MBB: NESCAC

[amh63]

An amusing Twitter on the Amherst website.  States that since it is 15 days to start of practice...the Amherst coaches challenge any other school with a 3 on 3 match game.  Afraid there will be few takers...in the d3 MBB world.  Believe the Amherst young assistant coaches are in pretty good shape.

[P'bearfan]

The challenge is not how fit the 3 Amherst ass't coaches are; it's the fact that it would be 3 vs 1 if they played Bowdoin.

[JustAFan]

News of a couple of "commitments pending acceptance of ED applications" on the NERR site:  6-6 Northfield Mt. Hermon forward Patrick Racy to Tufts and 6-3 Brookline (MA) guard Ronan Schwartz to Colby.

[nescac1]

Interesting re: Racy, who (at least for one year) will get to play against his older brother at Amherst.  Colby is going to need a HUGE recruiting year given that they will be graduating five very talented and accomplished senior starters (which is also why I am bullish on Colby's chances to be a surprise contender for a top-two finish in NESCAC this year).  NESCAC schools are off to a very strong start in recruiting (especially Amherst and Williams).   

[amh63]

JustaFan....thanks for the info.
Nescac1...you too.....was wondering about Racy.  Surprising to me is the prep school route..NMH.
Anyway, just looked at the Amherst schedule too plan my trips up to LeFrak.  For efficiency, looking at the Fri-Sat combo games during the regular season.  Seems that Williams have no such games...based on a look at the Williams schedule.  This must be that unique case where Williams has no " traveling partner".....has a break on the weekend games....Fri- Sun.
Any thoughts on whether this is a good or bad thing to have?  Good for a young team?  Bad for post season play?  whatever?  Recall Midd was on that schedule several seasons ago..??

[Bucket]

JustaFan....thanks for the info.
Nescac1...you too.....was wondering about Racy.  Surprising to me is the prep school route..NMH.
Anyway, just looked at the Amherst schedule too plan my trips up to LeFrak.  For efficiency, looking at the Fri-Sat combo games during the regular season.  Seems that Williams have no such games...based on a look at the Williams schedule.  This must be that unique case where Williams has no " traveling partner".....has a break on the weekend games....Fri- Sun.
Any thoughts on whether this is a good or bad thing to have?  Good for a young team?  Bad for post season play?  whatever?  Recall Midd was on that schedule several seasons ago..??

I think it's a bad thing to have. For starters, your Sunday opponent had the entire weekend off. And while you have a day of rest after the Friday game, they didn't have to play at all. Plus, they only had to game plan for you that weekend, while you had to prepare for both Friday's and Sunday's opponent.

Also significant is the disruption of the "normal"  weekend, which is usually Friday night game, Saturday afternoon game, Sunday library. With this unbalanced schedule, you play Friday night, try and get yourself into the library on Saturday (when most others on campus are not), and then play on Sunday, getting back to the library far later than normal.

I've spoken to several Middlebury players who really disliked this schedule.

And, for what it's worth, there's the impact on the parents. Much more difficuly to travel back home late on a Sunday, as opposed to Sunday morning.

[P'bearfan]

JustaFan....thanks for the info.
Nescac1...you too.....was wondering about Racy.  Surprising to me is the prep school route..NMH.
Anyway, just looked at the Amherst schedule too plan my trips up to LeFrak.  For efficiency, looking at the Fri-Sat combo games during the regular season.  Seems that Williams have no such games...based on a look at the Williams schedule.  This must be that unique case where Williams has no " traveling partner".....has a break on the weekend games....Fri- Sun.
Any thoughts on whether this is a good or bad thing to have?  Good for a young team?  Bad for post season play?  whatever?  Recall Midd was on that schedule several seasons ago..??




I think it's a bad thing to have. For starters, your Sunday opponent had the entire weekend off. And while you a day of rest after the Friday game, they didn't have to play at all. Plus, they only had to game plan for you that weekend, while you had to prepare for both Friday's and Sunday's opponent.

