MBB: Old Dominion Athletic Conference

[algernon]

(not to mention...no offense...SAT scores have a little bit of a say at Bridgewater...maybe not as high as W&L, but not as low as EMU)

Even though SAT scores have little to do with the success of an ODAC basketball program, I think it should be noted that the assertion that Bridgewater's SAT scores are "not as low as EMU" is false.  The truth is the opposite:  Bridgewater's SAT scores are not as high as EMU's.

There are various places on the internet where SAT scores can be found.  The scores reported vary a little, depending upon what year is reported, but all the sources indicate the same thing:  Bridgewater's SAT scores are barely above 1000 and are 40-70 points below EMU's.

By the way, not only are Bridgewater's SAT scores about 350 points below W&L's, but there is NO school in the ODAC that has SAT scores within 200 points of W&L's.  In fact, there is no college or university in Virginia -- D1, D2, or D3 -- with SAT scores as high as W&L's.

Anyway, I'm sure that many of us would agree that high average SAT scores do not make it more difficult for an ODAC basketball program to be successful.  Actually, HSC, RMC, and Roanoke are not only among the 5 ODAC schools with the highest SAT average, but they are also teams with a long history of success in ODAC basketball.

[cnufan]

Adair's loss is huge.

Wednesday, December 7
Roanoke at Bridgewater
VWC at EMU
Guilford @ W&L
Lynchburg @ H-SC

Saturday, December 10
E&H @ Lynchburg
EMU @ R-MC
VWC @ NC Wesleyan this one scares me, Adair is out, but NCW was missing several players the first time they played.

[mybleedinghands]

After hearing about the Adair loss and NC Wesleyan missing some players in the first game, I have to officially change my VWC @ NC Wesleyan pick from vwc to NC Wesleyan. Adair has been the only consistent scorer on the team this year and I'm not sure if the others are going to step it up without him. So my pick to win that game is now NC Wesleyan.

as i look to stay on top of the pick'ems here are my picks for this week...

Wednesday, December 7
Roanoke at Bridgewater
VWC at EMU, Adair's Injury is a huge loss!!
Guilford @ W&L
Lynchburg @ H-SC

Saturday, December 10
E&H @ Lynchburg, this is a tough gamee to call, but you gotta go with your gut sometimes, sorry scottie!!!
EMU @ R-MC
VWC @ NC Wesleyan, although there is no Adair, they crushed them the first time!!!

this has some tough games to call!!!

I don't blame you for picking agianst us. We're 0-8 and basically have proven nothing other than that we know how to lose. Things are going to turn around......eventually, just don't know hjow long it's going to take.

[algernon]

Wednesday, December 7

Roanoke at Bridgewater

VWC at EMU

Guilford @ W&L

Lynchburg @ H-SC .... Scottie: You could improve your "pick score" by not making a pick on the Hornets' games .... 

Saturday, December 10

E&H @ Lynchburg - So far, the Wasps have lost only to #2 Wooster, #21 John Carroll, #26 Hampden-Sydney, and Guilford (4-1).  They will not lose this one.

EMU @ R-MC - but I think the Royals are strong enough to pull an upset.

VWC @ NC Wesleyan

Wishing a very speedy recovery for Brandon Adair!

[mybleedinghands]

Wednesday, December 7

Roanoke at Bridgewater

VWC at EMU

Guilford @ W&L

Lynchburg @ H-SC .... Scottie: You could improve your "pick score" by not making a pick on the Hornets' games .... 

Saturday, December 10

E&H @ Lynchburg - So far, the Wasps have lost only to #2 Wooster, #21 John Carroll, #26 Hampden-Sydney, and Guilford (4-1).  They will not lose this one.

EMU @ R-MC - but I think the Royals are strong enough to pull an upset.

VWC @ NC Wesleyan

Wishing a very speedy recovery for Brandon Adailr!

the score is not important!

[algernon]

the score is not important!

Just giving you a hard time .... I appreciate your loyalty to the Hornets.

[hasanova]

hasanova...thanks for the spot...got it fixed...mr_divac is 23-4...

You're welcome.  I knew either his record or overall score had to be off.

[eagleslam]

Best wishes to Brandon Adair for a speedy recovery.  Certainly Brandon the person, not Brandon the athlete, is the most important thing now.


stillfamily...

"First and foremost", you're the one who came up with the "you're only as good as your last game" crap.  The bottom line in that is good, even great, teams lose, and bad teams win.  You act as if BC is as bad as they played on Saturday.  The Eagles have a young team, and like Coach Leatherman said in the paper, "Young teams don't handle things well when they go on the road."  A young team is a lot more likely to be influenced by the crowd.  Is that why they lost?  No.  I said it was because, at this point in the season, EMU was better.  But back to my original point.  BC is not as bad as they played.  They have not put 40 minutes together yet, either.  They are young team learning the ropes and trying to find their identity.  If EMU is better than they played, so be it.  If they played only average ball, against a team not as good as they are, on their own home floor, trying to end 7 years and 18 games of losing, than Kirby Dean has a HUGE problem.  They did know "all about the rivalry", didn't they?  And all they could come up with was "average" ball?  

As far as playing time goes, maybe Parrish would start this year.  I have yet to see either team play.  But I wonder if Parkes would have played those 35 minutes last year?  Although it's possible, he did have 6 seniors to beat out, so it would be difficult.

