MBB: NESCAC

Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) · August 01, 2013, 08:13:19 PM

Quote from: middhoops on July 30, 2013, 05:52:55 PM
Johnson State is lucky to get a coach with the experience of Verdell but he has a huge task ahead of him. Recruiting for Johnson athletics is very challenging. On the upside, you won't lose a lot of players to disappointing high school academics. However, Johnson, Vermont is a rural, semi-remote small village with one traffic light. Ok, they may not even have one. Their roster is packed with Vermont high school players. Matt St. Amour is the best Vermont player of the last two years and even he is a DIII player. It's grim.
Coach Verdell will need to be a brilliant marketer.

One would hope that Verdell has great success, starts a winning program at Johnson, then has the opportunity to move up relatively soon. That would be a perfect win-win outcome.

I grew up in Johnson, VT. I'd say the school has more to do with recruiting than anything. You're not winning any battles anywhere. I'm not sure if they've added a stoplight since I left (18 years ago - there was just one blinking yellow at the time), but the place is definitely bigger now with more options. I'm not sure they're going to recruit outside of northern New England/New York regardless, but it is a good opportunity for a coach to show they can make something out of nothing, even if the something isn't all that great.

lumbercat · August 01, 2013, 10:16:12 PM

Middhoops- Pretty condescending post. It's not "grim" for Tommy Verdell. He will bring great character and passion to Johnson State.

Not everyplace is as perfect as Middlebury. You characterize Johnson State as a school with low academic standards in a lousy town. Maybe those guys would be willing to come to Middlebury and clean the Panthers locker room.

Verdell is a grinder, a winner. Great coach and recruiter. He will do well, traffic lights or not. There is a world outside the NESCAC.

Vandy74 · August 02, 2013, 07:02:11 AM

Quote from: lumbercat on August 01, 2013, 10:16:12 PM
Middhoops-

There is a world outside the NESCAC.

I thought Middhoops played his college ball in the old Yankee Conference, but as I recall it was pretty grim. I wonder whatever happened to that girlfriend I used to have who grew up in Johnson?

Panthernation · August 02, 2013, 03:58:28 PM

Quote from: lumbercat on August 01, 2013, 10:16:12 PM
Middhoops- Pretty condescending post. It's not "grim" for Tommy Verdell. He will bring great character and passion to Johnson State.

Not everyplace is as perfect as Middlebury. You characterize Johnson State as a school with low academic standards in a lousy town. Maybe those guys would be willing to come to Middlebury and clean the Panthers locker room.

Verdell is a grinder, a winner. Great coach and recruiter. He will do well, traffic lights or not. There is a world outside the NESCAC.

Re: paragraph 1- These two positions (A: it's grim, B: he will bring character and passion) are not contradictions, though you make them out to be. You do not accomplish your task of disproving his claim.

Re: paragraph 2- It is a matter of fact that Johnson State has low academic standards, as well as that recruiting will be difficult. To point this out is not to insult Verdell. If anything, it is to say we should evaluate him with a strong benefit of the doubt in terms of what constitutes admirable coaching.

It's not really fair to cast middhoops in such a negative light for saying what he did, given that all of his claims are fairly reasonable and that he was wishing for the best for both Verdell and the JSC program.

Vandy74 · August 02, 2013, 06:53:14 PM

Quote from: Panthernation on August 02, 2013, 03:58:28 PM
Quote from: lumbercat on August 01, 2013, 10:16:12 PM
Middhoops- Pretty condescending post. It's not "grim" for Tommy Verdell. He will bring great character and passion to Johnson State.

Not everyplace is as perfect as Middlebury. You characterize Johnson State as a school with low academic standards in a lousy town. Maybe those guys would be willing to come to Middlebury and clean the Panthers locker room.

Verdell is a grinder, a winner. Great coach and recruiter. He will do well, traffic lights or not. There is a world outside the NESCAC.

Re: paragraph 1- These two positions (A: it's grim, B: he will bring character and passion) are not contradictions, though you make them out to be. You do not accomplish your task of disproving his claim.

Re: paragraph 2- It is a matter of fact that Johnson State has low academic standards, as well as that recruiting will be difficult. To point this out is not to insult Verdell. If anything, it is to say we should evaluate him with a strong benefit of the doubt in terms of what constitutes admirable coaching.

It's not really fair to cast middhoops in such a negative light for saying what he did, given that all of his claims are fairly reasonable and that he was wishing for the best for both Verdell and the JSC program.

