MBB: Old Dominion Athletic Conference

[ODACfan4life]

For the 2007-2008 academic year, Sewanee's cost was $30,438 for tuition; $222 for fees; $4,560 for room; and $4,220 for board.  Thats $40,000 minimum no matter how you slice it.  So, it won't get any easier to recruit at Sewanee which, on top of the cost, has not had even 1/10 of the success or basketball tradition of Hampden Sydney.  I am not aware of any schools in the ODAC whose tuition rates are going down. 

[HSCfan]

Let me try and clarify my earlier post. By no means am I trying to make excuses or insinuate that Hampden-Sydney is the only school for which tuition is rising. That is obviously not the case. When Tony Shaver was in his prime at H-SC, tuition was around $20,000 and top academic scholarships paid for basically all of the tuition. Since that time, scholarships have stayed the same, but tuition has doubled (now at $40,000). Getting kids into school at H-SC is much harder than it used to be and will continue to be as long as academic rewards stay the same and tuition rises. This comes into factor when H-SC is among the top-two most expensive schools in the ODAC and does not have the national reputation as a W&L to help lure kids from across the country.

I don't think that Coach Smith's move was based purely on winning and success, quite possibly a small fraction was. I believe that he is happy as a successful Division III coach and is a man that values family, which is very admirable. He may not have an easy time at Sewanee, but he will enjoy the challenge of possibly building something close to his roots.

[Pat Coleman]

There may be more reasonable expectations at Sewanee, however. I wonder if expectations at HSC after what Shaver was able to accomplish were too high.

[HSCfan]

Anyways, I apologize if I offended anyone or touched on a sensitive topic. I just wanted to clarify that the H-SC job is a tougher one than most people think. It's a job where someone has a great chance to be successful with hard work and dedication (i.e. Shaver and Smith), but one that is simply becoming more and more challenging than people may realize.

With that said, I am very excited for the upcoming season (months away, I know). I have finally decided to join the board and am very excited to take part in the discussions that I followed so closely in the last few years!

[HSCfan]

I'm sure the expectations are much more reasonable at Sewanee. They are very high at H-SC, as is to be expected at a program with such a rich tradition. In most cases, high expectations bring out the best in people. However, IMHO its almost unfair to have such strong expectations at any Division III program where there are no athletic scholarships to throw at players. It takes great recruiting skill, tremendous coaching talent, and a little luck to sustain success in Division III  That is why it is so impressive to see the traditional success of H-SC, R-MC and Roanoke and doubly exciting to see the emergence of Virginia Wesleyan and Guilford in the past several years.

The ODAC is truly a terrific conference to be a part of, where anyone can win on a given night!

[LCasid]

tuition is increasing rapidly at ALL schools - public and private, so I think the increasing tuition costs is a cop out. It would be different if the increasing tuition was exclusive to HSC or a few schools, but it's not, so every school is having to deal with increasing tuition costs, not just HSC...

[tigerfanalso]

HSCFAN

All good points but don't forget that during that same period of time in which the tuition doubled, tremendous wealth was created. How much money has HSC invested in facilities over that same period ? How much has the endowment increased ? How many additional scholarships have been funded ? Where did all of that money come from ?

Tuition costs are up but it is all relative. If you are able to recruit the right kid (good student) the cost of tuition will be about the same of UVA or any other state school. I don't know the % of students paying the full freight, but that number is probably not very high.

W&L has more wealth than any other ODAC school; they do enjoy a very rich national reputation and they do recruit from a much larger applicant pool; but W&L is also co-ed making it much harder to gain acceptance; so which school has the advantage over the other. I certainly do not pretend to have the answer but I do suspect that things will continue business as usual at most ODAC schools along the way and the cost of education will be dealt with much the same going forward as it has been in the past.

My two cents !!!

Peace

[HSCfan]

Again...and last comment on this...I am not trying to make an excuse or even compare H-SC to another institution. I am comparing H-SC of the present to H-SC of the past. It is harder at this point in time to recruit those same studs that propelled H-SC to the top of the ODAC in the 90s. When the top academic scholarship at H-SC pays $18,000 for a $22,000 tuition, more families will be willing to pay than when that same $18,000 scholarship now is up against $41,000 tuition. I understand that all schools face the same issues, maybe the same magnitude maybe not, but again, I am comparing the old H-SC to the new and trying to explain why this job isn't as easy as it was in the past!

