. I really don't think this very arguable. You take those two guys away, Utica has AT LEAST two or three less conference wins over the last few seasons.

Luck, recruiting.... whatever you want to call it.

[UCgrad45]

go bombers, you totally missed the point I said look what he has done against FISHER and UTICA, the two teams that most people have a tough time scoring on because they actually play defense.  you obviously also missed the point about him making his teamates better.  I hope you got to sleep alright.

See Clear's post about how they had three guys guarding him. Kinda hard to score with all those guys on you, especially when your teammates aren't hitting shots. You can get the ball to your teammates but if they're misfiring there's not a lot he can do. You're right, Fisher/Utica play defense on him...with several guys. It just so happens that those couple defenders are usually better than Naz or RIT's two defenders that guard him.

Another solid win for Utica last night. They have now won ten in a row and are steamrolling their way through the E8. When Bryant and Herring both go for over twenty you can pretty much strike up the band for the victory song. With a sweep this weekend the mighty Pioneers should crack the top 25. The rest of the E8 should have a round -robin tournament to see who will make the ECAC's this year. -THE DOCTOR

Are you Utica version of MadHawk? I understand you're trying to stir the pot here with the Fisher majority by making a comment about how the other teams should have a round-robin for the ECAC's, but try to be somewhat realistic so that people don't immediately shrug off what you say (like we do to Madha...Postup). Steamrolling, huh? Not sure if I'd describe the Naz or Fisher victories that way.

Whatever drug it is that some of you posters are on that makes you so delusional, can you tell me what it is? I'm tired of reality and I need you goes to help me out. Doctor? Madhawk? Any help?

If I was an ithaca fan I would be sick of reality as well. 

Seriously. I hate being an alum of the most consistently successful athletic department in the conference. That sucks.

That is like being a Bulls fan now and saying that times are good.... just look at all their championships!