Also significant is the disruption of the "normal"  weekend, which is usually Friday night game, Saturday afternoon game, Sunday library. With this unbalanced schedule, you play Friday night, try and get yourself into the library on Saturday (when most others on campus are not), and then play on Sunday, getting back to the library far later than normal.

I've spoken to several Middlebury players who really disliked this schedule.

And, for what it's worth, there's the impact on the parents. Much more difficuly to travel back home late on a Sunday, as opposed to Sunday morning.

In general I agree with Bucket's assessment - Sunday games are tough all around because they throw you out of your normal rythm.

At the same time, we should recognize that the "typical" NESCAC Friday/Saturday schedule strongly favors teams with deep benches (e.g. Amherst).  For example, last season Bowdoin played Trinity on the road on a Friday night and then Amherst the next day.  We had a chance to defeat Trinity on a last second in bound play but didn't (painful memory) and then lost in OT (even more painful memory).  Our starters logged incredible minutes in that game (e.g. Swords played ~38 minutes). 

Once we went to OT I knew we had a zero chance of beating Amherst - even if we had beaten Trinity.  We had so many injuries that we were especially thin so expecting us to defeat a top tier team within 24 hours was just unreasonable.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

So if you made the NCAA tournament, you figure you wouldn't win the second game of the weekend/tournament either, then.

[P'bearfan]

So if you made the NCAA tournament, you figure you wouldn't win the second game of the weekend/tournament either, then.

Agreed; that type of schedule favors deeper teams.  If you can play 8-9 vs 6-7 that's a big advantage when you face schedules with back to back games.  I'm not complaining just commenting on advantages / disadvantages of the Friday / Saturday vs Friday / Sunday format.

[Pat Coleman]

Preseason Top 25 is out. This one's a doozy!
http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2015/10/mens-preseason-no-1

[nescac1]

Interesting poll.  Augustana was indeed an obvious choice with basically everyone back from a loaded team.  I think Amherst at number five is exactly right -- while they were up and down last year, everyone is back from a team that relied almost entirely on underclassmen, plus they added yet another stud big guy.  They look scary this year and even scarier next year.  I take issue with the placement of two New England teams. 

I think Babson is way, WAY overrated.  They had a gaudy record last year but also MANY close escapes, really had to grind out many of their wins.  And while Flannery is a great player and certainly will be a first-team all-American, they replace their next three best players and return no one else who averaged even six points, or even three boards, per game.  They also benefited from incredible good luck in terms of health last year, as their top six guys didn't miss a single game between them.  They are unlikely to be as lucky, health-wise, and they are really a one-man show headed into the season.  If Flannery misses any games they'd be in big trouble.  I don't see them as that much different from Bowdoin, really, another team with a nationally-elite player surrounded by largely question marks. 

I'd also swap Trinity out with Wesleyan in this poll.  Trinity is another team that had to grind out a lot of close wins last year and loses many key pieces.  Trinity's biggest asset was its depth up front, but they have to replace two frontcourt starters.  Starks is really the only player with elite offensive skills on the team.  Trinity is another team that had VERY good injury luck last year, missing only one game combined from its top five scorers.

Meanwhile, Wesleyan came together late in the season, and rode that to the NESCAC title.  They return their top six guys, all of whom are very good players and should be improved after the NESCAC/NCAA experiences, and add in a talented and deep recruiting class.  They have a lot of 3-4 year starters on that squad.  I think they are clearly a top-25 team, while Trinity may fall to around fourth in NESCAC (I also like Colby's returning talent better than Trinity's, if Hudnut is healthy). 

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Interesting poll.  Augustana was indeed an obvious choice with basically everyone back from a loaded team.  I think Amherst at number five is exactly right -- while they were up and down last year, everyone is back from a team that relied almost entirely on underclassmen, plus they added yet another stud big guy.  They look scary this year and even scarier next year.  I take issue with the placement of two New England teams. 

