Empire 8

[ricco1]

I only have one thing to say. Find a program that needs you. Don't go where they already have people in that position and if you go to a school with a lot of talent you better be ready to beat somebody out every day for playing time. Thats all I have to say.

[e8bballfan]

POY should be jan coco. but he wont get it, im not sure on that one. Ray Bryant, Herring perhaps?

ROY has to be Corey McAdams.
baltz, newman shouldnt even be considered, and leahy?! gimme a break. this kid was 2 rebounds shy of a QUADRUPLE DOUBLE the other night. if any other player in the conference gets votes for that award, then they should be deemed retarded.

COY? No idea. Honestly.

...on the Adrian Fenyn thing, regardless of whether or not he is good, not starting him on senior night is pretty dick by Kornaker. Personally, i think Fenyn isn't any good, so not playing him all season wasn't a surprise to me. I think he wasn't good in the first place, and if he did something to get into Kornaker's dog house, then that just didn't help his cause at all.

Couple things...

-There's been the ongoing Bostic vs. McSweeny talk all year...BOSTIC is better, not having Sean OBrien showed that McSweeny isn't that good.

-Is Ray Bryant injured? Is he gonna go in E8 tourney?

-What would have happened for IC had BRian Joe not been MIA (what's his deal anyways?)

-and what would've happened for NAZ had Ryan MCAdams not missed the whole season??

-and Is Clemenson or whatever from AU a daddy?!

[FisherDynasty]

couldn't have said it better Ricco.

E8bball fan. Mcsweeney isnt any good? he had 23 and 13 on Bostic idk what your talkin about.  he is the most dominant force in the paint in the E8.  Teams key on him game in and out and still finds ways to score. 

Also, i agree mcadams should get ROY. but i think Baltz should be considered, there always has to be considerations for other players in a player of the year nomination.  Besides, I do agree Mcadams had an amazing freshmen year, those numbers are unreal.  But Baltz can score, and although his numbers arnt as good he plays on a better team with less opportunity, and has earned a starting spot over some solid returners, and now is leading the team game in and out to a conf. championship. 


Bryant is injured, and i would think he'd be back. 

If Brian joe would have been back, it probably would have meant less minutes early on for Leahy and he may not be where he is right now because of it. 

If Naz had ryan Mcadam i think they would be by far the most talented offensive team in the conference and would be tough to beat on paper, but its naz.  who the hell knows if they will show up. They play no D and cant finish out a whole game, so they probably wouldnt be much better off with him. 

[tigerfan2]

I only saw Brian Joe play vs. the Rochester schools in Rochester but I honestly think IC was better off without him this year. Every game I saw he killed IC by taking terrible 3's and usually finishing about 3-14 from the field. And it wasn't like he was offsetting his poor shooting by picking things up on the defensive end or hitting the boards.

Regarding Fisher's recruiting I think any coach would love to bring in large recruiting classes like SJF but most teams don't have 15 assistants that can hit the recruiting trail all year. That being said, the practice of bringing in huge classes and burying players on the bench may catch up with them eventually, at least for local recruits that can see it first hand. I know of a couple of players that have been recruited by SJF but have gone elsewhere for that reason.

[gobombers15]

A few things:

1) TF2 hit the nail on the head. The loss of Brian Joe was an addition by subtraction. He was a chucker who, occasionally, would have a good game. I think they were better off without him, honestly. Ruffrage is almost a non-factor when it comes to scoring but he plays pretty solid defense and allows the scorers to take more shots.

2) E8BBF, I'm not sure why Joe left. However, he played all first semester and then played in zero second semester games. He is no longer in the school directory which means he left school. Maybe it was for academic reasons but I'm not about to assume. By all accounts he was a good guy and teammate. I'm sure everyone at Ithaca wishes him well. I am also unsure as to why Clemente is no longer with the team. However, he is still in school.

3) FD, Joe would have had no bearing on Leahy's minutes. When a guy is 6'7'' and has the game that Leahy has, he would have been playing a lot, regardless of who else was on the team. The reason for his reduced minutes towards the end of the first semester was because he was banged up.

4) FD, McSweeney put up 23 and 13 and Bostic put up essentially the same numbers. Forget not that it was a 4OT game and McSweeney got a bunch of his numbers in those OT's. Also, it's a moot point because from the decent portion I saw of the game, Bostic wasn't even guarding McSweeney; Tom Brown and Sean Stahn were. Bostic has put up good numbers CONSISTENTLY. McSweeney has had his moments but Bostic has had a better conference season. I'm not sure if they'll give McSweeney first team status because he is older, but Bostic has earned it.

