MBB: NESCAC

[nescac1]

I did see Wang drain a three in that clip from madzillagd (the ROY in the NESCAC board for sure!), glad to hear he has recovered.  It must have been really tough for him last year, going from a sure-fire first team all-American on what would have been a nationally contending team, to a guy who didn't have even a fraction of his old explosiveness due to the back issues, and had his appendix removed just when things may have been turning around.  Before the back issues, he was as fun to watch as any guard I've seen in NESCAC play. 

Speaking of Trinity, anyone have any insight into what is going on there?  (As I noted earlier, last year's frosh were supposed to be the group that got the program back on track to return to its old NESCAC-contending level, but already three of those recruits, including two who were part-time starters, have left the program, as well as a few other guys from last year's roster ... seems odd for a new coach to so quickly suffer so many defections from only his second recruiting class). 

[NEhoops]

I was under the impression that if a Nescac team is involved in a scrimmage then it takes away one game from their regular season schedule.

It will be interesting to see what Trinity's roster looks like once the season rolls around. Cosgrove brought in a big group his first year (Reilly did the same at Wesleyan). Once the dust settles most of the time players realize that their oppurtunities might be limited and look elsewhere. Not saying this is the case at Trinity, but either way there has been a lot of movement and they are definitely, in rebuilding mode.

[amh63]

Amherst has its schedule posted......though there is a front end tournament that is not defined at this time....two open dates.   Preliminary roster of possible returning players.....three of which are now playing football....two in starting roles.  No FY players listed since the practice season doesn't start until November.

[madzillagd]

Interesting Amh63, if the 4 recruits that we expected are on campus that would put Amherst at 19 players. I'm not sure how the JV thing works but I can't imagine hey suit up 19 for a varsity game do they?  Are some of the returning players 'known' JV players?

[toad22]

Amherst has often carried 18-19 players. The NESCAC limits away teams to 15, and so does the NCAA. Dave Paulsen, when he was at Williams, carried more players as well. Mike Maker likes to keep his teams to 14-15. I'm not sure how the rest of the league views team size.

[NEhoops]

I think all the NESCAC coaches would prefer to have a roster of 15 players, but at D3 there are many factors that prevent this. Recruiting at D3, without scholarships, means that the coaches have a large group of players that they are targeting. At the end of the day they might end up with a class bigger then they projected. Along those same lines most coaches' aren't going to cut someone that they have shown interest in and at the same time that player shows great effort/attitude. Another situation is injuries and/or fall sport athletes. If a team has 15 players and three play a fall sport and three are injured then that team can't even play 5v5. I can see where the league is coming from on its travel roster size, but it does create some issues. 

[amh63]

Last year there were discussions about the size of the Amherst squad....not necessarily the travel squad.  The present posted squad has a forward/center Bryant who has been out about 2 years recovering from an ACL injury.  There is a guard on the squad that did not play at all due to an injury last year that carried over from prep school.  Big Pete Kaasila was slowed early in the season due to an injury.  The other "big" man Holmes arrived late to practice due to studying in Russia.  Starting guard Toomey was injured before the Brandeis game...a lost for Amherst...and his replacement, Kalema, did not have an good game.....team chemistry.  However, gaining experience by "fire" so to speak, he became a most valuable player by the end of the regular season as a back-up PG or playing along side with Toomey.
Several years ago, there was a soccer player that was slowed by an injury coming to the BB team as a FY.  He played well in the last several games when Amherst's pg was slowed by an injury.  The player did not come out for BB in his soph and junior year due to soccer injuries.  In his junior year, he was selected NESCAC player of the Year in soccer.  The present senior class had several recruits that dropped out..one transferring to Trinity in TX, etc. 
In short, it is always good to be able to recruit well and have players compete for spots/time.  It can become a long season if there is no good replacement for an unexpected injury to a starter.  I guess, I'm preaching to the choir a bit here.  Basically. it comes to the approach a head coach takes to building a team and developing team chemistry.

[madzillagd]

Obviously each coach has their own philosophy and or they are dictated by the AD/Admissions what they are allowed to carry.  Amherst played 19 guys last year and the bottom four played a grand total of 28 minutes combined....not even the equivalent of a single game.  The next four on the roster combined for 207 minutes total for the entire year.  8 players....235 minutes for the year.  That is the equivalent of 8 players averaging 1 min a game. 

I understand the value of having guys around when there are injuries or people leave the program, I just find it hard to believe you can maximize the abilities of 19 guys no matter how great the coach is.  Obviously Coach Hixon has won .720 of his games so he knows what he is doing, it's just interesting to look at the different ways of handling a roster. 

Just by comparison, here's a look at the # of players that played for each school last year and how many minutes the bottom 4 players played TOTAL for the year. 

# of Players  School   Total minutes for the year for bottom 4.
19 Trinity 38
19 Amherst 28
19 Bates 15
17 Midd 144
17 Colby 38
15 Bow 207
15 Wes 191
15 Williams 150
15 Conn 80
14 Tufts 204
13 Hamilton 446

As you can see, for the 3 teams that played 19 guys last year, the bottom 4 did not play the equivalent of a single game for the entire year.  Also interesting to see how few the bottom 4 played for CC even though they had 15 guys on the roster. 

