MBB: NESCAC

Started by cameltime, April 27, 2005, 02:38:16 PM

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ronk

Scranton WBB had a charter back from St. Louis(~900 miles,driving distance) last Saturday. There was a pic tweeted with the PROP plane in the background.

Old Guy

Quote from: Bucket on March 14, 2017, 12:40:39 PM
Quote from: Old Guy on March 13, 2017, 08:17:25 PM
Quote from: P'bearfan on March 13, 2017, 07:09:10 AM
I had exactly the same sentiment when Bowdoin played Williams.  About 10 or 12 minutes into the first half they brought yet another big off the bench.  I remember asking myself "Exactly how many 6'-8" players do these guys have?!!"

Congrats on the great season.  I'm sure it ended earlier than you would have like but this was a great Midd team.

It did indeed. We thought we had a great chance to go to the Final Four. We lost. We lost to a good team that earned their win.

Today I was in the little market at the bottom of the hill below the college picking up my Globe and a cup of coffee - and a couple of friends approached me tentatively, and asked, "are you all right?" like I had lost a loved one. I wanted to say, "Screw you. What do you take me for?" I know they meant well. 

A couple of years ago, I chastised Bucket when he described a loss as "heart-breaking." Language inflation, I told him. It's a game. Reserve that language for something poignant and deeply sad, a personal tragedy. We went round and around on that. I love sports, at their best, because they evoke such powerful emotions - loyalty, intimacy, the ecstasy that comes with heated competition and exhausting physical effort. I constantly quote Al Maguire who said "the best thing in sports is winning; the second best thing in sports is losing." Living life fully, in the moment - what a gift, win or lose.

Coincidently, Coach Jeff Brown was in the store at the same time - that would be NESCAC Coach of the Year and New England Coach of the Year Jeff Brown. He wasn't wearing black, greeted everyone with a smile, and seemed not to be faking it. Hell of a year.

Middlebury won three games in the NCAA tournament, won the NESCAC Championship, finished the season 27-4, had the NESCAC Player of the Year - it goes on and on. Disappointing loss, yes, but not that hard to get over. One of the greatest seasons
ever, I think, in Midd sports history (and I'm so old now I am institutional history at Middlebury).

I fully expect Bucket to write and say, "Don't listen to Pollyanna - heartbreaking loss."

I will never say don't listen to Old Guy–it's virtually impossible, for one. He never stops talking! (For those who don't know us well, take this with a pillar of salt. There are few people on this planet I enjoy engaging in conversation with more than my dear friend.)

Naturally, I find myself admiring his point of view, but I also want to challenge parts of it, especially "not that hard to get over." Ok, in the grand scheme of things—Syria or a basketball game—yes, of course. But, allowing for perspective, this team's dream of Salem coming up a game short, on the stage and in the manner that it did, will ache for some time, especially for those closest to this goal (and I'm not talking about me or other fans, but rather the players and coaches who literally worked toward this goal every day until Saturday). I mean, 15 years hence, I still find myself thinking about games that I coached (jv high school, not exactly high stakes!) in which we lost at the buzzer, replaying possessions over and over in my head. How long will these current players and coaches be replaying Saturday night's game in their respective heads? And I think this is entirely legitimate and understandable.

Sunday morning, I sat in a corner of a high school gym in rural Vermont with one of the Panther assistant coaches; our sons play on the same youth travel hoop team. While our boys warmed up, we commiserated, grieved even. The pain was real. I wouldn't have called the feeling disappointment. (And, to be clear, I would call this grieving directional, grieving for the young men, not for ourselves.)

Digression, kind of: Appropriate place to recognize that we lost to a great team who deserved the win; Williams was terrific.   

Of course, we're adults, blessed with perspective, so I would agree with OG's assessment of Coach Brown greeting well wishers: of course he wasn't faking it. It was, indeed, a hell of a year, a lot to be happy about, but I think it's possible to be grateful for the ride while also still hurting at the same time.

Last note on heartbreak—and this is where things get interesting, at least to me.

On Saturday morning, my 83-year-old father had a heart attack. (His heart, quite literally, broke.) While my dad rested comfortably in a hospital bed hundreds of miles away, I arrived at Pepin for Saturday night's game. On my mind were both life and death and a fervent hope for a specific outcome in a basketball game. Neither was in conflict, I'd argue, both in their proper perspective. Earlier that day, I had told my dad not to watch the game. When faced with serious issues, we often turn to humor to diffuse tension, so I think my specific words were, "For a cardiac patient, the worst thing to do would be to watch this game tonight."