Also, I don't want to hear about their first meeting at Fisher. That wasn't even a "game" in my mind. Fisher came out and blitzed IC and IC just rolled over. I don't put much stock in that one.

5) E8BBF, I agree that McAdam will win ROY. However, to say that Leahy has no chance is absurd. The kid has won E8 ROY five times; more than McAdam. Obviously someone (likely the conference SID's) disagree with you that Leahy isn't in the same league McAdam.

[superman57]

gb15 while I agree with you, a game is a game and if you go out suck in a game and lose big time then there is obviously a reason...

now lets get off the kornaker bashing

POY-while I am completly against giving POY to a player whose team won 3 league games...there are no other stand out players...Herring and Bryant lost it when there team choked...and there is really no one on fisher that deserves it...so i'm giving it to coco

ROY- it has to be McAdams but Baltz and Newman have been huge for fisher and same for Lehay of Ithaca

COY-it's going to be Kornaker be Mullins just has not done enough to win it and Goodemote's team really choked...This year has to be Kornakers best coaching year because he has done a lot with the least amount of talent he has had in a long time

[bamm]

POY-while I am completly against giving POY to a player whose team won 3 league games...there are no other stand out players...Herring and Bryant lost it when there team choked...and there is really no one on fisher that deserves it...so i'm giving it to coco

Amazing how sentiment here has changed in a few weeks.  This could certainly be one of those years where a couple of players split the award.

ROY- it has to be McAdams but Baltz and Newman have been huge for fisher and same for Lehay of Ithaca

These Fisher guys are ridiculous with the "Baltz and Newman" stuff.  They aren't even close to McAdam or Leahy.  Furthermore, Kenny Gethers of RIT is eligible for the award, and he's averaging 5 points more a game than Baltz and 9 more a game than Newman.  Please stop mentioning Newman and Baltz, for my sanity and GB15's.

McAdam:  14.6p, 5.5r, 49%fg
Leahy: 12.2, 4.0r, 44%fg
Gethers: 14.2p, 5.5r, 51%fg

Baltz: 9.6p, 3.7r, 41%fg
Newman: 5.6p, 2.6r, 50%fg

They are not even in the discussion for Rookie of the Year.

McAdam has a chance to be POY in this conference for each of his next three seasons.  He is a great player, and if Naz can't find a way to win a league title sometime while he's there it will be very disappointing.

[FisherDynasty]

Bamm, I Agree that mcadam and leahy have done more for their team.  But dont bring up numbers, like i've said a million times, Fisher players never have high scorers  because the play TEAM basketball, idk what you guys dont understand.  Just becaues Joe canori scores 20ppg for Naz doesnt meant he would on fisher i'd give him about 12ppg MAYBE.  Little Mcadam's stats would be split in half as well.  You guys just dont understand.

[fisheralum91]

Good weekend for Fisher!
Talk about a turn of events.
Someone help me out now- does Fisher make the NCAA's if they lose in the E8 tourney?

[bamm]

Please don't tell me I don't understand how Fisher plays basketball.  I've seen more of that program over the last six years than any team other than RIT.  I know the players, I know how they play, and I consider myself fairly objective (unlike, um, most of the Fisher guys on this board).

You guys always use this "team basketball" argument whenever any player's stats are better than a Fisher player.  This is your way of reconciling the statistics with your belief that every player on Fisher is better than every other player in the league.  Must be Fisher's "team basketball" style. 

Yes, Fisher has good players.  And yes, Newman and Baltz are good young players.  But they did not have the seasons that McAdam, Leahy, and Gethers had.  I would take any of those three over Baltz and Newman for any team.

What's more, Cory McAdam, if inserted on Fisher, would be the most important player on their team immediately.  And he would run the show for the next four years.  He's that good, and I think you Cardinal fans could be pretty sick of him by the time he graduates.

[bamm]

Good weekend for Fisher!
Talk about a turn of events.
Someone help me out now- does Fisher make the NCAA's if they lose in the E8 tourney?

I think things would only get hairy if Fisher loses in the E8's and Brockport loses in the SUNYAC's (they currently have won 12 in a row).

