MBB: Old Dominion Athletic Conference

[3sdown]

Oh I love when we compare officiating calls at different points in a game and with different outcomes!

Just curious, in the comparison on Rhoades' T and Macedo's non-T... can you give us quote for quote on what the two coaches may have been saying? Actions may speak louder than words, but when it comes to officiating, words actually speak louder. How do we know Rhoades didn't use one of those priceless words that draw T's and ejections faster than taunting fans? And how do we know Macedo didn't. I know how both coaches coach and are expressive in their actions. But from your description, I wouldn't be surprised if Rhoades used a no-no word while possibly Macedo didn't. Though, I wasn't there, so I would love to hear what they may have actually be saying. (That being said, at a lot of games I am sitting near coaches and I can't quote you what they are saying all the time with everything else going on.)

Secondly, I have usually seen officials that aren't the ones who called the original call being the ones applying the T's. The reason is simple, they are the closest in those situations to the coach. And that is usually where the priceless words are used. Also, while they aren't defending the other coach, they aren't going to allow a coach to show that official up, either. That other official may have also been the one that earlier warned a coach or is the head official. Just because one official makes a call doesn't eliminate the other refs from calling something following that call. There are three officials on the floor and they aren't disallowed from calling something, just because the other official made a call prior.

Curious...were you at the game?  Can't tell from your remarks.  I will just say that the official that called the "T" on Rhoades was no were near Rhoades to hear any no-no words.  The official was originially in the "C" position opposite the bench.  The official that called the foul (on the break away) was in the "Lead."  The official made the call, reported it to the table.  The "C" official had the players underneath the basket then came out to give the "T."  I cannot be 100% sure what Rhoades said, but I would say from my seat that he received the "T" for his demonstrative arm waving antics.  Besides the gym was going bonkers...Again highly doubt this official in the position that he came from heard any no-no words.

[3sdown]

  VWC@RMC   Let me start by saying that both teams gave away chances to win the game. In the end vwc found a way to get the W. For that I say good job. Do I like the outcome? No way ! Enough said.
   Bad calls (bothways), you bet! Bonehead mistakes by players(both teams) you bet! Hard played emotional game. d-mac the play/call that 3sdown was refering to took place right in front of me. The ref that called the foul was about 6 feet from coach R. The ref that T'd up Coach R was about 15-18 feet away. Think he heard something that the other ref heard? I doubt it!! In my mind to make matters worst the next time down the court the ref that called the T  no doubt in my mind tried to bait coach R into another T. If you can get the film and watch you would not miss.it. He came down the floor and stopped right beside coach,as coach worked his way down the bench said ref followed. As for coach M I don't think he did anything wrong it was just the old saying Hey" what is good for the goose is good for the gander"
   3sdown, you are correct 100 percent, not acceptable. I will go one better and say that I am tired of seeing TONTON get away with this sh..t. I have know idea why he did not get T'd up as the older offical was actually running stride for stride with him down the court. What the offical did do was go over and tell coach M about it. (At least that appeared to be what took place as the offical at the whistle ran directly over to coach M and pointed at tonton and said something) I have seen 7 VWC games this year and I guess that because of their recent success  it appears are getting the benefit.(?) That type of benefit belongs in the NBA not d3 sports.
   In general i would say that the officating was about on average with what i have seen all year.
   As I said before nice win for vwc,and I hope we get you one more time in Salem

Donho--

Wish I would have seen you at the game.  And you are correct that there were plenty of bad calls both ways, which in my opinion will happen in any game for the most part.  The one thing I can say is that officials are "paid" to get the big calls right and to manage the game.  The crew yesterday (regardless of the outcome of the game) screwed up some calls at important times, were not consistent, and managed the game poorly. 

And I would agree with your assessment of the sportsmanship issue.  I hope the ODAC takes a hard look at this and really makes it an emphasis in the future regardless of team and venue.  The actions yesterday were deserving of a unsportsmanlike T.  And if what happened yesterday happened at HSC (with RMC the violators) then that behavior warranted a T.  These players need to be held to a higher standard...Currently, in my opinion there is way too much crap being allowed.   

[GP05]

So the refereeing was poor and the sportsmanship was questionable.  That sounds like nearly every ODAC game.  The refs are not the best by any means, period.  TonTon and a great deal of other players in this conference, division, country, sport, and world talk trash; very few get T'd up.  It sounds like an intense game; had the result been different I expect we'd have seen trash talking the opposite way, likely from both the fans and players.  Good or bad, it happens.  I won't get into "culture" but all those institutions you mentioned have plenty of trash talking and instinctual "I told you I was better" reactions; they're just a bit quieter and without such fanfare.

Is there a report on the basketball game at all (beyond the refs and antics)?  I'd love to hear basketball details about a very important game in our conference.

