Empire 8

[Cyclone0205]

Clearly a stevens kid.  I personally think Williams and Gray are 1st teamers with McAdam, Burton, Herrig (not going by position necessarily, just from what I've heard/stats).  I don't know anything about Stevens bench..they never play them. 

[gobombers15]

Clearly a stevens kid.  I personally think Williams and Gray are 1st teamers with McAdam, Burton, Herrig (not going by position necessarily, just from what I've heard/stats).  I don't know anything about Stevens bench..they never play them. 

Williams may in fact be better than Bostic and Carson, but the numbers don't illustrate that. Right now, it's a two-horse race between Bostic and Carson for 1st Team big man in the E8. Here are there conference stats (which is probably about 90% of what the coaches use when voting):

SCORING
7. Carson (15.0)
10. Bostic (13.8 )
16. Williams (11.5)

REBOUNDING
1. Carson (10.5)
2. Bostic (9.4)
6. Williams (6.8 )

OFFENSIVE REBOUNDS
1. Carson (4.25)
5. Bostic (2.56)
6. Williams (2.40)

DEFENSIVE REBOUNDS
1. Bostic (6.89)
2. Carson (6.25)
7. Williams (4.40)

FG%
1. Williams (.671)
2. Carson (.588 )
5. Bostic (.570)

BLOCKS
2. Bostic (1.33)
4. Carson (1.13)
5. Williams (1.10)

If you noticed, Bostic and Carson are first and second in every one of those categories except FG%. Williams seems to have very weak rebounding numbers. I can see the "well, Farid takes rebounds away from argument" coming from a mile away, so I'll pre-emptively rebut it right now: Carson leads Williams by almost 4 rebs/game and his second-leading rebounder (Gethers--7.5 rb/game) averages more than Williams's second-leading rebounder (Farid--7.1 rb/game). So that argument has no merit.

I'm sure Williams is a very good post-player and could score much more if given the ball more. But so could Carson and Bostic. Very rarely do D3 teams dump the ball into their big men and let them go to work. That's just how it is. I bet Bostic gets 85% of his points in transition, on alley-oops, or from offensive rebounds. That's just what D3 big men have to do.

Williams has good enough numbers to be a second-teamer. The first-team nod will come down to Bostic and Carson. Carson has a slight statistical nod over Bostic at present, but Bostic will get a bump up from being on a better team (a la Dan McSweeney last year) and the fact that he can make FT's. Maybe the coaches will surprise everyone and put both on, but I doubt it.

I would break things down like this:

POY CANDIDATES & DEFINITE 1ST-TEAMERS: Burton, Corey McAdam, Herring
HOVERING BETWEEN 1ST AND 2ND-TEAMS: Virgil Gray (leading scorer on top team), Walled Farid, Joe Canori, Kenny Gethers, Bostic, Carson, Jan Cocozziello
THE REST: Tim Williams, Sean Leahy, Brendan Rogers, Chris Baltz, Justin Beigel, Ryan McAdam, James McClendon

Note: Zeinfeld would likely be somewhere in there, but his season is over

[Cyclone0205]

I agree with most of your assessment.  I only have seen the Bostic/Williams head to head matchup and Williams won that one with ease.  But the stats to bear out Williams being a 2nd teamer.


However, how is Gray not even a player of the year candidate?  He's not the favorite...but not even a candidate?  Leading scorer on the "best" team..5th in conference in scoring, top 15 in almost all stats...stats are VERY comparable to Doug Herring from Utica...Gray E8 player of the week twice, Herring zero times. 

I gotta think he is going to get at least some of the coaches votes for player of the year.

[bamm]

It might be worth noting that when they played, Williams had 9 points and 7 rebounds, while Carson had 23 and 15 in an RIT upset.

Williams faired better against Bostic in their first match up.  We'll have to see how things go in both of the "round 2" games.

[gobombers15]

I agree with most of your assessment.  I only have seen the Bostic/Williams head to head matchup and Williams won that one with ease.  But the stats to bear out Williams being a 2nd teamer.


However, how is Gray not even a player of the year candidate?  He's not the favorite...but not even a candidate?  Leading scorer on the "best" team..5th in conference in scoring, top 15 in almost all stats...stats are VERY comparable to Doug Herring from Utica...Gray E8 player of the week twice, Herring zero times.  

I gotta think he is going to get at least some of the coaches votes for player of the year.

I actually had him in that group before moving him down. If they win the conference, I think he's a shoo-in for 1st Team and may even garner consideration for POY. I think the problem with his POY candidacy is that some coaches may perceive that he's not even the best player on his own team (can make an argument that Farid is), so how is he the best player in the conference? From reading things written by you and AlfredHoops, who has taken in some Stevens games, it sounds as if Gray is the go-to-guy on offense, but Farid does all the things that make the team win. All I'm saying is that may divert some attention from him with respect to the POY award. Re: Herring, Utica would be on par with Elmira if it wasn't for him, in my opinion. He's easily one of the five best players in the conference, though.

Frankly, barring a catastropic collapse by Naz, I think the award is already signed, sealed, and delivered to Corey McAdam. His statistics are absurd and he's clearly the most important player on Naz's team. I think he's put some distance between himself and Burton, as Burton has taken a back seat in some of IC's blowout wins. If Ithaca wins the regular season title, I think Burton's chances improve tremendously. We'll have to wait and see.