Panthernation.....Spot-on, as always.

lumbercat · August 02, 2013, 08:23:15 PM

Condescending with a shade of arrogance- not typical of an individual who associates himself with a great institution like Middlebury.
The issue is not the accuracy of Middhoop's observations but in the way he delivered them.
Take the high road when you are on top, no need throw those in a position that you perceive to be inferior that far under the bus.
Guys like Russ Reilly and Old Guy have always exhibited great Panther class and would never project that kind of arrogance. Consider following their example.

madzillagd · August 03, 2013, 05:35:16 PM

<The uncle finishes his speech and exits through the doorway stage left>

<Nephew is left staring out the window into the distance, contemplating the lecture he has received>

END SCENE.

amh63 · August 03, 2013, 08:21:29 PM

Goodness...it is late Summer and classes have not started. You posters should join the football board where we are just speculating on few bits of info. Could use some of the wit shown by Mad.

P'bearfan · August 04, 2013, 02:35:21 PM

QuoteGoodness...it is late Summer and classes have not started. You posters should join the football board where we are just speculating on few bits of info. Could use some of the wit shown by Mad.

Agreed - it's only the beginning of August. At this rate it's going to be a long 3 1/2 months until the season starts!

amh63 · August 06, 2013, 01:21:55 PM

There is a post by rik on the NEWMAC board that maybe of interest here. MIT has announced it's recruiting class of six players....from around the country. Several of the players are from the D.C. Area which has been a good area for "CAC"schools. Of interest to me is that the school made the announcement at this time.

P'bearfan · August 06, 2013, 02:16:47 PM

QuoteThere is a post by rik on the NEWMAC board that maybe of interest here. MIT has announced it's recruiting class of six players....from around the country. Several of the players are from the D.C. Area which has been a good area for "CAC"schools. Of interest to me is that the school made the announcement at this time.

Interesting post and article. I don't remember any NESCAC schools announcing their incoming class....even after school started. It seems that they take the low key approach and just update their rosters on-line.

I'm sure this will be a good class for MIT and make them even more competitive. I have read about their 6'-10" guy (Higgins) before. He originally committed to Cornell along with one of my son's teammates. At his size he has plenty of upside but he'll need to work on his skills - especially offensively. Best of luck to Coach Andersen and this class.

nescac1 · August 07, 2013, 08:37:19 AM

Article on Ryan Spadaford, mentioned on this site a few months back, who has indeed transferred from Navy to Tufts:

http://www.gothamhoops.com/spadaford-commits-to-tufts-university/

Tufts will be as talented and deep as anyone in NESCAC next year led by Ferris, Palleschi, Moss, Firepong, Haladyna and Cohen plus four potential impact recruits. Of course, they have to prove it on the court (Tufts has looked stacked on paper in the past only to fall short of expectations), but hard to imagine they won't be an NCAA team assuming the young guys make the typical improvements.

P'bearfan · August 07, 2013, 09:06:01 AM

QuoteArticle on Ryan Spadaford, mentioned on this site a few months back, who has indeed transferred from Navy to Tufts:

http://www.gothamhoops.com/spadaford-commits-to-tufts-university/

Tufts will be as talented and deep as anyone in NESCAC next year led by Ferris, Palleschi, Moss, Firepong, Haladyna and Cohen plus four potential impact recruits. Of course, they have to prove it on the court (Tufts has looked stacked on paper in the past only to fall short of expectations), but hard to imagine they won't be an NCAA team assuming the young guys make the typical improvements.

With the additiona of Spadaford, you have to believe that Tufts will give Amherst, Wiiliams and Midd a real run for their money next year. Is it too soon to call Tufts the conference favorite?

nescac1 · August 07, 2013, 10:32:38 AM

A run for the money, yes. The FAVORITE when compared to (1) the defending national champion returning the the national player of the year, and (2) two returning Elite 8 teams, both of which have consistently made deep tourney runs, and who will likely have three pre-season All-Americans between them? Not even close. Let's at least see this Tufts group make a NESCAC final or an NCAA appearance before annointing them the favorites over three battle-tested, veteran squads. We also don't know yet how much of an impact the new players are going to make. They are not going to surprise anyone next year, and they will have to play at Williams and Midd back-to-back.

I do, however, think that Palleschi and Ferris are two of the top ten returning players in NESCAC, along with Toomey, Mayer, Epley, Kizell, Pieri, Hurley, Vadas, and Hart. They will need Haldyana to make major strides as a go-to scorer and at least two of the newcomers to make big impacts to break into the big three.

amh63 · August 07, 2013, 11:26:21 AM

As usual, Nescac 1 beat me with a response with respect to Tuft's position in this season's title race

Having seen Tufts talented team play live in LeFrak last season, the strength of the Jumbos is in the front court. They will need better backcourt play and overall defensive play to be a " real" contender / favorite. Defense and experienced talented backcourts were key to the three Elite 8 teams from the conference last year.
Amherst graduated it's front court stars... But return five of the 8 primary players that helped lead the team to the title.