I learned he had ignored my advice when I received a text from him that night before I had even left the gym: "So close. Hurts." And he wasn't talking about his heart. At least not his physical one.

Epilogue: My dad is fine, successful angioplasty yesterday, hospital release today. The "pain" associated with Saturday's loss will recede for all, though for some it might not entirely go away, perhaps ever, and I think that is ok. And all will move forward.

Last thought: About 15 minutes after the game's end, my 10-year-old son emerged from the Panther locker room; he's a water boy for the team. As he made his way over to me, I could see that he had been holding back tears, and as he reached my side, he began to silently cry. On the car ride home, though, the tears had been wiped away, and he began to break down next year's team.

Hell of a year. Good luck to Williams. May we all look forward to November.

Not a "grain of salt," but a "pillar of salt"?

I didn't say it didn't hurt, but the long view has to prevail; otherwise, it's unfair to these young men whose hurt is much deeper and more immediate. Perhaps it's just a semantical argument.

I'm glad you're dad is okay. watching the game may have been good therapy, despite the outcome. Exuberant sports.

We must get together for postmortems.


P'bearfan

Quote from: Bucket on March 14, 2017, 12:40:39 PM
Quote from: Old Guy on March 13, 2017, 08:17:25 PM
Quote from: P'bearfan on March 13, 2017, 07:09:10 AM
I had exactly the same sentiment when Bowdoin played Williams.  About 10 or 12 minutes into the first half they brought yet another big off the bench.  I remember asking myself "Exactly how many 6'-8" players do these guys have?!!"

Congrats on the great season.  I'm sure it ended earlier than you would have like but this was a great Midd team.

It did indeed. We thought we had a great chance to go to the Final Four. We lost. We lost to a good team that earned their win.

Today I was in the little market at the bottom of the hill below the college picking up my Globe and a cup of coffee - and a couple of friends approached me tentatively, and asked, "are you all right?" like I had lost a loved one. I wanted to say, "Screw you. What do you take me for?" I know they meant well. 

A couple of years ago, I chastised Bucket when he described a loss as "heart-breaking." Language inflation, I told him. It's a game. Reserve that language for something poignant and deeply sad, a personal tragedy. We went round and around on that. I love sports, at their best, because they evoke such powerful emotions - loyalty, intimacy, the ecstasy that comes with heated competition and exhausting physical effort. I constantly quote Al Maguire who said "the best thing in sports is winning; the second best thing in sports is losing." Living life fully, in the moment - what a gift, win or lose.

Coincidently, Coach Jeff Brown was in the store at the same time - that would be NESCAC Coach of the Year and New England Coach of the Year Jeff Brown. He wasn't wearing black, greeted everyone with a smile, and seemed not to be faking it. Hell of a year.

Middlebury won three games in the NCAA tournament, won the NESCAC Championship, finished the season 27-4, had the NESCAC Player of the Year - it goes on and on. Disappointing loss, yes, but not that hard to get over. One of the greatest seasons
ever, I think, in Midd sports history (and I'm so old now I am institutional history at Middlebury).

I fully expect Bucket to write and say, "Don't listen to Pollyanna - heartbreaking loss."

I will never say don't listen to Old Guy–it's virtually impossible, for one. He never stops talking! (For those who don't know us well, take this with a pillar of salt. There are few people on this planet I enjoy engaging in conversation with more than my dear friend.)

Naturally, I find myself admiring his point of view, but I also want to challenge parts of it, especially "not that hard to get over." Ok, in the grand scheme of things—Syria or a basketball game—yes, of course. But, allowing for perspective, this team's dream of Salem coming up a game short, on the stage and in the manner that it did, will ache for some time, especially for those closest to this goal (and I'm not talking about me or other fans, but rather the players and coaches who literally worked toward this goal every day until Saturday). I mean, 15 years hence, I still find myself thinking about games that I coached (jv high school, not exactly high stakes!) in which we lost at the buzzer, replaying possessions over and over in my head. How long will these current players and coaches be replaying Saturday night's game in their respective heads? And I think this is entirely legitimate and understandable.

Sunday morning, I sat in a corner of a high school gym in rural Vermont with one of the Panther assistant coaches; our sons play on the same youth travel hoop team. While our boys warmed up, we commiserated, grieved even. The pain was real. I wouldn't have called the feeling disappointment. (And, to be clear, I would call this grieving directional, grieving for the young men, not for ourselves.)