[bamm]

Gray is a good player.  But in the two games I watched him he did nothing to make me believe he's any better of a scorer than Canori. 

I don't see enough of Cocozziello to have an opinion.

[bombersquadron]

It might be worth noting that when they played, Williams had 9 points and 7 rebounds, while Carson had 23 and 15 in an RIT upset.

Williams faired better against Bostic in their first match up.  We'll have to see how things go in both of the "round 2" games.

Thinking back to the Ithaca v. Stevens game, I don't Bostic and Williams matched up. It was more of Williams vs. Brown and Kail. Bostic doesn't typically match-up vs. other bigs. Bostic was most likly matched-up against Gray as they are both athletic. I see Williams being gaurded Kail and Brown again.

[Caz Bombers]

Tonight's scores and stats:

Naz 90, Elmira 74 - the other McAdam is back, he had 9, Canori leads Naz with 20.  Evan Taylor had 19 for Elmira.  I've never heard of him, but then again I've never heard of any of EC's players.

Fisher 69, Hartwick 59 - Baltz had 20, 18 and 6 for Beigel.  Cocopuffs with 21 for 'Wick.

Utica 74, Alfred 51 - Pios do what they should on the road, Herring with 17.  Only one Saxomaphone got into double figures, Ellis Walsh with 10.

[NYBB]

Fisherrrrrrrr is good.

[FisherDynasty]

come on nybb i mean i know your probably drunk or somthing seeing its a friday night at 11:30 but no need for that comment from beating hartwick by 10 points at home.  If anything it should say fisher is MEDIOCRREEEEEEEEEEE. coming from a big Fisher supporter and fan. I think Hartwick is not an awful team, they play good defense, and have cocopuffs, if he goes off they can stay in games, but 10 pt win at home against hartwick is by no means any indicater of a good team.  A slightly above average team should beat hartwick at home by a minimum of 10 pts.



Naz with ryan back has to be feeling good, I think when ryan gets back to full potential they are the best team in the e8, however, there bad coaching and lack of D will probably blow it for them.

Utica nice win, seeing how playing at alfred is probably the worst of all e8 courts.  23 is good coverage for the atmosphere, maybe they are making a step forward towards getting to where they need to be to squeeze in the tourny.

[jasper]

, but 10 pt win at home against hartwick is by no means any indicater of a good team.  A slightly above average team should beat hartwick at home by a minimum of 10 pts.

Fisher was up by  20 with 5 minutes to play until Kornacker put the "way end" of the bench in.

[AUPepBand]

come on nybb i mean i know your probably drunk or somthing seeing its a friday night at 11:30 but no need for that comment from beating hartwick by 10 points at home.  If anything it should say fisher is MEDIOCRREEEEEEEEEEE. coming from a big Fisher supporter and fan. I think Hartwick is not an awful team, they play good defense, and have cocopuffs, if he goes off they can stay in games, but 10 pt win at home against hartwick is by no means any indicater of a good team.  A slightly above average team should beat hartwick at home by a minimum of 10 pts.



Naz with ryan back has to be feeling good, I think when ryan gets back to full potential they are the best team in the e8, however, there bad coaching and lack of D will probably blow it for them.

Utica nice win, seeing how playing at alfred is probably the worst of all e8 courts.  23 is good coverage for the atmosphere, maybe they are making a step forward towards getting to where they need to be to squeeze in the tourny.

What makes Alfred the worst of all E8 courts?  are we talking facilities or team?

[AUPepBand]

Do the Saxons have a shot at getting their first conference win today against Hartwick? A battle of two teams riding identical seven-game losing streaks. On Saxon Warriors!

While the Warriors (Hawks) and Saxons battle at McLane Center, Pep will be at the AU football banquet with the Pep Band providing pre-banquet music for the guests' listening pleasure? (only time will tell regarding the pleasure - - Merrill Field is a much more forgiving atmosphere for a band than Ade Hall, but this year's band will pull it off).

Pep's votes: Team MVP - Paul Keeley; Offensive MVP - Vinson Hendrix; Defensive MVP - Don Miller; Band MVP - "Dr." Phil Feichtner on Sousaphone; Band Rookie of the Year - tie, Peter Metz (trombone) and Sara Egan (trumpet); Most Pep - (Lau)Ren Celentano; Honorary Pep Band Member - Tony Alumdonor.

On Saxon Warriors!

[sjfcards]

Today should answer a lot of questions about who is going to get into the E8 tourny. Fisher, with a win, really takes a big step towards geting into the tourny, with 3 less losses than UC, and a win against them. Assuming of course that they don't slip up against the lower teams in the conference. Kornarker seems to have the team heading in the right direction (I know it is only two games, but they look a lot better in those two games).

Utica, with a win, can really get themselves back into the race for the 4th spot in the tourny. They would still have a game against Fisher, at home, to give them another loss. It hurts UC that Fisher is done with Stevens, and UC still has one with them, but a win today goes a long way to jumping Fisher in the standings.

[FisherDynasty]

didnt see the game jasper, but atleast the game was more of a blow out the final score showed, so good win then.

AU Pep band, i didnt mean worst facility (maybe it is, the lighting is bad and is alittle older) but mainly meant is tough to play, its in the middle of no wheres so long bus ride and just tough to get up for games there. Didnt necessarily mean facility wise.

sjfc, good points, and now that they are getting home games and playing some of the lower teams in the conference, it is a good way to get back on track.