[Brian Hamilton]

HSC-Roanoke game is almost over with about 2:40 to go.  HSC is up 17.

[algernon]

Tigers get the win in Roanoke, 76-61.

Washington & Lee humiliates Lynchburg, 83-52.

Bridgewater has defeated Emory and Henry, 103-90, which pretty much puts the Wasps' hopes of getting into the tournament to rest, since the Wasps are now 3-14 and not likely to get a 4th ODAC victory in their last game of the season against Guilford next Saturday.

Guilford has defeated Eastern Mennonite, 100-93.

An observation:  If the Tigers can get the #6 seed for the tournament, it's very possible that they'll play the Yellow Jackets on both Saturday the 23rd (in Ashland) and on Thursday the 28th (in Salem, the #3 vs. #6 ODAC quarterfinal at 8pm).  That's just early speculation that the Yellow Jackets will be seeded #3 ..... and there are a lot of games still to be played.  I think that tournament seeding will really be affected by how Washington and Lee does in its final 3 games .... against Hampden-Sydney, Guilford, and Bridgewater....   and I am assuming that Hampden-Sydney can get its 7th win against Lynchburg, but can the Tigers get an 8th win against Washington & Lee and a 9th win against Randolph-Macon and finish 9-9?  That still wouldn't be good enough for the #5 seed but probably would give the Tigers the #6 seed.

[DeWayneCarter]

As far as the game went, both teams had players step up to give them a chance to win. For VWC, Stephen Fields had a huge game, including the basket that put the Marlins up by 2 before Jeremy Dixon hit the two free throws to set up the GW by TonTon Balenga. For RMC, Eric Pugh and Andre Hunter both played key roles for RMC, since Justin Short caught 3 fouls in the 1st half. As for the details, the game was basically back and forth for 40 minutes. I think the biggest leads of the game were 5 early in the 2nd half by VWC and RMC was up 62-55 late in the 2nd half also. Like I said earlier, this game was probably one of the best in the ODAC this season. The stands were packed, both teams played hard, and the coach/referree/player trashtalking drama and the key buckets in the waining seconds all made for a great one.

[hasanova]

http://www.guilford.edu/sports/Mbasketball/2007-08/HTML/gcm-23.htm

Interesting game at GC today - back & forth with a few lead changes until about 30 all, then Guilford sprinted to a 51-41 halftime lead.  EMU got down 77-60 in the 2nd, but red-hot 3-point shooting pulled them to within 4 at 94-90 with about 2 minutes to go.  Guilford made some shots and FTs to boost it back to 10 at 100-90 before Parkes hit a late three for the final margin.

Strong was, well, Strong ... 39 points ... ho-hum.  Seriously, he was 16 of 21 from the field, but only 7 of 12 from the line.  Many Quakers (including Sanborn's 1 of 5) seem to struggle from the free (note - free!) throw line - team was 19 of 31.  This makes about three games lately with subpar FT shooting - we won, but it'll hurt in tournament play when every point matters!  Henson 13, Sanborn 13 and Belkoski 12 all in double figures for GC.  Hinson 24, Parkes 23 and Lyons 11 all in double figures for EMU.  The Royals were phenomenal beyond the arc in the second half - they really looked much better to me than their record would indicate.  I can see why they've had a few "upsets" this season.

Anyway, eleven wins in a row for the Quakers, now 19-4, 14-2.  Royals fall to 8-15, 4-12.   

[yj424]

What a great game last night. A great crowd was there. We had many chances to win but came up just a tad too short. VWC hit several key shots in the last three minutes of the game, even while being greatly contested by our defense,
I believe the Marlins had more experience with those veterans who had competed in the last two National Championship games for Division 3. Pity that they did not bring a second crown home for the ODAC.

3sdown, the officiating was pretty bad, both ways. One might think that the better officials  of the conference would have been assigned to this huge ODAC game. Yet, Instead.... they assign a rookie official... who walked with his hands in his pockets to the locker room at the ten minute mark before tip-off... he appeared very insecure....hey... but when you have THE leader of ODAC Officials who himself was a very crappy official  in his day..... well... what can you expect!

OK Jackets, pick yourselves up, get ready for a hugh game at EMU. I'll be there rooting you on. Let's get the next one. Forget about the past game. That one's over. Get ready!

[emufan]

I hate losing so don't get me wrong but EMU is so young.  If this core group of freshman and sophomores stick around for four years, EMU will have a great program in the near future.  They have lost some close games this year that would make them a .500 team, and I am hoping they are learning from each close game.  Coach Dean and his staff will continue to do a great job of recruiting athletes and then they need to stick around for four years. 

GO EMU!