Digression, kind of: Appropriate place to recognize that we lost to a great team who deserved the win; Williams was terrific.   

Of course, we're adults, blessed with perspective, so I would agree with OG's assessment of Coach Brown greeting well wishers: of course he wasn't faking it. It was, indeed, a hell of a year, a lot to be happy about, but I think it's possible to be grateful for the ride while also still hurting at the same time.

Last note on heartbreak—and this is where things get interesting, at least to me.

On Saturday morning, my 83-year-old father had a heart attack. (His heart, quite literally, broke.) While my dad rested comfortably in a hospital bed hundreds of miles away, I arrived at Pepin for Saturday night's game. On my mind were both life and death and a fervent hope for a specific outcome in a basketball game. Neither was in conflict, I'd argue, both in their proper perspective. Earlier that day, I had told my dad not to watch the game. When faced with serious issues, we often turn to humor to diffuse tension, so I think my specific words were, "For a cardiac patient, the worst thing to do would be to watch this game tonight."

I learned he had ignored my advice when I received a text from him that night before I had even left the gym: "So close. Hurts." And he wasn't talking about his heart. At least not his physical one.

Epilogue: My dad is fine, successful angioplasty yesterday, hospital release today. The "pain" associated with Saturday's loss will recede for all, though for some it might not entirely go away, perhaps ever, and I think that is ok. And all will move forward.

Last thought: About 15 minutes after the game's end, my 10-year-old son emerged from the Panther locker room; he's a water boy for the team. As he made his way over to me, I could see that he had been holding back tears, and as he reached my side, he began to silently cry. On the car ride home, though, the tears had been wiped away, and he began to break down next year's team.

Hell of a year. Good luck to Williams. May we all look forward to November.

Bucket - glad to hear that your father is doing well.  Best wishes for a full and speedy recovery.

Bucket

Thanks for the kind words, all.

Amh—my parents do still reside in Lex, tho were in Charlotte visiting my sister, which was fortunate (greater access to better cardiac care). And yes, time flies. As Kevin App reminds me, on his first tour at Williams he first spied my boy, then a precocious 2 and 1/2, sporting a customized Ben Rudin jersey. I had sent a picture to my good friend Mike Maker, letting him know that Midd had an edge in the recruiting wars. The pic came back to me within minutes, photoshopped by App; the Rudin jersey had been changed to a Kevin Snyder #24, purple and gold.


nescac1

A few good links to prep for Friday:

The latest Williams basketball show, including a few highlights from the Midd win at the 16 minute mark: http://willinet.org/content/williams-college-basketball-show-31317

D3hoops frontpage story on the Ephs: http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2017/williams-different-paths

Williams game notes: http://ephsports.williams.edu/sports/mbkb/2016-17/releases/20170314to7xl2

On another note, congrats to St. Amour, McCarthy, Aronowitz and Ogundeko on being named all-district:

http://static.psbin.com/4/2/9hl42ixl6gsd3c/2017_NABC_Coaches-_Division_III_All-District_Teams_and_Coaches.pdf

augie77

Daniel Bahls, son of Augustana President Steven Bahls, is a 2004 graduate of Williams.  Dad and son have a friendly wager on this game.  ;)

Gregory Sager

Quote from: toad22 on March 14, 2017, 11:59:45 AM
The team takes off for Salem, by bus, tomorrow, quite early. My map says the distance between Williamstown and Salem is 625 miles. I'm sure the players don't care at all, but it certainly couldn't feel like the NCAA particularly cares. There were flight options, but they were so long, with so many stops, traveling in so many different groups, that they all made the bus sound pretty good. Good luck to the Ephs!

Augustana bused 800 miles from the Quad Cities to Salem two years ago; Grey Giovanine made it up to his players by finagling for them the chance to practice in historic Hinkle Fieldhouse on their way east.

I don't know if Augie is busing again, but it wouldn't surprise me.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

augie77

They are.  Left at 10:15 a.m. CDT.

AllStar

Good luck to the Ephs in the Final Four this weekend.  Always worthwhile to support fellow in-region teams.

augie77

Coach Giovanine seems well connected.  Several years ago the Vikings played at Gonzaga, and a couple of years ago played at Western Illinois (and won). Both came as a result of old coaching ties.   Coach G formerly was Head Coach at D-1 Lamar, but left on his own terms to return to his native Illinois, and to coaching at Augustana. I expect stops at Hinkle are the result of old D-1 friendships.   

augie77

I can confirm that a Hinkle workout was part of today's itinerary.

