Empire 8

[superman57]

gb15 we can agree all we want, but the powers that be obviously saw something we didn't

[rjcarter8]

According to the QOWI as of Tuesday, Rochester is actually ahead of Fisher by one spot.

[bamm]

FisherDynasty -- I'm not being quick to judge.  As I said, I've seen plenty of basketball from these two teams this season.  From that experience, I am saying that I think UR would beat Fisher handily again.

UR being 3 spots below the Cards, based on the merits of their schedules/wins/losses, is strange.  My guess is those rankings are pretty volatile, and a slip by any one of those teams (other than Port) would cost them dearly.

[FisherDynasty]

gb15 you should be happy that an E8 team is ranked 2nd in the East, atleast someone holds down the conference reputation from very weak to okay.  And I guarantee if Fisher and UofR play again it will be a very tight game.  Fishers big guys are better then UofR's, UofR's guards are better.  anyways, idk why your surprised, UofR has 2 more losses then fisher they would be ranked lower, yes they play a tougher schedule but if you dont remember last year, UofR didnt even get in to the tournament because they had too many losses.  A loss is a loss tough schedule or not.

[bamm]

And I guarantee if Fisher and UofR play again it will be a very tight game.  Fishers big guys are better then UofR's, UofR's guards are better.  anyways, idk why your surprised, UofR has 2 more losses then fisher they would be ranked lower, yes they play a tougher schedule but if you dont remember last year, UofR didnt even get in to the tournament because they had too many losses.  A loss is a loss tough schedule or not. 

Why are Fisher's big men better than Onyurika and the other guy who's name I can't spell?

They have nearly identical stats, only the UR bigs play in a bigger, more physical league.  Beigel and McSweeney are good players, but they aren't clearly better than the bigs UR puts on the floor.

[FisherDynasty]

Well in the 05-06 season mcsweeney and beigel dominated.  The Fisher win at home they also out played the UofR bigs, I didnt see the 2nd game the blow out. Mcsweeney and Onyreka are close but id go with Mcsweeney as he is a little better at taking it to the basket and definatly beigal over the other big for UofR who hasnt been a factor any time i've seen him play.  Again, the discrepancy isn't huge, therefore, the guards have to play above their means to beat UofR again. 

[e8bballfan]

first things first fisherdyn, you think fishers big men are better then the ones at UR? thats outrageous, give me whatever you're smoking.

second..

all conference teams?!

POY-Ray Bryant
ROY-COrey McAdams

1st team

bostic
bryant
burton
herring
mcsweeny

2nd

bacon
beigel
coco
c. mcadams
mccarter
mueller

notables missing: canori, stein...

[FisherDynasty]

what am i smoking? i dont think my opinion is that far out of reach.  Onyreka cannot do anything if he catches the ball 10 ft from the basket, he is useless unless he gets the ball directly on the block.  Their 4 man, is the same, and also plays very soft so he isnt even that great on the block, he has no post moves.  Snider comes in and is a stiff, he is no good, can set a few good screens thats it, and Milbrand is very limited as well.  I would take smalt, mcsweeny, and beigal any day of the year. 

[gobombers15]

FD, you're ripping apart a team that beat you by 30 on a neutral court. Where does that leave Fisher? UR obviously does something pretty well to be as good as they are. It's obvious we see things differently when it comes to McSweeney, especially if you're now saying that he's a better player than Onyiruka. I'm not sure what McSweeney's ever done in his career to warrant being considered on the same plain as him, so maybe you can enlighten me there.

"A loss is a loss, tough schedule or not."-FD

Luckily, the tournament committee disagrees with you there. A loss to Alfred is not the same as a loss to Chicago or Wash U., regardless of what cliches you want to throw out there. That's a fact. UR has a higher QOWI with two more losses and three less wins. Temper your enthusiasm for Fisher a little bit, you can't compare 17-7 in the UAA to 20-5 playing in the E8. Fisher's probably the third best team in Rochester right now. Are you going to disagree with that, too?

[superman57]

first things first fisherdyn, you think fishers big men are better then the ones at UR? thats outrageous, give me whatever you're smoking.

second..

all conference teams?!