[hasanova]

I hate losing so don't get me wrong but EMU is so young.  If this core group of freshman and sophomores stick around for four years, EMU will have a great program in the near future.  They have lost some close games this year that would make them a .500 team, and I am hoping they are learning from each close game.  Coach Dean and his staff will continue to do a great job of recruiting athletes and then they need to stick around for four years. 

GO EMU!

EMU's talent & team play impressed me - they'll be a much improved program the next few years.

[steelyglen]

Week 3 ( so to speak) is in the books. 11-2 weeks by brianhamilton and jaydubyadubya paced the pickers. Congrats also to brian for being the only guru to call Hampden-Sydney over Roanoke. Raspberries to ALL gurus who called Lynchburg over Randolph (and that was all of us). One of these days we'll all come to understand that like Scottie and the pick'ems, the Hornets gave up and quit some time ago!

The standings:

jacketlawyer           28-9        10-3
bhamilton               28-9         11-2
steeleyglen            25-11        8-4
baselinejam           22-13        9-3
jaydubyadubya      23-14       11-2
rmc1982                 16-7          7-5
roomie                    15-9          dnp
oldfish                     16-10       8-5
44                           7-4            dnp
scottie                    11-13        officially quit!

this weeks pick'ems are up on the pick'ems page ( page 44 of the home and garden section in the D3Hoops Herald)!

[Brian Hamilton]

Hey steely,

For some reason the ODAC page has the HSC-LC game wrong.  The game is at LC and not at HSC.  I have been wondering about that for some time because I went to the HSC-LC game at HSC earlier this year.

[algernon]

In the waning days of the season, it seems appropriate to resume a discussion of the All-Conference teams.  This is my start:

COY - Adam Hutchinson, WLU
POY - Ben Strong, GC
FOY - Jordan Brown, RMC

First Team:
Ben Strong, GC
Turner King, HSC
Greg Bienemann, WLU
Tyler Fantin, VWC
Brad Parkes, EMU
Mason Wooldridge, LC

Second Team:
Justin Short, RMC
TonTon Balenga, VWC
Dominic Trawick, BC
Troy Kaase, HSC
Drew Prehmus, HSC
Clay Henson, GC

Honorable Mention:
Caleb Kimbrough, GC
Curtis Peery, RC
Josh LaPorte, RC
Jeremy Dixon, RMC
Michael Oblitey, BC
Camillo Weinz, EHC

[oldfish]

Is it too early to start looking towards the tournament?  As a VWC fan, Im not very comfortable facing HSC in the 1st round....or Roanoke...or W&L...or well anyone.  Any predictions on the 1st round match-ups?


And for my 2cents on the VWC/RMC game.

1.  I never realized that the ODAC refs were scared to give Macedo a tech?  I haven't seen that many games over the last 3-4 years but have seen him T'd on more than one occasion.

2.  While I don't know how any of the VWC players acted at the conclusion of the game...I would state, as a VWC fan/former player that I don't support overt acts of unsportsmanlike conduct.  However, if the RMC fans had been particularly harsh/vocal towards the VWC players I don't think a little arm waving or chest thumping is that bad.  I can only guess that we should condemn these young men because we all know that the RMC fans are nothing but the most pleasant, level-headed fans with nary a bad word to say.  Ohh how I fondly remember my trips to RMC...  The gentlemen in their top hats,  the ladies in their formal mumu's and chamber music played during timeouts.  A cross word would never pass through the lips of an RMC fan about an opponent during a game.  I always found it especially nice that the crowds would cheer just as vigorously for a good play as both ends of the floor.


ohh the memories!

[DenbowsRoomie]

For the first time in 2 years, I attended a W&L game yesterday when they hosted Lynchburg.  It wasn't much of a game really -- W&L was firmly in control throughout the contest, and since the W&L students are on break, the atmosphere was tame.  Nonetheless, it was good to see the Gennies play.

I now get a sense of why LC has struggled so much this year.  They get no easy baskets.  They really lack a playmaking guard who can create for other players.  They couldn't post the ball with enough consistency and so most of their touches were on the perimeter.  Routinely, W&L's defense would force the Hornets into a bad shot late in the shot clock.  And even when LC would get in close-range, W&L managed to contest almost every shot or send the Hornets to the line.

Concerning the Generals, W&L had a balanced offensive attack led by Isaiah Goodman.  He seems to have the right saavy, knowing when to pass it off or take it himself into contact.  He did most of his work from the free-throw line.

Bienemann had a sub-par game by his standards, battling foul trouble from the beginning.  He also got called for I believe 4 travels and as a result seemed to be a bit tentative.  Lucky for W&L, the reserve forwards (Heller, Owens, Goetsch) all played very efficiently and got into the action.

Tonight's game against HSC is a big one for ODAC seeding.  Let's go Gennies!!!