Yes the greater endowment has paid for better facilities, etc. However I'm pretty sure that extra money does not go toward paying the individual tuition of H-SC's student athletes! At least I would hope not, or we might have some problems on The Hill!

Anyways, I want to congratulate you, Scotty, on Lynchburg's new hire. I'm sure Lynchburg is ready to move forward in a very positive direction in the near future! A new court can be pretty exciting...I checked daily last year to check up on the latest paint job additions to the Sydney floor.

[allsky7]

Another ODAC coaching change

Gosh, I wonder if anyone at HSC saw this coming?  It's an interesting coaching move, at best a lateral professional move.  As an outsider, I thought Smith had a great situation at HSC and the program is much stronger than Sewanee.  Maybe the 'going home' with a growing family was a big draw to Tennessee.  I wish him luck and hoping it takes HSC a couple of years to recoup.   

     I was on campus today and was told it caught quite a few folks off guard. Definitely caught me off guard. 8) What about Russell Turner as a possible replacement?

[ODACHOOPS]

As an advocate ODAC fan for quite some time let me just say it has been a pleasure watching bubba smith patrol the sidelines for the past 5 yrs.  I always enjoyed watching his Tiger teams play for I knew I was going to witness hardnosed, aggressive and intense style of play.  I wish him nothing but the best of luck at The University of the South and just hope Sewanee truly understands how lucky they are to have such a young and talented coach like smith in their presence.
As for finding a replacement for smith at HSC I hope they do so quickly and efficiently, for making the transition from one head coach (and completely different style of play) to another is difficult enough, then you throw on top of that the fact the Tigers bring back little talent from last years team.  I think whoever takes this job will certainly have their hands full in terms of living up to the HSC tradition.  In the past 2 yrs HSC has lost starters (Green, Edwards, Prehmus, Murray and Kaase). 3 of those are 1,000 pt scorers and the other 2 are one of the best floor generals/pt guards hsc has had in quite some time and the other was a very solid all around player who in my mind might be the best defensive player to come through hsc, those are some big shoes to replace.  I wish the Tigers nothing but the best in finding a replacement for smith and look forward to another exciting year of ODAC basketball.

[ODACfan4life]

Certainly RMC and VWC will be the favorites leading into next year but the HSC cupboard is certainly not bare.

[HSCfan]

Randolph-Macon appears to be the odds on favorite to take the conference this year, an ODAC with many question marks. The Jackets return the most significant contributors, but with the elevation in talent across the board in the ODAC over the past few years and the arrival of two new coaches, the ODAC will once again be a "black and blue" conference night in and night out.

Not since 2000 has a team gone undefeated during the regular season in ODAC competition. I feel that Macon has an excellent chance of doing so this year, given their wealth of returners, the new schedule format, and the loss of many key, marquee players (especially marquee big men) throughout the conference. I would enjoy if H-SC could have the distinction of keeping this from happening, however 

[ODACHOOPS]

I too agree with RMC being the favorite by a long ways over the rest of the ODAC.  VWC is always a ? though just in terms of whom they may bring in not in terms of how they might play.  With their ability to get just about anyone into their school, not to mention give just about any player close to a full ride in terms of financial aid you just never know what recruits they could bring in year to year.  HSC's "cupboard" is not completely dry your right but that is only because they return Turner King, Pre-season player of the year candidate.  After that they have very little in my mind in terms of scoring.  A very solid but by know means a "scoring point guard" in Lawton and other then King really no one who can consistently knock down perimeter shots, let alone create shots for themselves.  They by know means are "dry" of talent but do have a lot of areas of potential weakness.

[jdubyadubya]

ODACHOOPS - where do you get your information on "not to mention give just about any player close to a full ride in terms of financial aid?"

[ODACfan4life]

If what ODACHOOPS says is true - that HSC has only one returning player who can score, create shots or knock down shots from the perimiter - maybe the rest of the HSC players should consider a transfer to VWC where the players apparently get enough financial aid to go for free!!!