[10]

I think the Tigers will win the Odac Title this year if Kaase and Murray keep up there play

[Jacketlawyer]

jacketlawyer,
The lack of success by the W&L men's basketball team is the exception rather than the rule when evaluating the competitiveness of the Generals in men's sports.  Last year W&L finished on top of the men's portion of the ODAC Commissioner's Cup, marking them as the best overall men's athletic program--just edging out Roanoke.   This year they topped the men's (and women's) cross country competition.  As in most years, they were very competitive in men's soccer this fall.  Football was up this fall.  The Generals' golf team is usually close to the top.  Tennis dominance and lacrosse excellence have been mentioned earlier.  The track and field teams (indoor and outdoor) are competitive at the second tier (behind perennial leader Lynchburg).  The commitment of the administration to fielding top men's athletic teams is there.  What needs analysis is the lack of success in the men's basketball program.  That has been discussed on the board at some length in past years, but we could do it again if you want.

Jeloesel--thanks for your exposition about W&L mens' programs.  I would be interested in reading past analysis of W&L's mens' hoops program, if the other posters are willing.  To be candid, I know only what I read in the ODAC archives when they're printed in the ODAC tournament program.  While I was at R-MC, we were a DII mens' basketball program.  We did not join the ODAC men until 1989 or 1990, I believe  (if someone who clear that up for me, it'd be great).  Before this time, we didn't really play many of a state-wide natural rivals, except for H-SC.

PS-may not be able to do it here, but would anyone be interested in doing a line on ODAC lacrosse when the season rolls around?

[primetimeplayer]

Wednesday, December 7
Roanoke at Bridgewater
VWC at EMU
Guilford @ W&L
Lynchburg @ H-SC

Saturday, December 10
E&H @ Lynchburg
EMU @ R-MC
VWC @ NC Wesleyan

Adair;s importance to VWC will show this week...hope hes back soon  my regards to him

[Brian Hamilton]

My Picks

Wednesday, December 7
Roanoke at Bridgewater
VWC at EMU
Guilford @ W&L
Lynchburg @ H-SC

Saturday, December 10
E&H @ Lynchburg
EMU @ R-MC
VWC @ NC Wesleyan

Steely,

I got them in on time for once!  So all my picks will count!

[Jacketlawyer]

I think the Tigers will win the Odac Title this year if Kaase and Murray keep up there play

H-SC is always dangerous, and contends every year.  I thought this would diminish a little bit when Shaver left, but it hasn't been the case so far.

Who else has H-S played other than VWC and E&H?

[jeloesel]

jacketlawyer,
I think Pat is not interested in a men's lacrosse thread added to his site.  There are other chat rooms to take care of the ODAC lax fans.  Be warned however, that scottietoohottie has taken up posting about lacrosse there, even though he knows nothing about the sport.   

[steelyglen]

just a couple of notes since it is 38 degrees and raining in Raleigh (welcome to winter-time in the Triangle)...

a lot of talk lately about this guy could play 35 minutes here and this guy wouldn't smell the floor there...its all hypothetical and no one can put anything factual to either side. Most if not all coaches are looking for players who can perform within their respective systems. To say that Parkes would start at the point at BC and that Sager would play 35 minutes a night at BC is pure conjecture at best. First I cannot remember the last player to get 35 minutes a night at Bridgewater. I personally know one who was pretty fair and he did not get 35 minutes a night. Would Parrish or Sager flourish in Bill Leathermans system? Who knows! Not a goof on those two kids, they're both fine ballplayers, but... how would they perform in Coach Leathermans system? Not sure...maybe...And to say that NOBODY from BC would get minutes at EMU but MAYBE Clay, is just plain silly. The Royals are off to a good start...but NOBODY? C'mon stillfamily!

All the talk about BC's "full-time assistant"...to set the record straight, PW Weller is Bill leatherman's Assistant...and a damned fine one...but PW performs, as a Bridgewater employee, three other duties for which he is repsonsible and compensated for. During basketball  season he devotes the majority of his attention to the Eagle hoops prgram, as he should, but that is NOT his sole position or responsibility at the College. So let's make sure we know of what we speak before we orate!

And there has been talk also about recruiting budgets...don't know what BC's or EMU's actually is, as I am sure few if any on this board do as well...but...recruit all you want in D3... in the final three feet in 95% of the cases it comes down to financial packages...the vast majority of these kids go where it will cost the least out of pocket for Mom and Dad. This is where EMU fans can help me here...after doing some poking around I understand that EMU is offering full financial packages to minority players. This is certainly not something you find at Bridgewater for the basketball program there! One case comes to mind where there was a particular player that both schools were recruiting...while BC was waiting for the final SAT numbers and grades to come in and determine what kind of partial package could be developed for this player, EMU offered one of these full financial packages and voila...he ends up at EMU! No need to involve names (which I won't), and nobody from this posting point blames the young man for his decision, you 've got to do what is best for you...but as I said the other day, you can have all the assistants (full-time, part-time, volunteer, doesn't matter) you want and Duke's budget, but if school A can give you 100% of $25,000 and school B can only give you say 50% of $25,000 the decison becomes easier! When was the last time EMU ran a 63% minority heavy basketball roster? What other ODAC schools carry this type of ratio? And don't go off playing the race card to me..this is about the color green!!!

Oh and make no mistake...this isn't sour grapes...I acknowledge that EMU is the better basketball team today...they should be! Look at what returned and what came in...my hats off to Coach Dean and his staff for the job they have done turning this program around!

Onto Roanoke and an important home ODAC battle with the Maroons! Let the negative karma flow like wine!