I think Babson is way, WAY overrated.  They had a gaudy record last year but also MANY close escapes, really had to grind out many of their wins.  And while Flannery is a great player and certainly will be a first-team all-American, they replace their next three best players and return no one else who averaged even six points, or even three boards, per game.  They also benefited from incredible good luck in terms of health last year, as their top six guys didn't miss a single game between them.  They are unlikely to be as lucky, health-wise, and they are really a one-man show headed into the season.  If Flannery misses any games they'd be in big trouble.  I don't see them as that much different from Bowdoin, really, another team with a nationally-elite player surrounded by largely question marks. 

I'd also swap Trinity out with Wesleyan in this poll.  Trinity is another team that had to grind out a lot of close wins last year and loses many key pieces.  Trinity's biggest asset was its depth up front, but they have to replace two frontcourt starters.  Starks is really the only player with elite offensive skills on the team.  Trinity is another team that had VERY good injury luck last year, missing only one game combined from its top five scorers.

Meanwhile, Wesleyan came together late in the season, and rode that to the NESCAC title.  They return their top six guys, all of whom are very good players and should be improved after the NESCAC/NCAA experiences, and add in a talented and deep recruiting class.  They have a lot of 3-4 year starters on that squad.  I think they are clearly a top-25 team, while Trinity may fall to around fourth in NESCAC (I also like Colby's returning talent better than Trinity's, if Hudnut is healthy).

I agree Trinity is a reach.  They lost a lot.

I'm a little less concerned with Babson.  They parlayed last year's success into a pretty good recruiting season - the guys lost are really leadership losses.  With the system they play, production is easier to replace.  You also have to figure there aren't a lot of options out there.  I mean Virginia Wesleyan lost about the same, if you measure actual production, but they're ranked #2 this year.  Flannery certainly gives Babson a boost (perhaps the same way an experienced, successful coach might be given the benefit of the doubt - see Wooster at the bottom of the poll), but I think we're going to see A LOT of upheaval this year once the games play out.

[nescac1]

I think the players Babson lost are a bit better than you give them credit for, Hoops Fan.  Wickey was a very, VERY good player, a big man with a unique tool set and a good inside-outside game.  Those guys don't grow on trees in D3.  Dean and Mack were very athletic, tough and physical and gave Babson a lot of its rough-and-tumble defensive identity -- they are always tough on D with that system and that coach, but they were still the two best defenders on the team in addition to providing some scoring punch.  But Wickey in particular I think is a big loss and without him teams can REALLY focus on guarding Flannery now. 

You do have a good point about there not being a lot of obvious choices, especially from NEWMAC which looks REALLY down this year, the weakest it's been in years (huge losses for Springfield and MIT too, and fairly big losses for WPI but I think WPI is the best team in NEWMAC coming back as they had a very strong frosh class last year which should be ready to step up into prime-time roles). 

If I were to do a VERY preliminary ranking of New England teams pre-season, I'd say something like 1. Amherst, 2. Wesleyan 3. Eastern Conn, 4. Southern Vermont (really! ... no longer a young team), 5. Colby (seems like a reach but return two key guys from season-ending injuries), 6. WPI, 7. Trinity, 8. Babson.  Albertus Magnus is always a wildcard, not sure if they brought in their usual Juco studs to replace the awesome players they lost, they may fit into the picture.  I'm sure there is another LEC team that maybe belongs in there but I know less about who is returning what there.  Williams and Middlebury I feel are both a year away from returning to their usual position as New England contending teams. 

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Yeah, Babson may be high.  I think it's just easier to say, "nobody really looks strong, why not go with the team that has the best player?"

Those losses are big losses, but they are bringing in some real talent to replace them.  No one can really predict if they can replace the leadership and toughness that got them to Salem - that's pretty much a judgment call.

I agree S Vermont should be pretty good (they lost one starter, #3 in scoring and rebounding) - they're at the Hoopsville tournament in November, so I'll get to see them in person early.

[nescac1]

Fair enough -- I certainly know nothing about the talent Babson is bringing in!