Rochester split with Chicago and WashU over the weekend, which is an OK set of results for them.  NYU dispatched with the UAA cellar dwellars over the weekend.  Hamilton and St. Lawrence both recovered from losses to Hobart by sweeping their respective weekend games.  It's going to be interesting.

[superman57]

Bamm, I understand that stat wise..baltz and newman are not in the same league as McAdams...but would fisher be where they are with out them...

[FisherDynasty]

Yeah its going to be very interesting.  I think UofR will not get in as they didnt finish in the top 3 in their conference and have 7 losses. NYU will be in, bport win or lose in their tourny will be in, 1 team from the LL i think will get in, Fisher would be the 2nd at large after bport if bport looses.  I think they will get in as long as the make it to the conf. championship.  so if we have five teams from the east i see it as:

NYU
Bport (2 sunyacs if bport looses)
LL team
Fisher (2 if fisher looses)
not sure if the NEAC gets an automatic bid anymore if the do, then there will be one from that as well.

Lets just hope that bport wins the sunyac and st. lawrence wins the LL this year to make things less complicated.

[sjfcards]

A few things:

4) FD, McSweeney put up 23 and 13 and Bostic put up essentially the same numbers. Forget not that it was a 4OT game and McSweeney got a bunch of his numbers in those OT's. Also, it's a moot point because from the decent portion I saw of the game, Bostic wasn't even guarding McSweeney; Tom Brown and Sean Stahn were. Bostic has put up good numbers CONSISTENTLY. McSweeney has had his moments but Bostic has had a better conference season. I'm not sure if they'll give McSweeney first team status because he is older, but Bostic has earned it.

Also, I don't want to hear about their first meeting at Fisher. That wasn't even a "game" in my mind. Fisher came out and blitzed IC and IC just rolled over. I don't put much stock in that one.

5) E8BBF, I agree that McAdam will win ROY. However, to say that Leahy has no chance is absurd. The kid has won E8 ROY five times; more than McAdam. Obviously someone (likely the conference SID's) disagree with you that Leahy isn't in the same league McAdam.

GB15...I totally agree that Bostic will be a better player than McSweeny...but I need to set this straight. McSweeny actually did not play for the first 2 1/2 overtimes. He had a problem with his eyes and apparently could not see. He then came into the game half way through the 3rd OT and scored something like 4 points for the rest of the game.

Having been at the game I would say that the first half belonged to McSweeny. He dominated Bostic for the first 20 minutes. Even an Ithaca fan that I was sitting with commented on how much better McSweeny was playing. However, the second half and the overtimes Bostic hit big shot after big shot and was the better player. He did score a lot of points while Beigle and some other freshman were guarding him, but he did have a good go at McSweeny as well.

They both had impressive lines...McSweeny was 23 and 13 in 49 minutes, while Bostic was 23-9 in 56 minutes. Like I said I am usually a Bostic guy in this conversation, but in that game McSweeny probably had the better of him...

Also, I have to say that on that particular night number 44 Sean Stahn was an animal. While he was in the game he was the best player on the floor. I was suprised that the IC coach did not play him more than he did (23 minutes, but he did foul out with about 4 minutes left in the game. His stat line does not look that great but he was by far the most intense player for IC, and if he had not fouled out he would have changed the outcome of the game.

[bamm]

Yeah its going to be very interesting.  I think UofR will not get in as they didnt finish in the top 3 in their conference and have 7 losses. NYU will be in, bport win or lose in their tourny will be in, 1 team from the LL i think will get in, Fisher would be the 2nd at large after bport if bport looses.  I think they will get in as long as the make it to the conf. championship.  so if we have five teams from the east i see it as:

NYU
Bport (2 sunyacs if bport looses)
LL team
Fisher (2 if fisher looses)
not sure if the NEAC gets an automatic bid anymore if the do, then there will be one from that as well.

Lets just hope that bport wins the sunyac and st. lawrence wins the LL this year to make things less complicated.

If UR beats CMU (count on it), they will finish tied for 3rd in the conference (with the winner of NYU/Brandeis). 

They will have a QOWI that is very good, and in their last two meetings with "real" East Region opponents they spanked Fisher and Geneseo by a combined 60+ points.

St. Lawrence has a great QOWI and the 2nd best in-region record in the East (behind only Brockport and tied with Fisher).

Brockport is going to beat Cortland tomorrow night.  And when that happens, they could still lose in the first round of SUNYACs and get in the NCAA's.

My point is, the top of the East region is crowded.  No one really sticks out.