Pat Coleman

Quote from: augie77 on March 15, 2017, 09:36:21 PM
Coach Giovanine seems well connected.  Several years ago the Vikings played at Gonzaga, and a couple of years ago played at Western Illinois (and won). Both came as a result of old coaching ties.   Coach G formerly was Head Coach at D-1 Lamar, but left on his own terms to return to his native Illinois, and to coaching at Augustana. I expect stops at Hinkle are the result of old D-1 friendships.

A lot of Division III coaches have these types of connections and can arrange these sorts of things for these players. The basketball coaching community is actually really welcoming for this sort of thing -- you don't have to have coached at Division I in order to provide this type of experience.
Publisher. Questions? Check our FAQ for D3f, D3h.
Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.

nescac1

#23817
After watching a bit of their style of play and reading up on Augustana, my thoughts on keys to victory for the Ephs:

-- Auggie is similar to Williams in that they don't have tremendous quickness off the dribble.  Instead they score by pushing the ball up the court for quick scores, moving the ball quickly on offense, exploiting mismatches on the interior, and hitting open 3's.  They do a lot of high pick-and-rolls to start offensive sequences.  Like the Ephs they typically have four shooters on the floor at one time to space the floor, although they are more focused than Williams is on getting shots in the paint vs. the perimeter; they seem really committed to working the ball inside.   The defense needs to be smart and discplined and work hard to deny the entry pass or at least make those passes difficult.  You want to make them put the ball on the floor as much as possible, ideally forcing them to dribble into traffic in the middle of the court or along the baseline, where they can get into trouble and turn the ball over.  If they can beat you with contested mid-range jumpers, so be it.   I would also expect the Eph frontcourt players to jump out on a lot of those high screens to try to disrupt some of Auggie's timing on the pick and roll; the Ephs are athletic enough that they can generally recover when they do so. 

-- Individually, Chrishawn Orange is a tough cover as he is an athletic finisher in the lane and also can nail jumpers when he has a little bit of space.  A smart, efficient player who doesn't force anything.  Cole Teal and occasionally Chris Galvin will likely get the difficult assignment, which is nothing new for them, and Teal has been playing some really strong defense of late.  Sortillo can get hot from 3 and the Ephs need to make sure he is covered on the arc.  Aronowitz should cover him since he is less likely to draw a ton of fouls.  Jacob Johnson is a very effective post player and likes to take smaller guys into the paint where he can use his strength and leaping ability to shoot over them.  I'd put Scadlock on him primarily, as I think he would be a very tough match-up for him, as well as Heskett at times off the bench; Johnson has likely seen very few forwards with that combo of legth and athleticism before.   Auggie's frosh big guys are similar to the Ephs' centers in that they primarily finish off passes from other guys.  Martin (who is enormous) in particular you don't want catching the ball close to the rim with a clean look; make him put the ball on the floor and he will be in trouble.  Be sure to box out their bigs as well as they go hard on the glass.   Also watch out for Benning off the bench -- he is very talented, big, athletic and smooth, and could be an x-factor.   

-- On offense, Augustana plays a tough man-to-man, nothing that unusual, and they press occasionally as well.  Williams needs to run its sets patiently and I think they will get enough open shots to win; just a matter then of making them.  The centers are very good rim protectors and will look to help VERY aggressively, so the Eph bigs need to be ready to catch and finish whenever Williams players get into the lane, or in the alternative, to go after offensive rebounds.  While Aronowitz and in particular Scadlock will be able to finish inside, other guys have to be aware at all times of the weak-side shot blocker and are going to have to do a lot of driving and dishing; Kempton, Soto and Karpowicz should be able to have some easy finishes if they stay alert when their man helps out.  This is also a game where Karp needs to see the floor for his offensive potential -- Auggie's bigs seem more effective as help defenders and can be scored upon by a physical guy one-on-one (Hanover's center being a good example) so Karp, as our best post-up scorer, could have a strong game if given some opportunities.  But in all events, the centers need to score effectively, as they did vs. Midd, to keep the shot-blockers honest. 

Overall, should be a great game between two evenly-matched teams.   Go Ephs!!!

augie77

This is a good analysis, the best I can determine.  Just a couple of spelling corrections--Jacob Johnston with a "t", and it's "Augie".  Augsburg of Minnesota goes with the double-g.

nescac1

Thanks, good to know!