[amh63]

Mazd....like to play with stats and project?  Are you a political poll taker/analyst?  Just kidding here....I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
Studying the stats/numbers, you should try to correlate the minutes of players with the teams win record and see if there is a correlation/trend.....without checking the injury reports.  Oh yes, there are few if any injury reports from the schools during the season.  Info is given by posters that followed the teams.

[madzillagd]

Not sure I'm following your logic. Of the 5 teams that carried more than 15 players, only 2 had a winning record. Of the 6 teams that had 15 or less players, 5 had a winning record.  I don't think roster size has much of an impact on wins/losses, I just think it impacts player development.

[P'bearfan]

It would be interesting to see if the teams that are providing the bottom 4 players with significant playing time are using that time to develop Freshmen.  If they do that consistently over a few years you would think that would help those players really blossom as they become upper classmen

[WPI89]

Crazy research Madzilla - if I was cool enough to be able to give karma points - I would get you some.

Looking forward to d3 hoops real soon.

[amh63]

From my fading memory....looking over the numbers provided by Madz, I will throw out some conjectures.
Last season, Midd.'s All American big man had some injuries in the second half of the season.  Being a senior, I would guess the Midd. coach started providing time to others to develop the replacement front line players.  Also, match ups causes insertion of bench players.
In the case of Trinity, the case is out.  The coach brings in many players and there is a relative "high" drop out rate.  Still do not understand his game plan since Trinity has lacked a "big" player since the coach arrived at Trinity.  Bowdoin had an all-conf front line player that carried the team for most of the season.  They have potentially the tallest front line in the "CAC".  Their 7 footer, Sword, started to play more near the end of the season and Bowdoin played both their taller players together in the second half of the season, I believe.  Bowdoin's tall players did not match up well,IMHO, last season with the conference's better teams.  Their guards also did not match up well and there was much rotation of guards during the few games I caught on video.
In the case of Hamilton, there was, imo, concerted effort to develop the younger players by the coach.  The team was also led by a fine senior front line player that made all conference in the "CAC" and in the conference Hamilton left.
I saw one Conn. game live against Williams in New London.  I sat with a Conn. player's father.  He was upset at the coach's use of his son who was a starter.  The father thought his son should have  had more playing time.  Conn.'s team and coach are still a puzzle to me.  They lack talent and as a good friend of mine... who has watched conference games with me over the years... thinks the coach has no set plays for his players.  My friend now refuses to go to any Conn. games...he lives 15 minutes away, because of the coach and the team play of CC.
Williams had a "tough" year last season with respect to injuries to Wang and in their front line players.  That may have increased the playing time of the bench and a faster development of the younger players.  The Ephs still played Amherst tight.
My general take of games in the conference is that it is a game of match ups when the top tier teams meet.  That, and how well a team's defense develops over the course of the season. Still, Amherst prefers to use its upperclass players more than others.  However, when a talent like Aaron T. comes around, he gets playing time at a critical postion.  It is of interest to me that Amherst's FY players this year will be the front line players in years ahead...and the "bench" players will now have their time on the court after Amherst graduated a fine senior class of five players.   Sorry about all the edits....needed to make it more readable.

[TheHerst2and4]

Interesting statistics and thanks for pulling it together, but as mentioned I'm not sure I see a correlation to team success or player development.
While Coach Hixon does prefer upperclassmen to youth, and his staff do an excellent job finding value in their players. I can assure you if you sat with Hix he could talk your ear off with why each of the 19 guys on that roster is there.
They key is finding value in a player and keeping him involved and ready should you need him. Practices become the venue for player development, and at these schools your bench players are facing some of the top players in the country day in and day out. I feel strongly that our success in 2007 was a result of our battles in practice. Those scrimmages were some of the toughest games we had all year that year. Our second 5 was four studs (Baskauskus, walters, Brandon Jones, Kevin Hopkins) and myself. While that's only your top ten, it carries over: when the top 5 gets a blow that second 5 was playing the third group, and so on. So carrying a heavy roster can really only benefit. Besides- how beneficial is the alternative (cutting them) to player development?
Personally I may be biased to keeping a big bench. With the exception of mop up duty my role for three years was to harass our other point guards. I was not heavily recruited to play hoop I knew it was a long shot to make the team so I was ok with it. I was literally the last guy off the bench freshman year and one of the last guys sophomore an junior year.  Hix must have seen something to keep me around. Senior year I saw significant time and knew my role on the team. I'd say it was all worth it in the end.

[amh63]

Nice to hear from you "Herst".   Hope all is going your way.   The previous poster is modest about his role on the 2007 National Championship team and during the season..  He was the backup pg for the All-American Olsen.  He was also the defensive stopper for Amherst against bigger guards.  He was also selected as a Captain on the team his senior year.....he was also a captain on the fine football team.....also a defensive leader/starter.  I guess I have "outed" you..."Herst".