MBB: Old Dominion Athletic Conference

[tigers]

Scotty,

So your view is everyone should just expect a drop at some point.  And that is simply just life and the natural rhythms?  Great recipe for mediocrity my friend.  Yes, if your sample size is large enough that is what it suggests.  However, you perhaps should consider the substance of the discussion.

[LCasid]

Scotty,

So your view is everyone should just expect a drop at some point.  And that is simply just life and the natural rhythms?  Great recipe for mediocrity my friend.  Yes, if your sample size is large enough that is what it suggests.  However, you perhaps should consider the substance of the discussion.

Name me 5 NCAA basketball teams who have NEVER had a drop in success. Name me 5 and I will concede to your assertion.

[Jacketlawyer]

Actually, it wasn't Macon that was really as strong during the 90s.  It was more Roanoke that was powerful.  Macon certainly had a few good teams, but many think they started to wane towards the end of Nunnally's career.

And, Moir didn't necessarily get out on the road as much...

I'd agree with this.  We didn't join the ODAC for hoops until '90-'91 I believe.  We were DII until that point.  The Maroons were incredible during the '90s.  I believe they still have the most ODAC titles.

Congratulations to the Tigers for getting a new coach (and the one they appeared to want). 8)

[tigers]

Scotty,

I agree that change occurs....and the sky is blue.  You are missing the point. It still was not relevant to the substance of the discussion.

You completely changed the substance of the discussion.  We were not discussing the nature of change and that every team has ups and downs.  We were specifically discussing the HSC hoops program and the differences in the Shaver/post-Shaver era.  If we leave it to that sample size we were discussing (which would make sense), your statement is wrong.

[HSCfan]

Yes, we do appear to be comparing apples and oranges here. Scotty is certainly correct when he points to the ebb and flow of athletics and the cycles that all programs do experience (though some struggles are far less lengthy!). 'tigers' is correct when he states the hyperinflation of Hampden-Sydney's basketball program success in the heat of the Shaver era.

Bottom line is, no one can expect their team to always be great, especially in college athletics where there are so many non-athletics department variables in play.

I still believe that a coach's ultimate measurement is a result of the players on his roster. There are plenty of cases documented where coaches do incredible things with inferior talent, but I think those instances are in a much smaller ratio when compared to talented teams that simply win because they are better! Hampden-Sydney was able to corral and stockpile greater talent in comparison to the rest of the ODAC in the Shaver era (IMHO because of the exponentially smaller difference in tuition and financial aid in addition to fewer coaches recruiting) that they are no longer able to do in today's ODAC. This is why such great parody exists!

[HSCfan]

On another note, I expect that the hiring will be announced sometime today  With all those familiar with the chronic occurences of power, internet, and phone outages on the Hampden-Sydney campus, they may experience one today with the overload of activity that I'm sure will take place on the communication front!

[xcoach]

"...this is more about the incredible level at which HSC was at during the 90s and early 2000s.  We'll get back there!"

With all due respect...No you won't.
It has been a long time since the opportunity for an RC and Moonpie wager appeared on this board, thus my extended absence...but the above statement screams out for one! With the parity that exists in the ODAC only getting stronger,  no school will match the record of the "Shavers era" in the ODAC.
Book it?

[HSCfan]

I second your opinion, xcoach! Although I will reserve my right as a Tiger fan to hope that one day the Tigers will actually return to that dominance (as I'm sure every fan of every ODAC team does for their respective school!)!

[tigers]

"...this is more about the incredible level at which HSC was at during the 90s and early 2000s.  We'll get back there!"

With all due respect...No you won't.
It has been a long time since the opportunity for an RC and Moonpie wager appeared on this board, thus my extended absence...but the above statement screams out for one! With the parity that exists in the ODAC only getting stronger,  no school will match the record of the "Shavers era" in the ODAC.
Book it?

Sure...I'll take it.  But, that assumes a number of things.  First, it is a 13 year bet (based off the 13 years that I referenced in my prior post).  Second, that they will continue to make moonpies in 13 years.

In all seriousness, I think you're right in that it will be very difficult to match the Shaver era.  My comment was more of an encouraging fan's view.  I do think we will rise back to the cream of the ODAC, but whether that results in the "Shaver era" records you mention is tough to say...and more than tough to accomplish.

But, it is certainly worth a moonpie and RC to try...

[tigerfanalso]

Time will only tell what Coach Vick will be able to accomplish with HSC b'ball... I would hope the goal is to field a team that can compete on the national level once they get into the playoffs ... dominating the ODAC is going to be difficult for all the reasons stated but building the program back to a national level can be done without dominating VWC. The Tigers just need to get to a point where they can compete with VWC (split) and the rest will take care of itself. I think it can be done .... again !!!!!

[allsky7]

Okay folks lets get back to reality here. There's not a single team in the country, rather it be D1, D3, NAIA, or even High School, that is going to lose less than 10 games every single year and be a contender for their conference championship and a national championship. Duke doesn't, UCLA doesn't, Kentucky doesn't, Kansas doesn't, Hampden-Sydney doesn't, Randolph-Macon doesn't, UW-Stevens Point doesn't, Amherst doesn't, DeMatha HS doesn't, etc. All teams go through "dry spells" - it's simply a fact of sports and a fact of life for that matter. Not even the greatest winner in the history of basketball (Bill Russell) won a title every year. If you expect your team to be that damn successful every year then you are just setting yourself up for some mighty disappointing times when your team goes into a dry spell.

You may not like to hear that but it's a fact and you need to learn to accept it every once in a while. If maniacal Kentucky fans can accept it, HSC fans can accept it.

     They do?!?! You must not be talking to the same KY fans that I am talking to.   

     
What about me?? lol

I know a few KY hoops "maniacs" that expect final fours every year which I guess goes back to your original point. Heck, Rupp himself may have gotten run out of town in todays world. 

[allsky7]

     Here it is:

http://www2.hsc.edu/athletics/basketball/2008_09/news_releases/vick_hire.html

[Tigerfan]

Jacketlawyer, the Tigers and Maroons are tied for most ODAC titles.   BTW, I was in your town on Saturday to see the Paul Thorn Band at the Ellington Theater.  Fantastic show at a great venue. 

[kramsay]

I think Coach Vick returning to H-SC is going to be a bigger deal than most non H-SC fans think.  Coach Smith had a nice run, but his two most successful seasons (barring his first year with Jeff Monroe, Brandon Randall, etc) were the two seasons he had an amazing recruiter (Chad Warner) bringing in the class.  Vick is at least as strong a recruiter as Warner and after his years playing for and sitting beside Tony Shaver he should know something about X's and O's as well.  He has some work to do this summer before anyone should get too excited about next year, but there should be a significant change in the type of play coming out of H-SC before too long.

[tigerfanalso]

Does HSC have a freshmen class this year ? I've heard absolutely nothing regarding  recruits for the incoming class. Anybody ??