POY-Ray Bryant
ROY-COrey McAdams

1st team

bostic
bryant
burton
herring
mcsweeny

2nd

bacon
beigel
coco
c. mcadams
mccarter
mueller

notables missing: canori, stein...

wow coco got robbed...it looks like winning means something...I'm not thrilled with the bryant pick, but it's not an awful pick...I would have to do some more research on the teams to see how they are, but right off the bat Mueller over Canori and burton over coco look odd to me

[gobombers15]

first things first fisherdyn, you think fishers big men are better then the ones at UR? thats outrageous, give me whatever you're smoking.

second..

all conference teams?!

POY-Ray Bryant
ROY-COrey McAdams

1st team

bostic
bryant
burton
herring
mcsweeny

2nd

bacon
beigel
coco
c. mcadams
mccarter
mueller

notables missing: canori, stein...

wow coco got robbed...it looks like winning means something...I'm not thrilled with the bryant pick, but it's not an awful pick...I would have to do some more research on the teams to see how they are, but right off the bat Mueller over Canori and burton over coco look odd to me

Wow, the #1 and #2 scorers in conference play make 2nd team and Honorable Mention, respectively. Very surprising. I have no problems with most of the selections. I agree that Cocozziello should be bumped up to first team and there should be six guys on that team. Burton deserves first team, he was Ithaca's most important player all season. He makes their offense 5x more efficient than it was in past years with other PG's running the show (errr, Whetstone).

Also, for those in other cities/states that can't attend the E8 Tournaments, here is the link to sign up:

www.pennatlantic.com

[FisherDynasty]

Gb15, did i once say fisher was better then UofR? i think you UofR is better overall.  They are better coached and have stronger guard play with solid big guys.  the only argument ive made is that fishers bigs are better, which they are.  also what has mcsweeney done to warrant being considered on the same plain as onyereka? what has he done to be considered so great? take his team to no post season tournament last year? Yeah they beat fisher by 30, big deal, a game is a game, UofR came out on fire and the game was over from there.  Do you honestly think UofR will blow fisher out in a rematch? you are crazy.

[gobombers15]

Gb15, did i once say fisher was better then UofR? i think you UofR is better overall.  They are better coached and have stronger guard play with solid big guys.  the only argument ive made is that fishers bigs are better, which they are.  also what has mcsweeney done to warrant being considered on the same plain as onyereka? what has he done to be considered so great? take his team to no post season tournament last year? Yeah they beat fisher by 30, big deal, a game is a game, UofR came out on fire and the game was over from there.  Do you honestly think UofR will blow fisher out in a rematch? you are crazy.

I think if Fisher played UR today, on a neutral court, UR would be about a 10-12 point favorite. I don't think that's "tight" unless you go to the Utica school of estimating what a close game is. As far as talking junk about UR not making the tourney last year, that holds no merit with me. That's like a fan of Vermont this year poo-poohing a UConn fan because they didn't make the tourney for one year. I mean, the team was playing for the National Title the year before and lost an unbelievable amount of talent from that team; they're allowed a down year, especially in that conference. Has McSweeney played in a title game? I don't think he has. Do I think Onyiruka is better than McSweeney? Of course. I'd say he's better than Bostic, too, because he is. McSweeney plays in a conference where he can get by on athletic ability alone. In watching him during his first three years, I never ONCE saw Fisher dump the ball in the post to him and him do a post move. Everything was alley-oops and putbacks. I don't think you can compare how refined McSweeney and Onyiruka's games are.

[FisherDynasty]

your entitled to your opinion.  I still disagree.  Also the 10-12 pt favorite is your opinion again, i think it would be more of a 4-5 pt favorite.  Yes onyreka played for the title game, but did he lead his team no, he was only a role player.  Yes mcsweeney does play in a conf where he gets by on athleticism, but he has matched up with onyreka 3 times and has won 2 out of the 3 battles.

[dmcclintock]

McSweeney plays in a conference where he can get by on athletic ability alone. In watching him during his first three years, I never ONCE saw Fisher dump the ball in the post to him and him do a post move. Everything was alley-oops and putbacks. I don't think you can compare how refined McSweeney and Onyiruka's games are.

Just curious GB15, how do you think Onyiruka gets his points?